Am I at fault?

[Mr tiddles]

Driving down a 30 by some lights and a Junction with traffic a BMW overtook and cut me up. I avoided any issues but I let out an exasperated 'f u'. at no one in particular, more out of frustration.

I turned into a small car park for a block of flats to calm down and get my breath, this car driver followed me and parked at the entrance. I went to drive away but he jumped in front and grabbed the bike.

He then started shouting out and point out he had a child in the car for some reasons. He then proceeded to hit me twice in the head. I did not react or try to defend myself because I was on the bike and the engine was running with it in first gear and I did not want it to fall or go into him if I let go of the clutch.

After forcing me to apologise to him and the kid for some reason he let me go.

I did note the guys reg and flag down a police officer to report the assault but he just told me to go to the station...which is closed. So of course it has not been reported.

Am I in the wrong here? The F U was not aimed at him, is there even any point in reporting since he can just say I am the big bad road rage man and he was 'protecting' his kid. Would I be the one in trouble?

[xX-Alex-Xx]

Shouldn’t have mattered if you directly called him a paedo cvnt… getting out directly assault you is all on him. Some people are just dicks who can’t ever hold up their hand and admit they made a mistake and move on. Gotta pin it on the other person. BMW drivers tend to have a reputation for self proclaiming infallibility.
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DILLIGAF

[trevor saxe-coburg-gotha]

Did you say fvck you into your lid or gesture w/ hand? I'm assuming the latter. Are you at fault? Not really - it's just that these encounters can soon escalate and the proverbial red mist quickly descends.

It's just a matter of reflecting on it - make your progress (e.g. filtering) unobtrusive wherever possible, offer many more thank-yous than you might in a car, give a low-key wave to diffuse any such tensions getting inflamed. Hot weather, holiday traffic queues, people gridlocked with the sun beating down - shit soon kicks off. I've got a mate in hospital with various fractures atm because a woman suddenly decided to peel out of a line of traffic and u-turn. No observation, no mirrors, shoulder check - nowt. Presumably just got hot and bothered in a queue, thought to herself hang on why am I enduring this crawling pace when there's a rat run I know, quarter of a mile back. Fvcking bam, guy filtering down the edge is toast. Not sure how fast he was going but suspect it wasn't much over 25 mph.

Be careful of this situation - if possible, give brief peeps of the horn as you filter down - it's not likely to be taken as a rebuke, just warning of your presence.

Your guy sounds like a sociopathic arsewit - there's no reasoning with them. I think your lack of retaliation was probably the right thing, for various reasons. Not overly shocked plod couldn't be arsed, mind you.
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"Life is a sexually transmitted disease and the mortality rate is one hundred percent."

Mobylette Type 50 ---> Raleigh Grifter ---> Neval Minsk 125

[The Shaggy D.A.]

[stinkwheel]

Of course it's worth reporting, he just assaulted you. He had no need to get out of the car, the courts take a very dim view of that kind of thing. The fact he followed you into the carpark means it was premeditated.

I know a guy who drives a wagon who had a really near miss with a car driver (like jack-knifed the trailer close) and admittedly less than politely sounded his air horns before enquiring if the car driver had obtained his licence in a cornflakes packet (or words to that effect, perhaops less polite). Next news car driver is out of the car shouting the odds. Wagon driver got out and blocked him one. Wagon driver got 120 hours community service, a P45 and a criminal record. Car driver got a compo payout. The judges exact words were "You had no need to get out of your cab in this situation".

The trouble will be proving it but most carparks have CCTV these days. Get a subject access request in.

Anyway, sounds like the behaviour of someone up to the back of his eyeballs on Colombian marching powder. At least a 50:50 chance if he's a shouty BMW driver. You should mention his behaviour seemed erratic as if he was on something when you talk to the police. You are obviously deeply concerned about his behaviour because he's driving a car with a minor in the back who he may be putting at risk. Then even if they don't check the CCTV and arrest him for assault, they might put a marker on his car to stop and drug wipe him next time he pings an ANPR. Nothing a traffic copper likes better than tasty low-hanging fruit and a drug driver = an extra chocolate biscuit with his tea.
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“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.”
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.

