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Singapore to execute female drug smuggler.

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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 09:38 - 27 Jul 2023    Post subject: Singapore to execute female drug smuggler. Reply with quote

Singapore to execute woman on drugs charge for the first time in 20 years

Two things to discuss I'm thinking.

The death penaly for drug smuggling and the fact the news is harping on about it being a woman.

2nd bit first. In todays equal society does it matter if it's a man or a woman? I think not. The 2nd thing that is up for debate here, does the death penalty do any good?

As someone who has been to Singapore many times over the years I've seen it change, mostly for the better. When I first went there crime was rife, ladyboys ruled Bugis street, Change Alley was a wonderful place to shop and get mugged. There were brothels eveyrwhere and it was the hippy centre of the far east.

Lee Kuan Yew cleaned the place up in an unusual way. He made it illegal for males to have hair longer than collar length and killed the hippy culture practically overnight. Even foreiners had to have their hair short, I had to have mine cut when arriving at Changi airport one time or they wouldn't let me in.

Ever since then Singapore has had some draconian laws. The famouse one being 'no chewing gum' and of course public birching happened and still does (but now behind closed doors).

The result is probably the safeest and cleanest city state in the world but does that warrant the death penalty? I don't know.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-66309347
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 10:03 - 27 Jul 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

A Singapore national so they knew the risk. Also 30kg of heroin, not a bit of weed or a few pills for her mates, that's indistrial scale dealing. How many people would that have killed either directly or indirectly? Probably over 100,000 deals by the time it's cut.

You'd have been jailed for life over here for that much heroin.
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Easy-X
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PostPosted: 10:35 - 27 Jul 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

Drug mule sentencing: I'd have to be convinced they acted 100% of their own volition, not conned or coerced into it.

Other than the incidental "it's a woman!" touched on in the article the main thing I took away from the article was "the death penalty does not deter crime."

1) Singapore is a largely crime free state. What magic are they using if it's not down to their severe sentencing?

2) Totally glossed over by the so-called experts: someone in prison or dangling from the end of a rope is no longer able to commit crimes against society.

What does then deter crime? Don't know. But we do know it's not catching and sentencing criminals Neutral
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The Artist
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PostPosted: 11:04 - 27 Jul 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

stinkwheel wrote:
A Singapore national so they knew the risk. Also 30kg of heroin, not a bit of weed or a few pills for her mates, that's indistrial scale dealing. How many people would that have killed either directly or indirectly? Probably over 100,000 deals by the time it's cut.

You'd have been jailed for life over here for that much heroin.


30g, not 30kg.
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grr666
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PostPosted: 11:51 - 27 Jul 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

If they want to off her then that's fine with me. She knew the risk. I've taken drugs abroad before on a few occasions
in Europe. There have even been times I took too much to use it all and I've brought what I didn't use home again.
But when I've travelled to countries with MEGA stiff penalties for possession of drugs, I'm talking decades in prison,
death or public flogging then I've left my drugs at home. It's not difficult. I would have loved to watch the sun
set over the Indian Ocean puffing on a spliff sitting on a Maldivian beach but the threat of 20 years in prison was
enough for me to do without and just abuse the all inclusive bar instead. Thailand was another place that would
have locked me up for taking weed over when I went (it's legalised over there now so I might go back), same
with Singapore although it's not legal there yet. For that matter I doubt the US would have seen me smuggling
drugs over in anything but a negative light, nor New Zealand who spaz violently if you bring over an onion never mind
a bag of weed. I'm sure it's possible to sneak a little something through in all these places but it's not worth
the possibility of being caught at all. If you do it and you're caught then it's all on you I'm afraid.
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jeremyr62
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PostPosted: 12:57 - 27 Jul 2023    Post subject: Re: Singapore to execute female drug smuggler. Reply with quote

Polarbear wrote:
Singapore to execute woman on drugs charge for the first time in 20 years


When I first went there crime was rife, ladyboys ruled Bugis street, Change Alley was a wonderful place to shop and get mugged. There were brothels everywhere and it was the hippy centre of the far east.



