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Track day race bike for road use?

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Whosthedaddy
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PostPosted: 20:49 - 02 May 2006    Post subject: Track day race bike for road use? Reply with quote
After scouring numerous ads on ebay for a new bike, it has become apparent that there are shit loads of race / track bikes for sale at very tempting prices compared to their road legal brothers.

Is it possible to legally run a race bike on the road?

All bikes come with a V5 documents and therefore a number plate could be attached, add some indicators and bobs your uncle? (I'm presuming that race bikes have brake lights as standard Shifty)

Whats the legal requirements that a bike needs for road use and an MOT?

Bullett wrote:
the alternative is to go balls-deep and just daylight mot it with no front lights atall and only a brake light on the back(tempting)


Would the insurance cripple you for the state of the bie or what the bike is, ie R1 comapred to a race R1? Thinking

A good idea or not?
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ram_doom
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PostPosted: 21:02 - 02 May 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
I believe there is something called a daytime mot... not sure how this works out though Confused

*edit: see your already aware DOH.

Insurance would be tough, and you'd have to replace a few bits for mot's probably tyres, exhaust etc...
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Zimbo
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PostPosted: 21:14 - 02 May 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
Race bikes can be put back on the road - indeed, many are dual purpose!
You'll need road fairings (race bikes tend to come with race fairings and seat units) and be aware that the race bike will probably have ultra - low clipons, rearsets, race exhaust etc. It may also have non - standard (upgraded) brake components etc and almost certainly suspension. It may have had engine work, which would develop more top end power at the expense of low to midrange. Also, oil and coolant bolts / plugs etc will have been lockwired.
I can't see any difference in insurance myself, you insure the model of bike and wouldn't have to declare it was previously a race bike!
Do an HPI check on it before buying to make sure it's not an insurace write off or anything.
Lastly, when you come to sell it the value of the bike will probably still be lower than similar road bikes!
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Whosthedaddy
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PostPosted: 21:15 - 02 May 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
ram_doom wrote:
Insurance would be tough, and you'd have to replace a few bits for mot's probably tyres, exhaust etc...


Arrow Tyres: As long as they have 1mm min tread on them and they are not slicks then they should be fine
Arrow Zorst: How cares most bikers have race cans anyway Wink
Arrow Horn: Thinking
Arrow Inidicators: Do hand signals still count Laughing
Arrow Headlights: What is classified as 'daytime'

Insurance should'nt be that bad apart from when they ask for any non standard modifications and the list starts.....
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Bendy
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PostPosted: 21:16 - 02 May 2006    Post subject: Re: Track day race bike for road use? Reply with quote
Whosthedaddy wrote:
A good idea or not?


'Not', generally. Unless you're going to fit some headlights - running home cos the sun's starting to go down would get on my nerves.
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Whosthedaddy
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PostPosted: 21:24 - 02 May 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
Zimbo wrote:

You'll need road fairings (race bikes tend to come with race fairings and seat units)


Why the need for a different fairing (standard will have cut outs for lights), but you can get headlight covers that make the lights useless anyways?

Bendy wrote:
Unless you're going to fit some headlights - running home cos the sun's starting to go down would get on my nerves


'Whosthedaddy' A.K.A 'Mr Fairweather Biker'

I am limited to when I can ride anyway due to child care arrangements and shift patterns with the missus so I cant ride all the time, so if its gloomy or dusk / dawn it would be Thumbs Down And as for winter Rolling Eyes
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TOM M
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PostPosted: 21:30 - 02 May 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
Whosthedaddy wrote:


you can get headlight covers that make the lights useless anyways?




Cool
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Whosthedaddy
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PostPosted: 21:34 - 02 May 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
TOM M wrote:
Cool


Wink

I could'nt remember which member had the post on them, looked very cool, ever been pulled by the fuzz?

Would painted lights do?
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G
The Voice of Reason



Joined: 02 Feb 2002
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PostPosted: 21:39 - 02 May 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
Whosthedaddy wrote:

Why the need for a different fairing (standard will have cut outs for lights), but you can get headlight covers that make the lights useless anyways?

Most race fairings don't have cut outs for lights.

Race bikes do not have brakes as standard, quite the opposite in fact; would be asking for trouble to show your competitors when you're braking so obviously

Some other things to consider:
Wiring looms may have been cut down.
They may be running on a total loss system, requiring charging after an hour's use if not less.
You should get good suspension, but it may also need a refresh. You will need to re-adjust suspension for your own riding style.
Gearing will probably come lower, with a lighter chain - good for wheelies, though Smile.

I have done it before, not sure I'd do it again for a day to day bike.
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Bendy
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PostPosted: 21:43 - 02 May 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
G wrote:

Race bikes do not have brakes as standard


Bit dangerous, no?
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Kickstart
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PostPosted: 21:45 - 02 May 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
ram_doom wrote:
I believe there is something called a daytime mot... not sure how this works out though Confused


Dubious as to whether there is such a thing. The MOT manual mentions them, but also mentions that only bikes older than (I think) 1931 do not require a headlight (along with a few exemptions for mopeds and the like at different ages). Suspect the MOT testers who issue one are using very selective reading of the manual.

All the best

Keith
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G
The Voice of Reason



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PostPosted: 21:45 - 02 May 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
Thought we were talking speedway Wink.

Ok, that should read no brake lights Smile.
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Whosthedaddy
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PostPosted: 21:45 - 02 May 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
G wrote:
Race bikes do not have brakes as standard, quite the opposite in fact; would be asking for trouble to show your competitors when you're braking so obviously


I thought that most motor sports had brake lights, maybe I was just thinking of F1 and there fog lights Rolling Eyes

G wrote:

Wiring looms may have been cut down.


