Blurring the lines /Sym Babieca /Gilera Ferro

[synaptyx]

A couple of guys started talking about auto-bikes the other night while I was adjusting my chain. They'd seen pics of the Gilera Ferro and had gotten quite flustered when one of them said "but, is it a bike?". The other just looked at him and went "FFS! What do you think!?" It looks like a bike, it has two wheels, a set of handlebars, a seat and an 850cc motor. So, it's made by a reknowned scooter company, does that mean it's really a big scooter? Comparisons have been made to Gilera's DNA, but that's another can of worms.

https://www.maxmoto.co.uk/images/gilera_ferro_850_2l.jpg

Sym, another major scooter manufacturer, may also be getting in on the act. On the Sym stand at Intermot'04 was their new concept 'scoota-bike' - as some people call them - the Babieca:

https://www.sym.com.tw/20040910/html/images/Babieca/7.jpg

It's a techies dream having an on-board PDA with GPS and a multimedia player, etc. More details of the Babieca here

Would you ride one? Personaly I prefer the style of the Ferro and would happily ride one and still consider myself a real biker.

[Keen]

I dunno, I think that sym model just looks a bit crap, regardless of whether its a bike or a scooter...

the DNA is DEFINATELY a scooter, the engine is on the swingarm, its a scooter made to look like a bike. That 850 that I've never seen before is an automatic bike if you ask me, its a bike in all other respects, just with an auto gearbox. It looks pretty cool, but I don't see why someone who rides bikes would want one though, changing gear is part of the fun, I think its aimed more at the big scooter rider market who fancy moving up from their boring armchairs-on-wheels
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[synaptyx]

I'd agree that the DNA is a scoot, but it's down to the individuals perception. People that don't know any better have mistaken the DNA for a bike and are quite happy with that definition. You say that you think the Ferro/Babieca is aimed at the big scooter riding crowd, but after those two guys I menioned earlier had finished arguing definitions, I asked them if they'd have one. Both said yes. They're both very experienced bikers. Not arguing for or against, just presenting my experiences and it was only two guys opinions.

[Spiral]

Yeah i would say there a bike, i don't really like the look of these new concept bikes are we really supposed to be riding around on something that looks like it should have been in some sci fi movie in a year or so.

I like this type of concept bike.

This is the ecycle it is a diesel 125 that does 85mph and 0-60 in 8 seconds
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[Keen]

yeah fair enough synaptyx, I can see why someone would want one, maybe if you had to commute through town alot, so you couldn't be arsed with changing gear all the time, but you wanted a bike that was fun out of town as well...... I've got nothing against it at all, I'd just miss changing gear, blipping the throttle on the down change, revving it a little harder than you should now and then all part of the fun... also, you couldn't wheelie an automatic bike.
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"he who makes a beast of himself gets rid of the pain of being a man"- Dr. Johnson

[TheShaggyDA]

Engine on the swing arm doesn't make a bike a scooter, so I don't regard the DNA as one. The best definition of scooter I could find is from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scooter :-

[dainesefreak]

I'd say that it's still a PTW and in that case I wouldn't count it out as a future form of transport. Personally it 's not something I'd be considering at the moment or in the near future however, but as these things become more viable, it can only be good for attracting those who would have never considered a bike before.

Something like the Sym is a great idea, why shouldn't we have access to the technology that is becoming more widely accessable to those in other vehicles?

It would have to be attached to something like the Blade to interest me properly though.

Interesting thread by the way.

[synaptyx]

[McJamweasel]

That Gilera is quite nice, but they seem to be a bit confused with the design. I would of thought that automatics would appeal most to commuters and tourers, and that doesn't look like it would be much good at either.

I think an auto option on (for example) the Honda Pan would sell bucket loads.
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[Kickstart]

Hi

Not keen on either, but then I am not that keen on automatic cars either (and when I do drive one I still tend to use the gearstick to hold it in the lower gears).

Gilera have a long history of making bikes. They have only really been making peds for under 10 years, since Piaggio shut down the traditional Gilera factory and stopped production of their range of bikes.

That Gilera bike is really ugly though. The fairing looks like a prop from the film "The Black Hole".

All the best

Keith
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Traxpics, track day and racing photographs - Bimota Forum - Bike performance / thrust graphs for choosing gearing

[synaptyx]

Yep, I'd agree with that McJam. With both of these bikes being concepts at the minute I think they're just out to prove the technology. Gilera and Sym, need to evaluate the market place before commiting to anything. They'd be wise to speak to as many PTW users as possible. Gilera are in a tight financial position with Piaggio lacking funds so they need to be extra careful.

This is another design concept, this time it's a feet forward from Suzuki. Leaning back towards the scooteresque I think.. It's a fuel injected 1000cc auto in this with an adapted CVT from a burgman 650. It, like the Babieca, has an on-board GPS and computer. I think these guys have been watching too much Anime.

https://www.cyberscooter.it/cx/spec/motorsh_tokyo03/images/suzukibsc211.jpg

[dainesefreak]

[Kickstart]

[synaptyx]

From the web:

"Gilera [are] marrying together their existing 850cc, 90 degree v-twin bike engine and a Suzuki Burgman type CVT automatic gearbox.

However, to general surprise, what we've seen first at the Milan motorcycle show is this engine with an "electronic power-assisted transmission and an automatic clutch" in a rather tasty prototype naked bike, the Gilera Ferro."

[dainesefreak]

I hope they get the thing built sooner than the supersport 600 they're releasing anytime now, or within the next decade, possibly.

[Kickstart]

Hi

That 600 sports bike is dead now, and has been for over a year.

The V twin engine has been designed to be used in various bikes, including a large scooter.

All the best

Keith
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Traxpics, track day and racing photographs - Bimota Forum - Bike performance / thrust graphs for choosing gearing

[Robby]

I like the big gilera thing. I just like auto transmissions, never have liked changing gear in anything, particularly not if I can have something to do it for me.

[Spiral]

[synaptyx]