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Showing L plates with full licence

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TravisBickle
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PostPosted: 08:43 - 06 Aug 2020    Post subject: Showing L plates with full licence Reply with quote

My bike is in the garage so I'm having to borrow my wife's 125 with L plates on to get to work and back.

One of my colleagues has just told me it's illegal to ride with L plates while holding a full licence and it carries a 3 point penalty if prosecuted.

I've just checked the government website. It says it's a 6 point penalty for riding without L plates if you're a learner, but all it says about riding with a full licence is that the plates should be removed. No mention of endorsements or a fine.

Anyone know definitively if it's possible to be fined or endorsed?
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arry
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PostPosted: 08:53 - 06 Aug 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/l-plate-size-rules/l-plate-sizes

Remember what the Highway Code says about MUST and SHOULD

Quote:
1. When to display L plates
Any vehicle driven by a learner must display red L plates. In Wales you can use either red D plates, red L plates, or both.

The L plates must be clearly visible to others from:

in front of the vehicle
behind the vehicle
You should remove or cover L plates when the vehicle isn’t being driven by a learner, unless it’s a driving school car.


For reference there is nothing in the Highway Code about the use of a vehicle with L plates attached by a full licence holder. Nothing at all.
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c_dug
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PostPosted: 09:46 - 06 Aug 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

Legal or not to ride with them displayed, I'd probably stick a bit of gaffa/electrical tape diagonally across the plate.

Don't know why, that's just what I'd do.
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 09:56 - 06 Aug 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

As arry says, 'must' or 'shall' is an instruction that has to be followed, 'should' is advisory as far as the law is concerned.
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 11:28 - 06 Aug 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

If there's a black stripe across it, it's not -legally speaking-, an L-plate.

It's what we used to do with our car when I was learning.
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TravisBickle
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PostPosted: 15:43 - 06 Aug 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the advice guys seems to be as I suspected that my colleague was talking bollocks. Normally I'd have dismissed the comment as BS but I remember seeing a YouTube video of a guy test riding and reviewing a Bandit they just bought for their riding school and at the start of the video he made a point of saying "it's ok that I'm taking this bike out on L plates because it's a riding school bike and I'm an instructor" so that did kinda make me wonder if it was illegal to ride on L plates with a full licence but certainly didn't think it would be an endorsable offence. Never occured to me before seeing that video that it might be an offence, I mean you see cars with L plates on all the time that are CLEARLY not being driven by a learner and it's the mum or dad just haven't bothered taking the plates off between teaching their child. But having said that, just because you see something frequently doesn't necessarily mean it's legal, just seems a silly thing to be illegal to me :-/

Guy at work was trying to argue that riding on L plates with a full licence is as bad as a learner riding without L plates. I was having none of it but he was insistent.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQIirXAcQ6Y

c_dug wrote:
Legal or not to ride with them displayed, I'd probably stick a bit of gaffa/electrical tape diagonally across the plate.

Don't know why, that's just what I'd do.


That's what the bloke at work suggested but:

1) can't be arsed, too much agro, only using it for a few days until I get my bike back and I'm not so much of a 'full licence snob' that I couldn't bare other road users to mistakenly think I don't have a full licence, I have to say though taking my wife's 12hp 125 to work generated more interest among my colleagues than it normally does when I bring the 150hp Fazer in, everyone was commenting on it and asking where my bigger bike was and have I changed bikes, I think because it's a cruiser style bike and looks like it should be a bigger displacement than it is so looks funny on L plates as I don't think people are used to seeing that style of bike on L plates

2) looks tacky

3) when I remove it it's going to leave nasty tacky residue that I'll have to clean off, which brings me back to my first point
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stablepeach
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PostPosted: 15:54 - 06 Aug 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

You ever driven with L plates on?

My mate did when his missus was learning and he reported that he got way more agro and arseholes than when he didn't have the plates even though he thought he was driving the same.
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TravisBickle
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PostPosted: 15:55 - 06 Aug 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

If anything I think that riding a 125 on the road without L plates would cause more anger and frustration from other motorists because from the speed and accelleration of the bike you can clearly tell it's a 125 and it's generally assumed that all 125 riders are on a provisional so they think it's just some little cunt bombing about on a 125 who can't be arsed with his L plates probably hasn't got insurance, tax or MOT either.

