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Im-a-Ridah
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PostPosted: 14:22 - 31 Jan 2021    Post subject: Vaccine passports Reply with quote

Vaccine passports could end up being the latest example of the selfishness of the baby boomer. Through 2020 younger people were asked to sacrifice having a quality time, basically to just stay at home and avoid socialising to keep older people from dying. It would be incredibly selfish and unfair for those older people in the higher risk groups over 50, newly vaccinated to jet off to Spain or go to the Pub while those who sacrificed so much so save their lives are denied the same opportunities. But this is very much the attitude of many boomers, but hopefully a minority.
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 14:28 - 31 Jan 2021    Post subject: Re: Vaccine passports Reply with quote

Im-a-Ridah wrote:
Through 2020 younger people were asked to sacrifice having a quality time, basically to just stay at home and avoid socialising to keep older people from dying.


And still they died. So that was a bit of failure, wasn't it? Are we really trying to protect old people from death? Seems a bit futile to me, given that we haven't yet discovered the key to immortality. Still, perhaps some people feel if they don't encounter death around them through their lives, they can believe they'll live forever.

Personally, I think it is useful to consider your own mortality every now and again, provides a little perspective on life.
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 14:35 - 31 Jan 2021    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually all baby boomers would need to be minimum 70 years old now.
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Im-a-Ridah
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PostPosted: 14:37 - 31 Jan 2021    Post subject: Re: Vaccine passports Reply with quote

Nobody ever said nobody wouldn't die, that would be an obvious untruth. Without the lockdowns the trend lines clearly show that the deaths would have been massively higher during the spring, auitumn and winter peirods than they actually were. By your logic of live fast die young we should encourage people to get high and drunk and drive as fast as possible because "they will die anyway" :lol:
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 14:38 - 31 Jan 2021    Post subject: Re: Vaccine passports Reply with quote

Im-a-Ridah wrote:
By your logic of live fast die young we should encourage people to get high and drunk and drive as fast as possible because "they will die anyway" Laughing


Now you're getting the idea! Very Happy Laughing

A couple of things spring to mind. One is that the average age of death from covid is very close to the average age of death.

Two is that considering your own mortality does indeed help you to make some life choices, which in my case has definitely led to a more enjoyable life overall. It doesn't need you to take things to extremes - just an encouragement to get out and enjoy life rather than sit cocooned at home, afraid of everything.
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Last edited by chickenstrip on 14:42 - 31 Jan 2021; edited 1 time in total
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Im-a-Ridah
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PostPosted: 14:41 - 31 Jan 2021    Post subject: Re: Vaccine passports Reply with quote

Well it would certainly clean the gene pool of stupid people :wink:
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 14:45 - 31 Jan 2021    Post subject: Re: Vaccine passports Reply with quote

Im-a-Ridah wrote:
Well it would certainly clean the gene pool of stupid people Wink


No one is suggesting you taking unnecessary risks when there is a definite danger to face. I'm not talking just about the current pandemic, but I do wonder if people will be afraid to live their lives even after it has gone away (to the extent that any infectious disease goes away). That would be a great shame. Infectious diseases and many other risks are a fact of life.

It's also a case of how much of the risk you take in life should be your choice, or chosen for you by government.
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The Shaggy D.A.
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PostPosted: 16:36 - 31 Jan 2021    Post subject: Re: Vaccine passports Reply with quote

chickenstrip wrote:
I'm not talking just about the current pandemic, but I do wonder if people will be afraid to live their lives even after it has gone away (to the extent that any infectious disease goes away). That would be a great shame. Infectious diseases and many other risks are a fact of life.


I'm hoping that the main takeaway from this will be a better attitude to viruses in general. It pisses me off when the martyr drags themselves in to work whilst sick, so you just know that it's going to around the office and every fucker is going to get it and do the same.

"It's just a cold/cough, I'm alright"

Fuck off. You can work from home, we've just spent the last year doing it. Be more Asian - wear a fucking mask if you're sick.

