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This rather nasty episode...

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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 00:20 - 03 Mar 2023    Post subject: This rather nasty episode... Reply with quote
Constance Marten and Mark Gordon charged with gross negligence manslaughter

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-64830159

Pretty diguisting. Pedofile, rapist and obviously someone who has total control over the woman.

They can't even sex the baby until DNA is checked.
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 07:53 - 03 Mar 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote
Sounds like it was but in some ways I hope the baby was dead before they were arrested and it wasn't as a result of being left somewhere by itself.
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 08:11 - 03 Mar 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote
Police are saying the baby has been dead for at least a few weeks.
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recman
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PostPosted: 08:39 - 03 Mar 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote
Now can we bring back capital punishment?
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Islander
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PostPosted: 09:41 - 03 Mar 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote
recman wrote:
Now can we bring back capital punishment?


No.
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Freddyfruitba...
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PostPosted: 10:26 - 03 Mar 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote
TBH, I'm confused about why there's been a manhunt for them for ages already (ie before the baby would even have been born)... is it just because the woman's father is a pillar of the establishment who hasn't taken kindly to his daughter buggering off with this low-life? Otherwise, what was the crime?
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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 10:34 - 03 Mar 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote
Freddyfruitbat wrote:
TBH, I'm confused about why there's been a manhunt for them for ages already (ie before the baby would even have been born)... is it just because the woman's father is a pillar of the establishment who hasn't taken kindly to his daughter buggering off with this low-life? Otherwise, what was the crime?


Did it not start with their car burning on the side of the motorway or was it before that?
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 10:40 - 03 Mar 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote
Nope, started with the burning car.
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recman
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PostPosted: 12:10 - 03 Mar 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote
Islander wrote:
recman wrote:
Now can we bring back capital punishment?


No.


How about a spot of torture?
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BTTD
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PostPosted: 13:46 - 03 Mar 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote
recman wrote:
Now can we bring back capital punishment?


The rationale for removing capital punishment was the promise of advances in rehabilitation.
It's never happened so in certain instances you could argue yes. For example Rigby's killers have shown no remorse and will likely never be released. There is no doubt as to their guilt so why keep them alive at great cost?
What is acheived by imprisioning someone for the rest of their natural life if rehabilitation is off the cards?
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DaddyStu
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PostPosted: 16:47 - 03 Mar 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote
Read somewhere they were in some sort of Nigerian cult. Cant find the story now though.
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Easy-X
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PostPosted: 17:10 - 03 Mar 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote
Islander wrote:
recman wrote:
Now can we bring back capital punishment?


No.


Capital punishment is perfectly acceptable. It's the administration that's the problem.
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 17:37 - 03 Mar 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote
Easy-X wrote:


Capital punishment is perfectly acceptable. It's the administration that's the problem.


More of a case the principle is okay, but the execution is either a let down or a bit shocking.

In all seriousness, though, the whole point of capital punishment is as a deterrent. It's clearly not because 1) it never seemed to stop people and 2) some of the worst mass murderers committed suicide rather than stay in prison.
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Last edited by Nobby the Bastard on 20:08 - 03 Mar 2023; edited 1 time in total
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Islander
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PostPosted: 20:02 - 03 Mar 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote
Easy-X wrote:
Capital punishment is perfectly acceptable. It's the administration that's the problem.


We'll have to agree to disagree on this. It certainly isn't ok. Apart from the morality of the state taking a life, mistakes are made in the judicial process. You can let someone out of a prison, you can't restore life.

It has no place in any civilised society.
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to v or not to v
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PostPosted: 20:07 - 03 Mar 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote
it not a deterrent, its there to remove the worst type of people.
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 20:08 - 03 Mar 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote
to v or not to v wrote:
it not a deterrent, its there to remove the worst type of people.



Prisons do the same thing.
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recman
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PostPosted: 21:10 - 03 Mar 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote
Nobby the Bastard wrote:
to v or not to v wrote:
it not a deterrent, its there to remove the worst type of people.



Prisons do the same thing.