[Bhud]

I don't ride at all without an action camera these days.

People are fully aware of the he-said-she-said thing, and will twist things and lie to suit their situation.

An action camera is for legal purposes. It makes you look like a d!ck and you get fewer nods, but it's sort of like insurance.

The problem you've got in this situation is, he may make you out to be the aggressor. And, since he had a child in the car, that's an aggravating factor. A second aggravating factor, i.e. assault aggravated by road rage, and aggravated by the fact it happened in front of a minor. A sobbing kid is not a good look. Therefore, if he complained and it went against you, a serious criminal outcome is on the cards, i.e. prison. There are hidden factors, such as, for example, the social power of having a child in the car, or the type of car he was driving, or the fact you were riding a bike, that may lead you to run into problems being believed by magistrates or by a crown court jury. The police are there to prosecute crime. You may think there are all these CCTV cameras everywhere, but you'll be amazed how all the footage disappears or how they weren't working, when the police want a conviction.

If you go and report this assault now, that may work in your favour as a sort of insurance in itself (i.e. the social power of being a "victim" may get the ball rolling in your favour, if he hasn't reported you already). On the other hand, if he's had a bit of a panic attack and worries about you having reported him for assault, and has himself already gone and reported YOU for assault, then you may have a problem. He does sound like the sort of person who covers his tracks and tests the waters (i.e. he grabbed and shoved your bars to see how you would react, before assaulting you). You have to bear in mind as well that if you report him, they will interview him, and he will most likely say you assaulted him. And that leaves it up to the police/CPS to decide if they want to charge anyone.

In summary, there are no easy answers.

If I may suggest, you need to calm down a bit and assess the situation. Don't speak with or engage any other road user, in any way. They are just a liability. You will always sense when someone is getting erratic or angry, and when you do, you've got the bike, so just put space between you and them.

[Ste]

[Bhud]

The criminal mind:

"I was taking my daughter home from her weekly horse riding class. She was diagnosed with ADHD and a personality disorder, and myself and my wife go to great lengths to help bring it under control. She really enjoys it, and it helps stop her panic attacks, and to lead a more fulfilling life.

On my way home, I'm not sure what happened, but this chap on a motorcycle - he was absolutely huge - pulled up to my window at a traffic light and started screaming and shaking, and swearing. He was shouting obscenities and making obscene gestures, in between shaking his fist at me. I was scared for myself and my daughter. I don't know what I did wrong, and I was too scared to open the window. I didn't know what to do. My daughter started having a panic attack. When this happens, she has difficulty breathing, and she has a sort of epileptic episode. I tried my best to calm her down but it wasn't working.

I pulled into a car park down a side road, so that I could calm down my daughter. To my absolute surprise, the motorcycle rider followed me there. He turned off his bike and marched up to my car. I think he had a metal object in his hand. I was really scared but I thought I could calm him down and try to find out what upset him, so I opened my car door with my hands up. I didn't want him getting any closer to my daughter. He was really raging. He shouted at me, accusing him of cutting him off at the lights, and punched me about the head three times. My head was swimming and I saw stars, and all I wanted to do was get away from there. I got in the car and sped off. I think the motorcycle rider was following me. I must admit, I had to break a few speed limits to get away.

My daughter was beside herself with panic, and was crying and screaming. I didn't know what to do, and when I got home my wife and myself spent the rest of the day trying to calm down my daughter. I had bruises around my head, but I didn't go to the hospital because I had to look after and calm down my daughter. Nowadays, ever since this incident, she awakes in the middle of the night, screaming. She can't sleep and I'm not taking her back to school. We are in daily contact with her therapist, who recommends that my daughter isn't put through the process of a police interview, despite being a witness.

I am deeply concerned about the behaviour of the motorcycle rider, and I have reported this incident because felt he poses a significant risk to members of the public. I am a responsible person and a member of the Chartered Institute of [....] and I felt it's my civic duty to report this."