Got to be honest, that's what goes through my mind when I see a 125 without L plates on.
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TravisBickle
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PostPosted: 15:57 - 06 Aug 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

stablepeach wrote:
You ever driven with L plates on?

My mate did when his missus was learning and he reported that he got way more agro and arseholes than when he didn't have the plates even though he thought he was driving the same.


That's interesting because his view appears to be the opposite of mine above. But yeah I guess the same could be true. They see the L plate and assume it's a little cunt who has been renewing his CBT every 2 years for the last 10 years just bombing around irresponsibly etc.

Interesting different view points...

To answer your question yes I did ride with L plates before I got my licence but never got any real agro. But then I don't live in London or a built-up city so...
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TravisBickle
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PostPosted: 15:59 - 06 Aug 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hang on, just realised you said DRIVE and not RIDE.

No, I only ever DROVE with L plates on in my instructors car when I was learning. Passed my car test and went straight into my own car without L plates or P plates.
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A100man
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PostPosted: 16:12 - 06 Aug 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tuberculosis wrote:
If anything I think that riding a 125 on the road without L plates would cause more anger and frustration from other motorists because from the speed and accelleration of the bike you can clearly tell it's a 125 and it's generally assumed that all 125 riders are on a provisional so they think it's just some little cunt bombing about on a 125 who can't be arsed with his L plates probably hasn't got insurance, tax or MOT either.


A few years back on the A100 I was tail-gated by some youths in car who clearly figured I was a fellow feckless yobbo and were jeering a slinging Vs at me. I ignored it until I came to my turn off and as they undertook were leaning out of the window jeering
and generally 'laughing at my mule'.

It made me cross and I gave chase drawing alongside and making to kick the car - I may even have done so. Clearly panicked they tried toclear off up a side road - I followed them some more until I had them 'cornered', the mists down I banged on the side windows and I had 'mad' in my eyes shouting an hollering . they locked the (two) doors and stayed put.

It was fortunate it was only a two door as the to biggest were in the back seat. Shaking slightly I threw a few more Fs at them and went on my way.

I hope that they saw the error of their ways.. I think i probably did.
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TravisBickle
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PostPosted: 17:00 - 06 Aug 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

A100man wrote:
A few years back on the A100 I was tail-gated by some youths in car who clearly figured I was a fellow feckless yobbo and were jeering a slinging Vs at me. I ignored it until I came to my turn off and as they undertook were leaning out of the window jeering
and generally 'laughing at my mule'.

It made me cross and I gave chase drawing alongside and making to kick the car - I may even have done so. Clearly panicked they tried toclear off up a side road - I followed them some more until I had them 'cornered', the mists down I banged on the side windows and I had 'mad' in my eyes shouting an hollering . they locked the (two) doors and stayed put.

It was fortunate it was only a two door as the to biggest were in the back seat. Shaking slightly I threw a few more Fs at them and went on my way.

I hope that they saw the error of their ways.. I think i probably did.


I had similar once but was on my FZS600. Some twat in an X6 cut me up on a roundabout. I didn't react over-aggressively but raised my left palm in the air in exasperation. He then decided to brake check me which nearly resulted in the car behind me rear-ending me. I pulled up beside his driver window at the next set of traffic lights to have a polite word (and it would have been polite! I try not to engage in road rage) but when I raised the front of my helmet to talk to him and he saw it wasn't some spotty little oik he dramatically mounted the curb and drove around the traffic to escape me, as if I was wielding a gun or a knife or something! Big hard man in his cage huh?
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 17:04 - 06 Aug 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tuberculosis wrote:


That's interesting because his view appears to be the opposite of mine above. But yeah I guess the same could be true. They see the L plate and assume it's a little cunt who has been renewing his CBT every 2 years for the last 10 years just bombing around irresponsibly etc.


I doubt most car drivers even know what CBT is.
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TravisBickle
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PostPosted: 17:16 - 06 Aug 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

chickenstrip wrote:
I doubt most car drivers even know what CBT is.


Maybe the terminology but I think most realise that you have to do some sort of training course or refreshment every so often in order to keep riding round on L plates, and also that they don't have a 'proper' licence.
Don't you think? I'm pretty sure even I knew that and I came from a completely non-biking background. None of my family or friends were bikers or had mopeds back then.
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Freddyfruitba...
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PostPosted: 17:17 - 06 Aug 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

chickenstrip wrote:
I doubt most car drivers even know what CBT is.

