The value of life.

Irezumi aka Reuben · Carrot Top Joined: 28 Sep 2004 Karma :

I realise you cant put a price on a life and even though it's an accident some more responsibility has to be taken here. Apparently the more people you kill the less each life is worth.

https://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/5241798.stm

There was black ice involved so it is an accident, but your meant to drive taking this into account, why was his licence not even taken away?
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Mr.Everready · World Chat Champion Joined: 28 Mar 2003 Karma :

How can you take the black ice into account when your driving ?
Thats the whole point, you don't know it's there until it's too late.
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byke95 · World Chat Champion Joined: 25 Mar 2004 Karma :

It's difficult to take action agains black ice, as pretty much the only fool proof action is to not drive.

G · The Voice of Reason Joined: 02 Feb 2002 Karma :

As has been mentioned, the whole point of black ice is that you don't notice it before hand. As it was 'fine' weather, I wouldn't expect the average road user would to put a lot of effort into looking out for ice specifically.

Accidents do happen.

Though I got fined £400 for a solitary defective tyre - also not the cause of the accident.
I did plead guilty allthough I later found the police had evidence to suggest I wasn't guilty.

sickpup · Old Timer Joined: 21 Apr 2004 Karma :

Louise · World Chat Champion Joined: 22 May 2006 Karma :

Irezumi aka Reuben · Carrot Top Joined: 28 Sep 2004 Karma :

Dont think he should be imprisoned but he has clearly proven that he is a danger to other road users as he failed to take into account the conditions. You can get a ban for doing 30mph over the speed limit, so why only a fine and some points for killing 4 people?
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G · The Voice of Reason Joined: 02 Feb 2002 Karma :

syl · World Chat Champion Joined: 05 Dec 2005 Karma :

Rejimbo · Renault 5 Driver Joined: 13 Aug 2004 Karma :

I don't see where they've come to the conclusion that three defective tyres haven't contributed to the accident involving ice??If he's been prosecuted for them it means they are deemed unsafe to be use on the road, add this to the ice and something was bound to happen.
Surely he can be charged with causing death by dangerous driving?

McJamweasel · BCF Junkie Joined: 22 Mar 2002 Karma :

colin1 · Captain Safety Joined: 17 Feb 2005 Karma :

he lost control and was going to fast for the conditions
the tyres being low tread depth is irrelevant as there wasnt liquid water on the road

Its a judgement as to whether he was driving dangerously or if you can just say it was a no fault accident.

Not sure how you would draw the line as Im sure some people would have been more cautious on the road.

I nearly lost the back end of my bike once on black ice, but I was going fairly slowly (cautious due to the conditions). Less cautious people would have crashed and more cautious people wdnt have nearly lost control at all.

Not sure how you can legislate an appropriate level of cautiousness.

I suspect they couldnt prove blame as it would have to be beyond reasonable doubt, so i suspect that on the balance of probabilities he was at fault. Not sure what his punishment should be, but a driving ban would be a start.

I think an automatic driving ban for anyone who kills anyone would be a good start. It would protect the rest of us.

I suspect drivers who kill are far more likely to kill again than homicidal nutters with kitchen knives.
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RickHolt · Traffic Copper Joined: 17 Mar 2004 Karma :

I was thinking about accidents the other month when that boxer got sent to jail. Should the outcome of a crash affect the punishment? If you do something really stupid like that boxer and pull out to overtake and hit an oncoming vehicle, should it make any difference if the people in the other car die or not? You committed exactly the same crime/made the same mistake no matter what happens. In the boxers case, he could have pulled out, hit no one, and carried on his way. If he was spotted doing that, would he be punished the same as if he hit a car and killed the family inside?

Rick.

plugger147 · World Chat Champion Joined: 13 Mar 2005 Karma :

It's to difficult to judge on the outcome as there are to many factors involved. The victim/victims would then all have to be judged too,i.e: if the cyclists had all been riding single file would they all have died.

What I can't understand is if he had 3 dodgy tyre's why did he only have 6 point's. Confused

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Kickstart · The Oracle Joined: 04 Feb 2002 Karma :

Kwaks · I'm not a fast rider Joined: 28 Jan 2006 Karma :

The Police and Court have accepted it was a tragic accident, the conditions were deceptive and the driver would reasonably not expected ice (as the cyclists didnt otherwise they prob wouldnt have been out).

The fine and points are for an unrelated matter, which would not have been reported if this case wasn't so tragic.
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colin1 · Captain Safety Joined: 17 Feb 2005 Karma :