Still a risk to society.
I'm not sure how many wrongly executed cases versus scumbags being released to murder/rape/etc there have ever been but I think today's society would stomach the former rather more easily.
I'd like to think wrongful executions these days, with all of the forensic technology at our disposal along with the ubiquitous cctv factor, would be minimised to the point of elimination. We don't live in the 50s.
Yet even today we still hear about prisoners being wrongly released to beat some old lady to a pulp for the £3.76 in her purse, another executable crime in my humble opinion.
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 21:38 - 03 Mar 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote
There are many killers in prison without any genetic evidence and just circumstancial evidence. Roy Whiting for one.
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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 22:16 - 03 Mar 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote
Nobby the Bastard wrote:
There are many killers in prison without any genetic evidence and just circumstancial evidence. Roy Whiting for one.


I suppose that the arguement would be that if it wasn't 100% proved nowadays someone wouldn't be excecuted. It would be life imprisonment. Where it was 100% like Lee Rigbys killers, why not?

And I don't agree with Islander on a civilised society can't have the death penalty. We put rabid dogs down, why not people. Surely more civilised than letting them rot in some hole for the next 50/60/70 years.

And as recman says, how many so called reformed inmates have been released just to convict again. I know the modern position is reform, but there are some you can never reform and never trust again in society so put them out of our misery.
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recman
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PostPosted: 22:22 - 03 Mar 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote
Nobby the Bastard wrote:
There are many killers in prison without any genetic evidence and just circumstancial evidence. Roy Whiting for one.


https://www.standard.co.uk/hp/front/dna-proof-against-sarah-s-killer-6335671.html

I'm thinking more about future cases rather than current criminals incarcerated.
Although how many would be truly put out if Whiting swung?
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Islander
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PostPosted: 22:38 - 03 Mar 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote
recman wrote:


Still a risk to society.
I'm not sure how many wrongly executed cases versus scumbags being released to murder/rape/etc there have ever been but I think today's society would stomach the former rather more easily.


So you'd be happy if one of your nearest and dearest were wrongly convicted and executed by the state would you?

One innocent person executed would be one too many.

I stand by my statement that state executions have no place in any civilised society.
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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 01:10 - 04 Mar 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote
Islander wrote:
recman wrote:


Still a risk to society.
I'm not sure how many wrongly executed cases versus scumbags being released to murder/rape/etc there have ever been but I think today's society would stomach the former rather more easily.


So you'd be happy if one of your nearest and dearest were wrongly convicted and executed by the state would you?

One innocent person executed would be one too many.

I stand by my statement that state executions have no place in any civilised society.


Why? Should rabid dogs be allowed in society? Why do humans have more rights than animals? Kill a few billion and maybe the wrld will be a better place.
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arry
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PostPosted: 09:42 - 04 Mar 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote
Islander wrote:

I stand by my statement that state executions have no place in any civilised society.


Is a society civilised when people are hacking other people to death with machetes in the street, with alarming regularity?
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MCN
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PostPosted: 09:50 - 04 Mar 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote
Islander wrote:
Easy-X wrote:
Capital punishment is perfectly acceptable. It's the administration that's the problem.


We'll have to agree to disagree on this. It certainly isn't ok. Apart from the morality of the state taking a life, mistakes are made in the judicial process. You can let someone out of a prison, you can't restore life.

It has no place in any civilised society.


So you've never heard of a Defibrillator then? Rolling Eyes

Laughing

Off main topic.

I listened to a radio 4 interview with the last hangman in England.
A very sober sounding and upright chap by the sounds of him.
He said he never had any regrets about his job.
He said the people were fou d guilty and he arranged the appeal in heaven/hell.

Death sentence is a vengeful means of dealing with horrendous crimes.

The real thing to do is to help people not commit crime and if they do we need much better ways to prevent crime and then detect and take the guilty into custody.

The chance of being caught is the real deterrent to most people.

Mental cases are a different show.

Psycho don't want to be caught. They are not usually careless in crime. Above average intelligence helps them avoid legal confrontation.
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recman
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PostPosted: 11:12 - 04 Mar 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote
MCN wrote:
The real thing to do is to help people not commit crime and if they do we need much better ways to prevent crime.


Nothing personal but I'm really sick of hearing that one.
Call me unimaginative but I think there is a better way.
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