CG125ES4 (2005) Clutch Problems (Pushrod?)

osholt · L Plate Warrior Joined: 17 Dec 2020 Karma :

Hi all,

I cam across this old thread and I thought my problem might be similar: https://www.bike-parts-honda.com/honda-motorcycle/125-MOTO/CG/2004/CG125ES4/Engine/CLUTCH/17KGA401/E__0600/1/3570

I am having problems actuating my clutch after taking the engine apart and reassembling. The clutch lever has very little resistance and is not actuating the clutch no matter where I adjust it to. The clutch worked perfectly before I disassembled it so I do not believe it is the cable or lever.

I have been following the Haynes manual instructions but they make no mention of the different push road arrangement in Brazialian bikes.

I have the pushrod style shown in this parts diagram (part 9): https://www.bike-parts-honda.com/honda-motorcycle/125-MOTO/CG/2004/CG125ES4/Engine/CLUTCH/17KGA401/E__0600/1/3570

I am confused how this is supposed to be installed to actuate the clutch. Is the shaft part of the pushrod supposed to be recessed into the mechanism in the right crank case cover and the flat disc pushing directly on the ball bearing inner race? This seems wrong but I can't really see how else it would go together unless I am missing another part. Based on the parts diagrams this does not appear to be the case. If the part is spun round as in the diagram (facing the other way with the shaft going through the bearing loosely), I cannot see how it would engages with the mechanism in the right cover.

Are the screws compressing the clutch springs supposed to be done up all the way? It seems when they are there is not enough travel on the pushrod when it is engages with the cover mechanism to push against the bearing.

The clutch lifter plate (8 in the diagram) does appear to be recessed further into the clutch centre than the Haynes manual shows when all the screws are done up.

Any suggestions? Am I missing a part or have I just installed it wrong?

If anyone has any better instructions or pictures that would also be great.

Thanks,

Oliver

stinkwheel · Bovine Proctologist Joined: 12 Jul 2004 Karma :

https://youtu.be/zFC29CjcwIs
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osholt · L Plate Warrior Joined: 17 Dec 2020 Karma :

bikenut · World Chat Champion Joined: 21 Nov 2011 Karma :

U sure you assembled the Clutch properly? Notice the one different clutch plate and where it goes. The mushroom part 9 goes into the clutch outer cover and engaged with the flat on the end of that covers clutch arm. You have a new gasket etc...centrifugal oil filter will check exploded views...yes it has a centrifugal oil filter. The mushroom part 9 is shown incorrectly in the diagram me thinks....
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stinkwheel · Bovine Proctologist Joined: 12 Jul 2004 Karma :

Have you remembered to fit the splined washer (part 12)?
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“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.”
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.

bikenut · World Chat Champion Joined: 21 Nov 2011 Karma :

Can you post a pic of the clutch outer cover out, and inside view?
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osholt · L Plate Warrior Joined: 17 Dec 2020 Karma :

Sorry for the delay in replying. I was busy with other things over Christmas. Here are the requested pictures of the clutch assembly and inside right engine cover.

https://imgur.com/a/9Sai9q9

No matter how much or little I do the bolts up that compress the clutch springs, the clutch lever does not seem to push against the springs even when adjusted all the way out. The clutch is always locked up.

Here are the assembly drawings for the clutch and the assembly mechanism:

https://www.bike-parts-honda.com/honda-motorcycle/125-MOTO/CG/2005/CG125ES4/Engine/CLUTCH/17KGA401/E__0600/1/3573

https://www.bike-parts-honda.com/honda-motorcycle/125-MOTO/CG/2005/CG125ES4/Engine/RIGHT-CRANKCASE-COVER/17KGA401/E__0500/1/3573

I presume the bolts compressing the springs must have to be done all the way up? And that I am not a piece of the pusher assembly?

The only thing I can think of is I have put something like the splined washer in the wrong place during assembly.