Making it hard to reconnect inidicators

G wrote:
They may be running on a total loss system, requiring charging after an hour's use if not less.


WTF does that mean, it runs on rechargable AA's
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G
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PostPosted: 21:47 - 02 May 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
Whosthedaddy wrote:

WTF does that mean, it runs on rechargable AA's

Meaning it runs on the recharable battery most bikes come with. Just that it doesn't charge while you're riding.

Majority of basic race bikes don't have this, but plenty still do.
Releases a few horsies.
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Whosthedaddy
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PostPosted: 21:53 - 02 May 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
G wrote:

You should get good suspension, but it may also need a refresh. You will need to re-adjust suspension for your own riding style.


What will a race tuned suspension set up feel like on the road, like a bone shaker or jack hammer on the back?
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Whosthedaddy
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PostPosted: 21:56 - 02 May 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
Kickstart wrote:
Dubious as to whether there is such a thing. The MOT manual mentions them, but also mentions that only bikes older than (I think) 1931 do not require a headlight (along with a few exemptions for mopeds and the like at different ages). Suspect the MOT testers who issue one are using very selective reading of the manual.


Damn it Sad

The MOT with regards to headlights wrote:
This inspection applies to: all machines, except those which have neither front nor rear position lamps, or have such lamps permanently disconnected, painted over or masked that are
. only used during daylight hours, and
. not used at times of seriously reduced visibility

If this situation occurs the vehicle presenter should be issued with an advisory notice recording the above and it should also be recorded on the carbon copy of the VT20.

A motor bicycle first used before 1 January 1931 does not need a headlamp.

A motor bicycle is only required to have a dipped-beam headlamp (but may also have a main beam) if it:
. was first used on or after 1st May 1995 and cannot exceed 30 mph / 50 kph with an engine capacity not exceeding 50cc. or
. was first used before 1 January 1972 and with an engine capacity of less than
50cc.
. any machine having a maximum speed not exceeding 50km/h/30mph


Surely this is a grey area, as they say the same for indicators, the bike may be used during good visisbility and during the day

Quote:
A motor bicycle may be fitted with a
bell.


Laughing Tingalingaling
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Kickstart
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PostPosted: 22:10 - 02 May 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
Whosthedaddy wrote:
Surely this is a grey area, as they say the same for indicators, the bike may be used during good visisbility and during the day


Don't think it is a grey area, just that some people selectively read the manual. As you quoted "A motor bicycle first used before 1 January 1931 does not need a headlamp", which I would read as saying any bike first used after that dat must have a headlight.

You are correct about indicators, except the date is different. Any bike used after the mid 80s must have indicators (with some exceptions, mainly for off road bikes).

All the best

Keith
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G
The Voice of Reason



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PostPosted: 08:27 - 03 May 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
Places do still offer 'daytime' MOTs, whether or not they should.
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Dark
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PostPosted: 10:25 - 03 May 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
I had a ZX7R on a daytime MOT last year and it had no lights on it at all, not even a brake light.

It had a race fairing, no mirrors and rearsets, but apart from that was pretty much standard

I was told that if you had one light on it, a brake light for example, you have to have all the other lights too.
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Whosthedaddy
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PostPosted: 14:58 - 03 May 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
G wrote:
Places do still offer 'daytime' MOTs, whether or not they should.


I sent and recieved the following email to an online MOT web site:

Quote:
yes keith
tommy
----- Original Message -----
From: <admin@ukmot.com>
To: <t.barton@btinternet.com>
Sent: Tuesday, May 02, 2006 10:15 PM
Subject: MOT Queries


> Email: keith@imnotputtingmyemailaddressonhere.co.uk
> Question: Is there such a thing as a daytime MOT for a motorcycle without
> a head light or indicators?
>


Short and to the point, but it seems the answer is YES
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Bendy
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PostPosted: 15:02 - 03 May 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
While I'm not sure if it's a requirement or not, I'd certainly want to stick a brake light on the back for my own peace of mind.
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Whosthedaddy
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PostPosted: 15:02 - 03 May 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
Dark wrote:
I had a ZX7R on a daytime MOT last year and it had no lights on it at all, not even a brake light.

It had a race fairing, no mirrors and rearsets, but apart from that was pretty much standard


I believe that mirrors are not a standard requirement just pretty helpfull on an everyday use.

I think before I consider it further probably worth taliking to the local MOT centre that would be issuing me with the actual certificate, if they're happy then so am I Wink If not shop around for another MOT centre Shifty
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Whosthedaddy
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PostPosted: 15:05 - 03 May 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
Bendy wrote:
While I'm not sure if it's a requirement or not, I'd certainly want to stick a brake light on the back for my own peace of mind.


Probably a good idea other wise cars and bikes behind will try and be my pillion passengers if they aren't careful Laughing

If a brake light is fitted it has to work from both the hand and the foot controls, not one or other as it used to be.
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Gazdaman
I did a trackday!!!



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PostPosted: 15:29 - 03 May 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
Banjo bolts with pressure switches in are your friend. As obviously most racign rearsets don't have the option for a brake light switch.

I looked into daytime MOTs recently, you just have to exploit quite a few different loopholes.

Best way would just be to chat to the tester, see what he'll allow.

Gaz
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Barry_M2
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PostPosted: 15:34 - 03 May 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
Gazdaman wrote:
Banjo bolts with pressure switches in are your friend. As obviously most racign rearsets don't have the option for a brake light switch.


Hay? Say again!

Banjo bolts with pressure switches? Where can I get one of these puppies? Thumbs Up Very Happy
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