Hopefully it'll be more socially unacceptable to be sick at work, and businesses will be more proactive in making sure people can stay at home when sick.
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martin734
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PostPosted: 16:52 - 31 Jan 2021    Post subject: Re: Vaccine passports Reply with quote

Im-a-Ridah wrote:
Vaccine passports could end up being the latest example of the selfishness of the baby boomer. Through 2020 younger people were asked to sacrifice having a quality time, basically to just stay at home and avoid socialising to keep older people from dying. It would be incredibly selfish and unfair for those older people in the higher risk groups over 50, newly vaccinated to jet off to Spain or go to the Pub while those who sacrificed so much so save their lives are denied the same opportunities. But this is very much the attitude of many boomers, but hopefully a minority.
Although right now, thanks to lockdown, and businesses closing, retired people are pretty much the only people that can afford to go on holiday. Tens of thousands of people have lost their jobs, livelihoods and even homes. Hundreds of small businesses have collapsed, many permanently and the tax payer will be paying for this for years to come. This is to try and protect the older members of our population, who, with their triple-lock pensions and mortgage free homes can actually afford to stay at home. As Chickenstrip said, the average age of someone who dies from Covid is almost the same as the normal average life expectancy. Lockdown after lockdown isn't working, the elderly are still dying and yet the whole of the country is having to suffer because of it.
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Riejufixing
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PostPosted: 17:01 - 31 Jan 2021    Post subject: Re: Vaccine passports Reply with quote

martin734 wrote:
Lockdown after lockdown isn't working

That's because of fucking twats.

https://www.google.com/search?q=party+fined&source=lnt&tbs=qdr:d&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiArYqxxcbuAhVJUMAKHTWXArUQpwV6BAgEECE&biw=1536&bih=722

Etc, etc.
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Riejufixing
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PostPosted: 17:06 - 31 Jan 2021    Post subject: Re: Vaccine passports Reply with quote

Im-a-Ridah wrote:
Vaccine passports could end up being the latest example of the selfishness of the baby boomer. Through 2020 younger people were asked to sacrifice having a quality time, basically to just stay at home and avoid socialising to keep older people from dying. It would be incredibly selfish and unfair for those older people in the higher risk groups over 50, newly vaccinated to jet off to Spain or go to the Pub while those who sacrificed so much so save their lives are denied the same opportunities. But this is very much the attitude of many boomers, but hopefully a minority.

Let's hope they don't leave their selfish grandschildren any money or property , then. A pity too that these people who moan were unselfishly looked after as children, eh.
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 17:11 - 31 Jan 2021    Post subject: Reply with quote

But we don't know how many people the virus itself has killed, because of the daft way deaths are totalled up. Have you noticed that nobody has died of flu lately? Why on Earth would they include flu deaths in the covid total?

Anyone who dies "within 28 days of being tested positive." What kind of ridiculous way to categorise is that?
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Riejufixing
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PostPosted: 17:28 - 31 Jan 2021    Post subject: Reply with quote

chickenstrip wrote:
Have you noticed that nobody has died of flu lately?

Of course they have. The number of 'flu infections and deaths has dropped enormously though, because of the anti-virus rules.
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Kawasaki Jimbo
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PostPosted: 18:05 - 31 Jan 2021    Post subject: Reply with quote

Flu vaccination take was up in 2020, and school year 7 (11-12 year old super-spreaders) were vaccinated for the first time too.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/flu-vaccine-uptake-among-people-aged-65-on-track-to-be-highest-on-record
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The Shaggy D.A.
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PostPosted: 18:11 - 31 Jan 2021    Post subject: Reply with quote

chickenstrip wrote:
But we don't know how many people the virus itself has killed, because of the daft way deaths are totalled up.


No, but you can have a bloody good guess based on a "usual" number of deaths against what is currently happening.

https://fingertips.phe.org.uk/static-reports/mortality-surveillance/excess-mortality-in-england-latest.html
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Riejufixing
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PostPosted: 18:30 - 31 Jan 2021    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kawasaki Jimbo wrote:
Flu vaccination take was up in 2020, and school year 7 (11-12 year old super-spreaders) were vaccinated for the first time too.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/flu-vaccine-uptake-among-people-aged-65-on-track-to-be-highest-on-record

Yes:

"Three-quarters (75%) of those aged 65 and over in England received the free vaccine so far this year – up from 72.4% at the end of the last flu season"

2.6% more. Hurrah.

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/deathsduetocoronaviruscovid19comparedwithdeathsfrominfluenzaandpneumoniaenglandandwales/deathsoccurringbetween1januaryand31august2020

Still, since chickenstrip doesn't believe people die of COVID-19, then I assume they don't die of anything other disease including the 'flu. What an expert couple you make!

