Nationalising Energy.

[Polarbear]

The Gruppenfurher Sturgeon has come out with 'Nationalising energy can't be off the table and for once I agree with her.

Now as I understand it from when Corbyn wanted to renationalise British rail that the government only had to wait until the francise/lease expired and not renew it to basically renationalise at no horrendous cost.

This is not possible with the energy compainies and by them I mean Eon, Centrica and co. BUT, what is to stop the government setting up their own company which undercuts the rest forcing them to lower prices dramatically or lose all their customers?

So we get 'UK Energy' charging half what the private companies do. Everyone switches to them forcing the prices down. Is that feasable, doable or would it totally undermine the free market economy?
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Triumph Trophy Launch Edition

[Nobby the Bastard]

What you think of as energy suppliers aren't the energy generators. They are the ones making the massive profits. Loads of energy suppliers have gone to the wall over this.
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trevor saxe-coburg-gotha:"Remember this simple rule - scooters are for men who like to feel the breeze on their huge, flapping cunt lips."
Sprint ST 1050

[Polarbear]

[Nobby the Bastard]

E.on is a generator of electricity.

British Gas doesn't just sell energy, they also supply, fit and service gas appliances.
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trevor saxe-coburg-gotha:"Remember this simple rule - scooters are for men who like to feel the breeze on their huge, flapping cunt lips."
Sprint ST 1050

[stinkwheel]

They could build national generation infrastructure with capital expenditure and sell the power to the grid at whatever price they want. Thereby giving a degree of realtime control over the national energy price.

I wonder how much renewable generation capacity could be built for the amount they are currently spending subsidising peoples electricity bills and what impact that extra generation capacity could exert on the energy price?

Not to mention capital expenditure on civil engineering projects is probably one of the better forms of economic stimulus because you not only pump money into the economy, but you create employment and have something to show for it at the end of the day.

The ability to use eminent domain cuts through a shitload of red tape too "We are building a windfarm here.".
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“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.”
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.

[Easy-X]

I'm a great believer in free markets but let's face it: we're talking about a rigged market here. Water companies would be a clearer example. If I don't like the service from Thames Water I can't switch to Southern even though I'm close to the border between the two.

The question [to politicians] is what do want out of energy generation? Do you want UK plc to be a successful country that fucks over the rest of the world? Offer all essential* infrastructure at cost domestically and at slim profit commercially.

Or do you want to bleed the poor for every penny they have... oh, it seems the system is working as intended

*Energy, water, maybe landlines. Mobiles and broadband seem to be served fairly well by the free market approach.
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[Weisse Schlange]

Just so's yeh know

EdF are fucking struggling in the UK



Don't confuse energy suppliers with Oil producers.
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Hing Oan

[CaNsA]

This is how nationalising utilities plays out, and the Gov put us here in the first place.

Gov runs out of money and sells decently running and stable utility networks.
Companies buy utilities for pennies with the promise they will upgrade network as needed and keep on top of repairs.
Companies spend as little as possible on utility network
Network on verge of collapse due to lack of maintenance, mis-management, price fixing, price gouging and share-holder pocket lining then boasts record profits.
Gov buys utility companies = many pounds
Gov fixes utility network = many pounds
Gov runs out of money again and then sells the utilities again.

Rinse and repeat.

[doggone]

[Easy-X]

Be nice to have politicians that could serve the public and the country instead of themselves and their chums. Who's up for a bloody revolution? It's either that or join your local political party
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[Kawasaki Jimbo]

Since VAT is a percentage of the cost of whatever you’re buying and the government coffers are empty after lockdown’s expenses it suits them to see fuel prices high.

Fuel duty is currently levied at a flat rate of 57.95p per litre for both petrol and diesel, while VAT at 20% is then charged on both the product price and the duty.

So even the tax is taxed.

[Ribenapigeon]

The problem is that the profit ethic can be as subject to fanatisism as any other ethos. Nothing gets done because it's a good idea these days, roads railways and airports aren't built because it's a good idea to be able to get from A to B, water isn't collected because it's a good idea to be able to use it, energy infrastructure doesn't get created because it's a good idea to have power, schools aren't built because it's a good idea to have people educated. Real service delivery is replaced by a box tick for profit system. We get crap products and services and some prick gets to bob about on a yacht in Monaco. Then something serious kicks off and we get into a war fought on an economic front with a super-power and we're screwed.

[CaNsA]

[Easy-X]

AFAIK raw sewage gets dumped in rivers when the plant is overloaded with something like a flash flood.
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[Ribenapigeon]

[CaNsA]

[Irezumi]

Water companies have reportedly spent £5bn on infrastructure since privatisation (No.10 statement). That's all companies combined over a 33 year period.

Within that time frame they have also paid out £72bn to shareholders.

Sewage companies are only supposed to discharge sewage into the water system in "exceptional situations".

You would think a government would put general public health before companies making profits. Seems that isn't the case currently. An MP in 2015 asked civil servants to find a way out of making all rivers 'good' under then applicable EU rules by a 2027 deadline. That MP was Liz Truss.

They're corrupt and complicit. A required natural resource such as water should never of been put into private hands. Particularly a monopolistic system.

[Ribenapigeon]

[chickenstrip]

It's called "greed".
I don't know about "The Great Reset", but the higher end of capitalism certainly needs some kind of reset, one based on moral values I think.

In a way, I even understand the phenomenon of "woke." It's just that no one seems able to judge when they're taking things too far in any given direction.
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[Ribenapigeon]

[Nobby the Bastard]

Nationalising stuff sounds suspiciously like socialism to me.....
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trevor saxe-coburg-gotha:"Remember this simple rule - scooters are for men who like to feel the breeze on their huge, flapping cunt lips."
Sprint ST 1050

[Ribenapigeon]

[Rob Fzs]

[Polarbear]

I'm old enough to remember the disaster nationalised industry was back in the pre Thatcher days.

Everyone who worked for a nationalised company regarded it as a free joy ride with wage rises as requested thanks to the government having magic money trees, especially Labour who were in the pockets of the unions. Give BL government help to save the company and the workers came out on strike for more even though they were only partially nationalised. Anything the government touched was seen as fair game for non stop striking. We can't go back to that mindset again if we do start nationalising anything.
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Triumph Trophy Launch Edition

[Ribenapigeon]