As it happens I was talking to my (car-driving doctor) daughter last night and mentioned my son doing his CBT. We had a few moments of very bizarre conversation before she said "...but why is he having Cognitive Behavioural Therapy?"
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P.
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PostPosted: 17:25 - 06 Aug 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

I carried pillion whilst having L plates clearly displayed on a moped, got pulled, because why wouldn't I, but they were fully aware that I could have them displayed.
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 17:31 - 06 Aug 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

Driving instructors don't take them off between pupils so why should anyone else give any fucks?
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1198
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PostPosted: 20:12 - 06 Aug 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

My driving instructor insisted he drove me back from my car test after my successful test as he said he was allowed to drive the car with L plates on and I wasn’t. Fair enough. What we could have done was simply remove the things and me drive - it was my bloody car after all!
Gave my parents the wrong idea when we showed up back at home with the L plates on and instructor driving...
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 20:15 - 06 Aug 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

chickenstrip wrote:
Tuberculosis wrote:


That's interesting because his view appears to be the opposite of mine above. But yeah I guess the same could be true. They see the L plate and assume it's a little cunt who has been renewing his CBT every 2 years for the last 10 years just bombing around irresponsibly etc.


I doubt most car drivers even know what CBT is.


Cock and ball torture?
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TravisBickle
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PostPosted: 20:18 - 06 Aug 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

1198 wrote:
My driving instructor insisted he drove me back from my car test after my successful test


That's pretty standard but I understood this was because learner insurance doesn't cover you once you've passed.
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smokin joe
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PostPosted: 20:41 - 06 Aug 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tuberculosis wrote:
1198 wrote:
My driving instructor insisted he drove me back from my car test after my successful test


That's pretty standard but I understood this was because learner insurance doesn't cover you once you've passed.

It does, but the poor old ADI has had enough of sitting beside you and having to concentrate by then and wants a relaxing drive before his or her next lesson.
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davebike
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PostPosted: 07:34 - 07 Aug 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

AS said Driving / riding professional instructors are sort of OK with L plates up as are Mechanics but most put tape across the L plates
I been spoken to when I forgot !
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Freddyfruitba...
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PostPosted: 09:59 - 07 Aug 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

smokin joe wrote:
Tuberculosis wrote:
learner insurance doesn't cover you once you've passed.

It does

Does it really though? The fact that you have to tell the insurers as soon as you've passed, whereupon they instantly increase the premium, would suggest not (that said, I imagine if they tried wriggling out of a claim after an accident on the way back from a successful driving test, the ombudsman or whatever would pronounce it unreasonable...)
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arry
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PostPosted: 10:58 - 07 Aug 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

Freddyfruitbat wrote:
Does it really though?


Of course it does. How would a driving instructor give Pass Plus lessons if it no longer covered people that had passed their test?

Freddyfruitbat wrote:
The fact that you have to tell the insurers as soon as you've passed, whereupon they instantly increase the premium, would suggest not (that said, I imagine if they tried wriggling out of a claim after an accident on the way back from a successful driving test, the ombudsman or whatever would pronounce it unreasonable...)


Driving Instructor policies aren't 'normal' motor policies - they're very broadly written and covers effectively any driver under tuition, plus any driver over 25 for any use ordinarily. It's essentially a mini-fleet policy in the breadth of its cover.

As for the FOS finding it unreasonable - unlikely; duty of ongoing disclosure is clear and regardless of what you might think of the mechanics of it, I know for bloody well sure I was a lot more lairy in my first drive out after passing my test than I was the day before I passed my test with my instructor sat beside me. And I got even more lairy when my mates came out with me for the first time. The risk is hugely different - clearly it is - and that's why the need for disclosure.
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Chutzpah
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PostPosted: 11:23 - 07 Aug 2020    Post subject: Reply with quote

smokin joe wrote:
It does, but the poor old ADI has had enough of sitting beside you and having to concentrate by then and wants a relaxing drive before his or her next lesson.


Mine told me it's because you're giddy with happiness and it's better they drive, but I can believe this argument
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