Triumph looking worried by RE?

[Mawsley]

I wonder how any Triumphs get sold, I've either been ignored or experienced complete disinterest when looking around for a bike to buy.

Conversely, our local Enfield dealer is the most welcoming place - thrusting a coffee into your hands the minute you walk through the door.

[om15]

Over the years I have owned five Hinckley Triumphs, a Trident 900, 790 Bonneville, T100, Adventurer and Street Twin, after 20 years I thought would try something else and had a RE Classic 500 (not bad), Himalayan (very good), Intercepter (pretty poor) and Classic 350 (very ordinary).
I found that Royal Enfields in general were heavy, under powered, poor brakes and suspension and very cheap consumables (brake pads, fork oil and battery), build quality isn't very good and dealer servicing ( to keep warranty valid) is very expensive. They are very popular and people are happy to live with the shortcoming for the price.
I sold the Classic 350 because it was very, very dull and had about as much charisma as a mobility tricycle.
After a great deal of thought I came to the decision that I much preferred the early carb Bonneville to the modern Royal Enfields, I luckily found a very low mileage good condition 2001 790 Bonneville, excellent build quality, no EFI, ABS, mode selectors and so on, very happy to return to Triumphs.
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Alcohol doesn't solve problems, but neither does milk

[Polarbear]

[Mawsley]

[om15]

I bought a new Baker Express, first job was to replace the huge cat exhausts with TEC pipes and fit a DNA filter, this made the bike go well and sound nice, I improved the suspension by stripping the forks and fitting YSS emulators and pre load adjusters and replaced the rear shocks with IKONs, this did improve matters, and I also replaced the brake pads with items that worked. I fitted some nice accessories, a sump guard, fly screen and fork gaiters.
The bike looked great, but I still compared it unfavourably with the Bonneville, it didn't handle as well and I found it uncomfortable after an hour or so.
It is value for money, but I would rather pay a little more and get something better, with the slower Royal Enfields (Classic 350, 500, Himalayan) it is acceptable to ride a bike with poor handling, suspension and brakes when you are in the 40-60 mph range, but with the Interceptor you are in the 60-80 mph range and need something better.
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Alcohol doesn't solve problems, but neither does milk

[stinkwheel]

I think the problem the retro enfields have is they are actually like the originals in terms of performance and character. It turns out this isn't what people who want a retro bike are after. What they want is a bike that looks like the original but has the performance of a modern one.

What the Enfields give you is a bike that does everything the original did but much more reliably with working brakes, lights and charging system and no need to get the spanners out every couple of weeks.

What Triumph give you is a modern motorcycle that looks superficially like an original triumph.

I rode a 350 classic for a couple of weeks recently. I agree it's pretty dull, but was also entirely competant and capable, it never missed a beat and I put a few thousand miles on it. Performance was comparable with my pre-unit 350 bullet, the riding experience was considerably easier but in many ways, was less for that. What makes the old iron barrel interesting is the highly involved riding experience from nailing a gearshift to feathering the throttle to keep it on the boil to planning and using your limited brakes. I could probably hustle both bikes about at the same speed but the old bullet would be more of an achievement. Yes, it was boring. But there is a market for boring bikes. It's perfect for the Indian home market where nobody is going over 60mph anyway.

I suspect the new interceptors are similar in some ways. Put one next to an original interceptor which was no slouch for its day, you're probably getting comparable performance but in an overall easier to ride package. A good rider on an original 750 interceptor would probably hand an average rider on a modern 650 their arse.

Compare that to Triumph. Mrs stinkwheel has a speed twin while I was on the enfield. I had a go and it's a thoroughly modern hooligan of a bike that makes you power it out of corners on the twisties with the throttle pinned just to feel it pull. Safe in the knowledge that if you screw up, the traction control will take over. Almost no comparison to the performance and riding experience you'd get from the likes of an original 650 bonnie.

So two different markets. An actual retro bike from RE or a retro-looking bike from Triumph.

Of course, if you do want some performance, they are doing some interesting things with the RE 650s. Lots of tuning parts coming on the market. Like S&S are doing an 865 big bore kit which bumps it to 11:1 (from 9.5:1), performance cams, firged conrods etc-etc.

Be interesting to see how an RE650 +£5k of goodies would compare to a T120 Bonneville.
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“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.”
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.

[Easy-X]

I'm spending a lot of time tuning the exhaust with the Husky in the same way I did with the XSR because of the manufacturing limitation all new bikes have with regards to noise and emissions.

But if you're going to the trouble of redoing suspension, rebuilding the top end, etc. the obvious question is did you buy the right bike to start with.
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Husqvarna Vitpilen 401, Yamaha XSR700, Honda Rebel, Yamaha DT175, Suzuki SV650 (loan) Fazer 600, Keeway Superlight 125, 50cc turd scooter

[stinkwheel]

[Easy-X]

Yes, that always amazes me. Round my way there's a 40mph dual carriageway section that I'd probably scream away from the lights doing well over 50 obviously within the speed limits and some battered old van comes past me trying to do 70. Then 500 yards later screeches to a halt at the next roundabout. What was the point of that?!
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Husqvarna Vitpilen 401, Yamaha XSR700, Honda Rebel, Yamaha DT175, Suzuki SV650 (loan) Fazer 600, Keeway Superlight 125, 50cc turd scooter

[om15]

I have spent the last couple of months working on my new/old Bonneville, fitted original oem exhausts, cleaned and ACF 50'd everything, completed all servicing items, but still had an itch.
So I bought a 2015 RE Bullet 500 UCE this week, can't keep away.
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Alcohol doesn't solve problems, but neither does milk

[om15]

here it is,
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Alcohol doesn't solve problems, but neither does milk

[Robby]

[doggone]

I can see it being a bit gutless if you are wanting to overtake on fast A roads especially with pillion.
Nice enough for single track road bimbling and commuting, at that price should sell plenty.

[to v or not to v]

[rpsmith79]

The Speed 400 was the best selling bike (126-500cc), selling 58 bikes in the month of February

for reference:

51-125cc - Honda PCX 125 - 309
126-500cc - Triumph SPEED 400 - 58
501-750cc - Yamaha MT-07 ABS - 62
751-1000cc - Suzuki GSX 800 R - 57
1000cc+ - BMW R 1300 GS - 61

Not bad going for a bike many folk said wouldn't have much of a market

Source https://www.mcia.co.uk/press-statistics
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Current Bike: Honda CG125 ES4 // Honda CB600FS Hornet // Triumph Street Triple R

[McJamweasel]

The Scrambler 400 took the top spot for 151-500cc and Modern Classic in March with 222 sold. The Speed 400 sold a very similar amount.

0-50cc Lexmoto ECHO 50 21
51-125cc Yamaha NMAX 125 415
126-500cc Triumph SCRAMBLER 400X 222
501-750cc Yamaha MT-07 ABS 187
751-1000cc Triumph TIGER 900 GT PRO 161
1000cc+ BMW R 1300 GS 431
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BCF: Be yourself, just don't be an arse.