Sounds pretty good to me.
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jeremyr62
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PostPosted: 13:03 - 27 Jul 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

As far as I know there isn't much evidence to support the theory that the death penalty does anything other than kill people, some of whom are guilty and some will be innocent. It certainly doesn't act a deterrent to violent crime. The septics like it cos it satisfies their warped desire for revenge.
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 13:18 - 27 Jul 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

jeremyr62 wrote:
As far as I know there isn't much evidence to support the theory that the death penalty does anything other than kill people, some of whom are guilty and some will be innocent. It certainly doesn't act a deterrent to violent crime. The septics like it cos it satisfies their warped desire for revenge.


It has a 0% re-offending rate.
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Skudd
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PostPosted: 14:07 - 27 Jul 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like the idea of public birching. That would be brilliant over here and a better deterrent than we have now, not that we actually have any deterrents.
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Bhud
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PostPosted: 14:57 - 27 Jul 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

They're getting cleverer with the clickbait, aren't they.
They already know very well what we think. But from framing the story this way, MSN and the like will get up or down clicks from people, even if they didn't read the article. Those who read it and feel inflamed by the sexism will write a comment. They know the game they're playing, and it's just a surprise how powerful the residual image of "journalism" is, after all this time.
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The Artist
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PostPosted: 15:15 - 27 Jul 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bhud wrote:
They're getting cleverer with the clickbait, aren't they.
They already know very well what we think. But from framing the story this way, MSN and the like will get up or down clicks from people, even if they didn't read the article. Those who read it and feel inflamed by the sexism will write a comment. They know the game they're playing, and it's just a surprise how powerful the residual image of "journalism" is, after all this time.


Same as this whole thread really.

People that are pro death penalty will think its fine and those against will think it isn't.

I doubt we are going to see any bombshell revelations that will convince someone to hop the fence on the politics section of a motorbike forum.
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Easy-X
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PostPosted: 18:17 - 27 Jul 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

jeremyr62 wrote:
As far as I know there isn't much evidence to support the theory that the death penalty does anything other than kill people, some of whom are guilty and some will be innocent. It certainly doesn't act a deterrent to violent crime. The septics like it cos it satisfies their warped desire for revenge.


AFAIK this is, from the research, largely true however what's left out is that criminals don't fear the penalties as much as they fear getting caught. Generally though letting the penalties slide goes hand-in-hand with slack policing - "why bother catching perps when the court only gives them a slap on the wrist?"

BTW I'm sure it was originally 30 kilos in the article. Has it been revised?
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 18:21 - 27 Jul 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

It was 30g in the original story because I remember wondering how far an oz of smack would go.
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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 20:00 - 27 Jul 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Artist wrote:
Bhud wrote:
They're getting cleverer with the clickbait, aren't they.
They already know very well what we think. But from framing the story this way, MSN and the like will get up or down clicks from people, even if they didn't read the article. Those who read it and feel inflamed by the sexism will write a comment. They know the game they're playing, and it's just a surprise how powerful the residual image of "journalism" is, after all this time.


Same as this whole thread really.

People that are pro death penalty will think its fine and those against will think it isn't.

I doubt we are going to see any bombshell revelations that will convince someone to hop the fence on the politics section of a motorbike forum.


I'm not sure that is true over the death penalty. My own view is sometimes there are crimes commited that are so horrendous my first though is that they don't deserve to live. Then you get misscarriages of justice which obviously are unreversable with the DP and that is against. So I'm not convinced either way.

But I'm certainly not convinced that it doesn't work as a deterrant or, as Easy wrote, how come Singapore with it's draconian sentencing has very little crime and that's all aspects of crime. I'm not convinced they are just a better law abiding society than most others for no reason.
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to v or not to v
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PostPosted: 20:39 - 27 Jul 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

Death to all drug dealers. drug addicts locked away until cleaned of the habit then released. if they reoffend then they get the death penalty too.
thats what id vote for.
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 21:07 - 27 Jul 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

to v or not to v wrote:
Death to all drug dealers. drug addicts locked away until cleaned of the habit then released. if they reoffend then they get the death penalty too.
thats what id vote for.