Any ideas?

oilyrag · Nova Slayer Joined: 07 Oct 2020 Karma :

Take it apart and go through it again. Did you replace parts? Try putting the original parts back in and see if it works.

osholt · L Plate Warrior Joined: 17 Dec 2020 Karma :

bikenut · World Chat Champion Joined: 21 Nov 2011 Karma :

If you look at your pictures, of the clutch basket, you will see what you have done wrong😀

Let's hope u ain't broken/bent anything.
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osholt · L Plate Warrior Joined: 17 Dec 2020 Karma :

bikenut · World Chat Champion Joined: 21 Nov 2011 Karma :

Use your eyes, preferably stone cold
sober ones.

Just look at the pictures you have posted, of the clutch drum/basket.

Do you like fish fingers, fish don't have fingers....just have a good look.

Anything odd!

Quiet surprised no one else, or you spotted it.

Remember, looking at the pics, you can see what I see.....only my eyes are old.
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bikenut · World Chat Champion Joined: 21 Nov 2011 Karma :

Spotted the mistake yet?

Anyone ?

By the way did you take the engine out and completely strip it?, Or just take off the clutch cover off and strip the clutch?

How did you get on with the centrifugal oil filter "nut"?

Also, the "mushroom" push rod thingy, that fits into the clutch cover, and "moved" by the clutch cover clutch arm, is it engaged with the "flat" or "cam" bit of the clutch cover clutch arm properly?

The mushroom should move towards the clutch drum when the clutch arm is moved forwards.

The exploded views are different from on your bike. I take it the mushroom is a good wobble free sliding fit in its hole in the clutch cover?
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osholt · L Plate Warrior Joined: 17 Dec 2020 Karma :

bikenut · World Chat Champion Joined: 21 Nov 2011 Karma :

Part 7, the o ring? No.

Part7, the alloy "pressure plate" let's call it, the bit with the 4 threaded towers that the 4 spring bolts go into, no.

Go and have a look at your pictures of the clutch drum/basket.

Look logically.

Do fish have fingers ? No.

What have fingers to do with a clutch ffs. May be "tangs" would be a better word.

Tangs are on files ffs, not clutches, arnt they?

Times crossword puzzle, criptic as hell and take me all day to do...

Have a good look at the clutch drum/basket, which is on the engine as seen in your pics?

See anything odd? Different somehow, wrong, not in the right place, compared to the others....there are enough of them....

It's better for you to see the mistake yourself, do you learn more so you don't make the same mistake again, rather than be told.

Just have a good look.
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Robby · Dirty Old Man Joined: 16 May 2002 Karma :

The top clutch plate is out of line with the others, which is what bikenut was getting at.

Also the mushroom thing should not be sitting proud. Push back the operating arm on the outside of the crankcase cover (as if you were operating the clutch normally) and push the mushroom down into position.

bikenut · World Chat Champion Joined: 21 Nov 2011 Karma :

Oh well done, what are this week's lottery numbers?

If he got this bit wrong, and stripped the engine, this thread is Gunnar break a lot of records for even on here!
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osholt · L Plate Warrior Joined: 17 Dec 2020 Karma :

bikenut · World Chat Champion Joined: 21 Nov 2011 Karma :

Each clutch friction plate, the plates with many fingers on its periphery, fit do the fingers fit in the clutch drum/basket parralel sided slots, not as seen by one plate, the outer one, in your picture.

You do realise that one friction plate is different to the others, yes.

It's different as it fits over the "damper sprung loaded plate" "securing ring". See the parts diagram, part 4 and 5.

Since the clutch worked ok before you took it apart, look for tell tale witness marks in the clutch drum/basket slots?

Since you completely stripped this engine, I hope you Put back all the gearbox shims etc in the right place?

If not them expect broken gears/burst c/case etc..

You have checked gear selection by hand and g/box input and output shaft end float I hope....
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Robby · Dirty Old Man Joined: 16 May 2002 Karma :

Under the mushroom is a round rod with a slot cut into it, which the mushroom sits in to. When the rod rotates it pushes the mushroom out, which pushes on the centre of the clutch, and allows it to release.

The problem is that when the take the mushroom out, the shaft over-rotates. Then the mushroom doesn't go back into its slot, it just sits on top of the shaft, giving a similar effect to always having the clutch lever pulled in.

From the diagram and your pictures it looks like part 9 is missing. This would a different mushroom that slots into the middle of the centre bearing.