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Bhud
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Joined: 11 Oct 2018
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PostPosted: 22:09 - 13 Jul 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote
Don't want Sunak. He's way too hardcore. Don't think anyone quite realises just how hardcore he is.

He's that guy in the Audi/BMW who tries to run you off the road because he believes he his car gives him a higher status. We're ready for people lining their pockets but not ready to be driven over by people who think everyone "below" them is scum. Rather the law of the jungle than the law of the Delhi roundabout.
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Ribenapigeon
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PostPosted: 22:46 - 13 Jul 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote
Bhud wrote:
Don't want Sunak. He's way too hardcore. Don't think anyone quite realises just how hardcore he is.

He's that guy in the Audi/BMW who tries to run you off the road because he believes he his car gives him a higher status. We're ready for people lining their pockets but not ready to be driven over by people who think everyone "below" them is scum. Rather the law of the jungle than the law of the Delhi roundabout.


You've had these people in charge for forty three years why change now?

What the country needs is broad pilitics, right and left but the Tory party is no longer a party which represents ordinary British people (if it ever was) and thats what is needed on the right of our political landscape, a conservative party that represents ordinary working people who may be quite affluent but will still need to work into elder years to enjoy a retirement as well as the lower paid, but who have traditionally conservative views, cautious about legislative, and social change and financies.

The modern Tory party IE since Thatcher and her cronies took over in the seventies is hardly that, its a tool of the global neo-lib right wing. A party of cheap traitors who will sell out the British people for a few million to their foreign masters. If the labour party of the seventies could be seen as being controlled by un democratically elected union bosses then we should see the contemporary Tory party in the same way, worse even because in no way at all do the masters of the likes of Sunak and any of the other party elite represent any British person unless they're members of the globalist super rich. Are there any supporters of conservatism who see things this way? I would be interested to know.
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Kawasaki Jimbo
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Joined: 09 Oct 2015
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PostPosted: 23:17 - 13 Jul 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote
Do you think Labour is a party which represents ordinary British people?
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Ste
Not Work Safe



Joined: 01 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: 23:24 - 13 Jul 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote
Bhud wrote:
He's that guy in the Audi/BMW who tries to run you off the road because he believes he his car gives him a higher status.

Lol, he doesn't run anyone off the road.

He's not some poor person who drives themselves around, he has a chauffeur to do that stuff for him.
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M.C
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PostPosted: 23:28 - 13 Jul 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote
Ribenapigeon wrote:
You've had these people in charge for forty three years why change now?

Yep.
Ribenapigeon wrote:
What the country needs is broad pilitics, right and left but the Tory party is no longer a party which represents ordinary British people (if it ever was)

They never were, it was the Labour party, decreasingly so until the last general election where they completely abandoned the white working class vote which went well... General election 2019: 'Worst night for Labour since 1935'

[before Nobby chimes in yes I mean British not David fucking Lammy]

Ribenapigeon wrote:
and thats what is needed on the right of our political landscape, a conservative party that represents ordinary working people who may be quite affluent but will still need to work into elder years to enjoy a retirement as well as the lower paid, but who have traditionally conservative views, cautious about legislative, and social change and financies.

Yes and no, it seems obvious but if you observe Conservatives all they do is follow 'the left', routinely redrawing their line in to sand to whatever left wingers were campaigning for last week. It's why things tend to go in one direction.

And why should they do any different? Boris was voted in with a massive majority. If people stop voting for them, like what happened when they were losing votes to UKIP, then they'll change direction/policies (remember the Conservative government didn't want Brexit).

Anyway I only came here to post this... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Ens-MNzQOE Wub
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Ribenapigeon
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PostPosted: 23:34 - 13 Jul 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote
Kawasaki Jimbo wrote:
Do you think Labour is a party which represents ordinary British people?


Far more than a fifth column for Wall St does. However questionable some of its flakey wokists are the labour party isn't inatley traitorous. But I fear you missed my point that we need broad politics based around a definite spectrum so each side balances out the other. We don't have that with the Tory party the way it is today.
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Ste
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Joined: 01 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: 23:42 - 13 Jul 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote
Kawasaki Jimbo wrote:
Do you think Labour is a party which represents ordinary British people?

https://i.imgur.com/Sa70CLF.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/y1MrAQl.jpg
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Ribenapigeon
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PostPosted: 23:43 - 13 Jul 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote
M.C wrote:

Yes and no, it seems obvious but if you observe Conservatives all they do is follow 'the left', routinely redrawing their line in to sand to whatever left wingers were campaigning for last week. It's why things tend to go in one direction.

And why should they do any different? Boris was voted in with a massive majority. If people stop voting for them, like what happened when they were losing votes to UKIP, then they'll change direction/policies (remember the Conservative government didn't want Brexit).