Still, there are other threads for coronavirus. This one's for selfish whinging about things, as in the OP: Q.E.D.
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Kawasaki Jimbo
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PostPosted: 18:40 - 31 Jan 2021    Post subject: Reply with quote

Riejufixing wrote:
Kawasaki Jimbo wrote:
Flu vaccination take was up in 2020, and school year 7 (11-12 year old super-spreaders) were vaccinated for the first time too.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/flu-vaccine-uptake-among-people-aged-65-on-track-to-be-highest-on-record

Yes:

"Three-quarters (75%) of those aged 65 and over in England received the free vaccine so far this year – up from 72.4% at the end of the last flu season"

2.6% more. Hurrah.

Read beyond the headline. 65+ are obviously keen on the vaccine but,
Quote:
Flu vaccine uptake is higher in all groups except pregnant women compared to this time last year.
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MCN
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PostPosted: 18:59 - 31 Jan 2021    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not sure if discussed here or other thread etc.
If the current lock-down doesnt curb the trend in infection rates what's the next move going to be?

Should we then Euthanize those most at risk before they test positive in order to prevent the disease spreading from vulnerable to vulnerable whilst gaining the ability to infect and harm the less vulnerable. Shocked

I think the term is Cull.
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Easy-X
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PostPosted: 19:07 - 31 Jan 2021    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm thinking that what Covid-19 exposes is a lack of redundancy in various systems: the NHS may have been running very efficiently pre-2020 but throw it a curveball and it'll fall over with the first gust of wind*

Also highlighted is what we think of as "essential." Food & Booze - essential, not clogging up the NHS - essential, sacrificing the young for the old - essential. Not essential: hairdressers, tattoo artists, hotels, restaurants, pubs, holidays abroad.... mental health, cancer treatments err... social unity being the least essential thing apparently Sad

*Wow, how many metaphors can we mix!
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 19:08 - 31 Jan 2021    Post subject: Reply with quote

Riejufixing wrote:

Still, since chickenstrip doesn't believe people die of COVID-19


Silly boy! I've never said that. I just question whether the government has done much to protect anyone. I would suggest that most people have done what they can to protect themselves thus far. I know you agree with whatever the Tory Party says, whatever their current line happens to be, but some of us don't have that much trust in them, or any other bunch of politicians for that matter, and with good reason.
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Kawasaki Jimbo
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PostPosted: 19:13 - 31 Jan 2021    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote=“chickenstrip”]I just question whether the government has done much to protect anyone. I would suggest that most people have done what they can to protect themselves thus far.[/quote]

By following government advice.

(Is it my new iPad or am I doing something wrong wrt quotes lately?)
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 19:34 - 31 Jan 2021    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kawasaki Jimbo wrote:
chickenstrip wrote:
I just question whether the government has done much to protect anyone. I would suggest that most people have done what they can to protect themselves thus far.


By following government advice.


Do you think everything the government has done through this pandemic has been effective in reducing the problem?
I just don't think that draconian lockdowns are the way to go. Nor does the WHO for that matter. I think we could get a good segment of the economy working again with care and the proper precautions, mostly protecting those in known vulnerable categories.
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 19:36 - 31 Jan 2021    Post subject: Reply with quote

Btw Jimbo, when I quoted you quoting me, it didn't work properly, but I noticed your quote marks looked a bit different. Changed them out and it worked fine. So something to do with that.
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Riejufixing
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PostPosted: 19:43 - 31 Jan 2021    Post subject: Reply with quote

chickenstrip wrote:
I just don't think that draconian lockdowns are the way to go.


Ah, so. China had a wokdown that was certainly the way to go. It fixed their problem. Here? Loads of thick stupid fuckers didn't take any notice, leading to reduction in efficiacy.

chickenstrip wrote:
Nor does the WHO for that matter.

No? Where do they say "lockdowns are no use"?

chickenstrip wrote:
I think we could get a good segment of the economy working again with care and the proper precautions, mostly protecting those in known vulnerable categories.

Ah, so. China economy. https://www.ft.com/content/ac22618a-4bab-4905-af81-a031a54e9617
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Riejufixing
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PostPosted: 19:47 - 31 Jan 2021    Post subject: Reply with quote

chickenstrip wrote:
Riejufixing wrote:

Still, since chickenstrip doesn't believe people die of COVID-19

Silly boy! I've never said that.


chickenstrip wrote:
But we don't know how many people the virus itself has killed, because of the daft way deaths are totalled up. Have you noticed that nobody has died of flu lately? Why on Earth would they include flu deaths in the covid total?

Anyone who dies "within 28 days of being tested positive." What kind of ridiculous way to categorise is that?

Why is the "way deaths are totalled up" daft, or "within 28 days of being tested positive" ridiculous? I'd love to know why you think that, and also why you think 'flu deaths are included in the COVID-19 total.
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