[Easy-X]

Actual Bodily Harm. It's a thing, it's not legal.

I kinda wonder of the mentality of someone hitting a guy in a helmet wearing (most likely) an armoured jacket If I didn't care so much about my precious bike I might have hopped off and beaten him to a pulp. I'd imagine the kid would have been wishing that would happen for years

Seriously though the best you could have done is drag the scenario out until some passer by stumbled on the scene or someone else tried to get in or out of the car park. Apologising forced or otherwise was, IMHO, totally the wrong thing to do as the guy will carry on doing this sort of thing.
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Husqvarna Vitpilen 401, Yamaha XSR700, Honda Rebel, Yamaha DT175, Suzuki SV650 (loan) Fazer 600, Keeway Superlight 125, 50cc turd scooter

[trevor saxe-coburg-gotha]

[P.]

Half the story for sure, you clearly angered them by doing something silly. Be a boy and own up

[Mr tiddles]

[JustinW]

I'd say let it go, move on.
Not like you were hurt. Just one of those weird red mist moments.

[MarJay]

[ThatDippyTwat]

[Bhud]

The forum tends to be sort of traditional in its social attitudes, and I do get that. I think we're all of an age where we remember that world in which you could easily tell who was who by what they drove or what they wore.

Regarding the BMW/Audi thing, quite honestly, when I'm out on my bike I'm having fun, it's all about me, and I don't even notice what anyone's driving. Unless it's something like a kit car, or a Ferrari Dino (as I saw the other day), a DeLorean or something equally interesting, in which they get a wave from me. However, I do try to keep my head in 2021. Many things have completely changed in society. Most cars are expensive, most are German, many are bought on some sort of credit agreement, many aren't properly maintained or serviced because it's all too expensive now, etc. You can't look at someone and tell who's who anymore. Remember when you could easily tell that someone was a bank manager simply because they drove a Rover V8 Vitesse? That world's gone now. Just, completely gone. Try explaining to a kid today that the difference between driving a 1.6L and a 1.6GL is that the latter meant you were "management material", or that once you were promoted at work you changed your cigarette brand to Silk Cut, if you wanted to go places...

Some things, however, haven't changed much.

The reception you might get at court, for example, as a father and as a driver of a BMW car, might not be quite the same as someone who rides a really ratty 125 and who's unemployed (as OP claims to be).

There are also people who appear to be nutters in BMWs and Audis because they're genuinely distracted or carried away by their excitement, e.g. on a sunny day, on their way to their dealer. And, yes, drug use is commonplace now. In the past, drinking was commonplace and socially accepted and drug use was edgy, and now it's all reversed.

So, some things have definitely changed, while others haven't changed very much at all. It isn't about envy any more. A lot of these BMWs and Audis are "beaters" being driven into the ground until the wheels fall off, holding on just barely to an MOT, and I don't think anyone's under any illusion about these high mileage A3s or X5s being driven by high flyers. It's all different now. Aren't pushbikes the new status symbols for go-getters and hard workers?

[trevor saxe-coburg-gotha]

[Easy-X]

[MarJay]

[trevor saxe-coburg-gotha]

[McHattrick]

I got some questions.

[Andy_Pagin]

[Fat Angry Scotsman]

Off topic slightly but I have noticed as well that Audi and BMW drivers have an unwarranted sense of entitlement and I also note that there is no barrier to entry on expensive cars anymore.

HP let middle earners into the higher earner car bracket and then PCP let anyone own one.

Lad that used to work with me kept on banging on about his Audi RS3 that he got brand new as if it was some kind of amazing achievement. PCP on an RS3 is £523 a month with no deposit which is affordable for most people.
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PRESENT: 2018 BMW S1000XR SE Sport.
PAST: 2009 Kawasaki ER-6F. 2021 Zontes ZT-125U.

[Mr tiddles]

[quote="McHattrick"]I got some questions.

[Robby]

No matter what the word may have been, or how loud, you got assaulted and it needs to be reported. Stinkwheel's suggestion is also good, anything where a kid is present will increase the interest of the police.