Im not sure what you mean by "follow the left", im sure the Tory strategists are aware that the majority of voters are arithmetically to the left so come elections they have to appear to be pro NHS and education etc, they also know how to lie very effectively as well. They don't actually "follow" left wing progressive policy they've just learned how to camouflage themselves. They also know how to make the unspoken promise of "vote for us and you wont have to give a s#1t about anyone else but yourself, oh and plus pay less income tax".
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Ribenapigeon
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PostPosted: 23:49 - 13 Jul 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote
Ste wrote:
Kawasaki Jimbo wrote:
Do you think Labour is a party which represents ordinary British people?

https://i.imgur.com/Sa70CLF.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/y1MrAQl.jpg


See, they do.
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M.C
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Joined: 29 Sep 2015
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PostPosted: 00:09 - 14 Jul 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote
Ribenapigeon wrote:
M.C wrote:

Yes and no, it seems obvious but if you observe Conservatives all they do is follow 'the left', routinely redrawing their line in to sand to whatever left wingers were campaigning for last week. It's why things tend to go in one direction.

And why should they do any different? Boris was voted in with a massive majority. If people stop voting for them, like what happened when they were losing votes to UKIP, then they'll change direction/policies (remember the Conservative government didn't want Brexit).



Im not sure what you mean by "follow the left", im sure the Tory strategists are aware that the majority of voters are arithmetically to the left so come elections they have to appear to be pro NHS and education etc, they also know how to lie very effectively as well. They don't actually "follow" left wing progressive policy they've just learned how to camouflage themselves. They also know how to make the unspoken promise of "vote for us and you wont have to give a s#1t about anyone else but yourself, oh and plus pay less income tax".

Eh? This is the same conservative party that has presided over record immigration to Britain, introduced gay marriage, introduced big minimum wage increases?

I'd say they do the opposite, come election time they talk tough on immigration etc. then carry on as they have done the last decade with the above.
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Ribenapigeon
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PostPosted: 09:27 - 14 Jul 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote
M.C wrote:

Eh? This is the same conservative party that has presided over record immigration to Britain, introduced gay marriage, introduced big minimum wage increases?

I'd say they do the opposite, come election time they talk tough on immigration etc. then carry on as they have done the last decade with the above.


Globalisation of labour is a right wing neo-lib policy and the other stuff was just cheap vote buying. The real left are anti the cheap foreign labour racket.

Im not trying to get you to vote Labour im just trying to get accross that the Tories are not at all a party of the British people. They're utter traitors.
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Easy-X
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Joined: 08 Mar 2019
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PostPosted: 12:10 - 14 Jul 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote
As I always say: the ballot box doesn't let you choose your leaders only the brand of lube.*

*The modern vernacular of Twain's "if voting made any difference they wouldn't let us do it!"
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Im-a-Ridah
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Joined: 20 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: 18:24 - 14 Jul 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote
Ribenapigeon wrote:

Globalisation of labour is a right wing neo-lib policy and the other stuff was just cheap vote buying. The real left are anti the cheap foreign labour racket.

Im not trying to get you to vote Labour im just trying to get accross that the Tories are not at all a party of the British people. They're utter traitors.


Yup, the centrists on both sides only care about money and power for themselves.

Somewhere along the way the unions went from union solidarity to let them all in. IMO once many of the unionised jobs became middle class they just threw the other working class people under the bus.

Easy-X wrote:
As I always say: the ballot box doesn't let you choose your leaders only the brand of lube.*

*The modern vernacular of Twain's "if voting made any difference they wouldn't let us do it!"


And if anyone disputes this just take a look at the reaction of "they" i.e the ruling class when the working class dared to vote against what they were instructed to vote for [remain].
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Ribenapigeon
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PostPosted: 18:29 - 14 Jul 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote
Im-a-Ridah wrote:


And if anyone disputes this just take a look at the reaction of "they" i.e the ruling class when the working class dared to vote against what they were instructed to vote for [remain].


Whats the demographic of what you call the rulling class?
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Ribenapigeon
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PostPosted: 18:31 - 14 Jul 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote
Easy-X wrote:
As I always say: the ballot box doesn't let you choose your leaders only the brand of lube.*

*The modern vernacular of Twain's "if voting made any difference they wouldn't let us do it!"


I think thats overly cycnical. If managed well democracy should give good representation of what the people need.
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chickenstrip
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Joined: 06 Dec 2013
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PostPosted: 18:42 - 14 Jul 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote
Ribenapigeon wrote:
Im-a-Ridah wrote:


And if anyone disputes this just take a look at the reaction of "they" i.e the ruling class when the working class dared to vote against what they were instructed to vote for [remain].


Whats the demographic of what you call the rulling class?