Most of us would be in chokey or dead then.
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to v or not to v
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PostPosted: 22:29 - 27 Jul 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

well it would help ease the over population and global warming you lefties care so much about.
a win win situation really Thumbs Up
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 22:47 - 27 Jul 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

As Gove has admitted taking coke can we put him at the head of the queue?

After all, we should expect a higher standard from those we elect to pass legislation.

What party does he represent? Pretty sure he's not a lefty...
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hellkat
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PostPosted: 00:04 - 28 Jul 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

grr666 wrote:
New Zealand who spaz violently if you bring over an onion never mind
a bag of weed. I'm sure it's possible to sneak a little something through .

I just wouldnt take the risk (anywhere, let alone NZ).

Recreational drugs are a great invention Laughing but are just not worth getting booted out, banged up or beheaded for Shocked

If I wanna get wankered and can't get weed, there's always tequila!


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to v or not to v
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PostPosted: 07:23 - 28 Jul 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nobby the Bastard wrote:
As Gove has admitted taking coke can we put him at the head of the queue?


id be most willing to start with the ruling class Nobby. im a firm believer in rule by example.

just think of all the living spaces we could free up for those invading children you care so much about.
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The Artist
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PostPosted: 08:46 - 28 Jul 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

Polarbear wrote:

I'm not sure that is true over the death penalty. My own view is sometimes there are crimes commited that are so horrendous my first though is that they don't deserve to live. Then you get misscarriages of justice which obviously are unreversable with the DP and that is against. So I'm not convinced either way.

But I'm certainly not convinced that it doesn't work as a deterrant or, as Easy wrote, how come Singapore with it's draconian sentencing has very little crime and that's all aspects of crime. I'm not convinced they are just a better law abiding society than most others for no reason.


Singapore can't be compared to a normal country. It is effectively a city state and is a fully unified system.

Regarding the death penalty, I am against because of the risk of murdering an innocent which I think is more egregious than carrying any quantity of drugs.

Then there is the other aspect that is if you are 100% sure it is the right person, whether you think it is right for a society to group together to kill someone for carrying some drugs.

I think state sanctioned killing of people can never be correct. It just seems barbaric and most people pro-death penalty for certain crimes, see it as revenge more than justice. Justice would be making them work like the rest of us but without any freedom.

I follow some true-crime subreddits/forums and there is a clear split between the curious in search of answers and the group just seething to kill/punish so called monsters. I find it quite interesting how people can be so blind to double standards and I am so glad that the western world (in general), has procedures that are followed for prosecution of criminals rather than mob justice.
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grr666
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PostPosted: 10:06 - 28 Jul 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

hellkat wrote:

I just wouldn't take the risk (anywhere, let alone NZ).

I wouldn't anymore, but 30 odd years ago in my 20's I was somewhat less concerned about consequences.
I remember when I was about 22 I took half ounce of whizz and half ounce of cannabis resin to Puerto Rico,
Gran Canaria. Try as I might I couldn't get through it all in a 10 day and three night Wink holiday. I was sitting
on my suitcase outside the airport, chain smoking joints to try and polish off my cannabis before getting on a plane.
Still ended up bringing an eighth back of each. Laughing As usual absolutely nobody in UK customs on my return.

They've hung her now anyway.
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Easy-X
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PostPosted: 12:27 - 28 Jul 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nobby the Bastard wrote:
What party does he represent? Pretty sure he's not a lefty...


Conservatives so yes, he is a Lefty.
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Easy-X
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PostPosted: 12:29 - 28 Jul 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Artist wrote:
I think state sanctioned killing of people can never be correct.


So you're not a fan of the Canadian government?
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to v or not to v
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PostPosted: 19:08 - 28 Jul 2023    Post subject: Reply with quote

Easy-X wrote:
The Artist wrote:
I think state sanctioned killing of people can never be correct.


So you're not a fan of the Canadian government?


thats killing innocent people so its all good.
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