Globalists? Is that the the common factor? The "one world" lot? I'm talking about now, not years ago, although I couldn't place a marker on when it became this way, if that's what it is.
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Easy-X
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PostPosted: 19:41 - 14 Jul 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote
Ribenapigeon wrote:
If managed well democracy should give good representation of what the people need.


Where is this magical dreamland you speak of?
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Ribenapigeon
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PostPosted: 20:16 - 14 Jul 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote
Easy-X wrote:


Where is this magical dreamland you speak of?


Where you make it. Laughing
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Ribenapigeon
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PostPosted: 20:18 - 14 Jul 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote
chickenstrip wrote:


Globalists? Is that the the common factor? The "one world" lot? I'm talking about now, not years ago, although I couldn't place a marker on when it became this way, if that's what it is.


Shocked are you on the sauce this evening?
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M.C
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Joined: 29 Sep 2015
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PostPosted: 21:14 - 14 Jul 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote
Ribenapigeon wrote:
M.C wrote:

Eh? This is the same conservative party that has presided over record immigration to Britain, introduced gay marriage, introduced big minimum wage increases?

I'd say they do the opposite, come election time they talk tough on immigration etc. then carry on as they have done the last decade with the above.


Globalisation of labour is a right wing neo-lib policy and the other stuff was just cheap vote buying.

Gay marriage is a vote winner? Confused

Ribenapigeon wrote:
The real left are anti the cheap foreign labour racket.

Who are they then? Cos the Jeremy Corbyn/momentum lot want unlimited immigration.

Ribenapigeon wrote:
Im not trying to get you to vote Labour im just trying to get accross that the Tories are not at all a party of the British people.

I never thought and never said they were...

M.C wrote:
Ribenapigeon wrote:
the Tory party is no longer a party which represents ordinary British people (if it ever was)

They never were, it was the Labour party, decreasingly so until the last general election where they completely abandoned the white working class vote which went well... General election 2019: 'Worst night for Labour since 1935'


Ribenapigeon wrote:
They're utter traitors.

You'll get no disagreement from me.
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Nobby the Bastard
Harley Gaydar



Joined: 16 Aug 2013
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PostPosted: 21:45 - 14 Jul 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote
M.C wrote:

Gay marriage is a vote winner? Confused



It probably is if you are gay. Most straight people have no opinion either way so it doesn't cost any votes.

Aside from the religeous freaks and fuck them.
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 21:49 - 14 Jul 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote
Ribenapigeon wrote:
chickenstrip wrote:


Globalists? Is that the the common factor? The "one world" lot? I'm talking about now, not years ago, although I couldn't place a marker on when it became this way, if that's what it is.


Shocked are you on the sauce this evening?


You don't think our ruling class are globalist elitists? Or are you confusing the Tories for the ruling class? I think that may have been the case in the past, not now. You're just still stuck on the same old leftie rhetoric while the world leaves you behind.
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M.C
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PostPosted: 22:38 - 14 Jul 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote
Nobby the Bastard wrote:
M.C wrote:

Gay marriage is a vote winner? Confused



It probably is if you are gay.

2017 general election...

https://blogsmedia.lse.ac.uk/blogs.dir/8/files/2021/01/lgbt2.png

Clapping
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Ribenapigeon
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PostPosted: 22:39 - 14 Jul 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote
chickenstrip wrote:


You don't think our ruling class are globalist elitists? Or are you confusing the Tories for the ruling class? I think that may have been the case in the past, not now. You're just still stuck on the same old leftie rhetoric while the world leaves you behind.


I just couldn't understand your ramble.

No. I do think our ruling class are globalist elitists. I doubt many of them have a British passport or are in any meaningful way related to britain.

No. I dont think the Tories are our ruling class any longer they're just happy to take the coin of the globalist elites and serve them.

Im too the left politically but in terms of how the division of labor in the economy and the product of that labor is distributed and how public institutions progress to make said distribution fairer. If thats old fashioned I dont care. Im also a democrat and pro capitalism but I'm anti having capital dictate to democratically elected power in the same way I think church and state should be seperate.

I think we should be as concerned about corporate business penetration of our conservative political party as we were about Russian influence over the Labour party in the post war years. however I believe the Conservative party has been compromised far more emphatically by the powers of global corporate and financial powers than Russia ever managed to with the Labour party.
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Ribenapigeon
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PostPosted: 22:50 - 14 Jul 2022    Post subject: Reply with quote
M.C wrote:

Gay marriage is a vote winner? Confused



It's a flagship "look we're not the nasty party" policy that's all.

Corbyns view on immigration is it's the way its used to cheapen labour thats wrong not the physical movement of people. Its a subllty thats lost on many and which was never communicated very well unfortunately.
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