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Can someone explain the pros and cons of current Processors?

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400bandit
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PostPosted: 23:21 - 06 Sep 2006    Post subject: Can someone explain the pros and cons of current Processors? Reply with quote

Hey all, I'm looking to buy a laptop soon (desktop replacement) and am getting a little confused with all the current laptop processors. If there is anybody out there that could kindly describe current models? (only roughly...) Unitl now I have always stuck with Intel products but can't help feeling that AMD may be a better alternative?
I don't have bundels to spend on the laptop though. I was looking to buy somehting with a Core Duo but I can only really afford the 1.6ghz unit. This seems a little low but how would this compare to say a pentium 4? (thats what I'm currently running in my desktop)
Sorry to sound like a computer noob but I'm not as bad as I sound, I just normally stick to Desktop PCs
My Budget for the laptop has to be no more than £650 (times are tight Crying or Very sad ) Any info would be greatly received and also any offers of decent laptops would be of interest Laughing
Joe
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stevehsenior
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PostPosted: 23:44 - 06 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi, from experience, AMDs are generally cheaper than Intel; this usually reflects in the overall price. AMDs are better at multi-tasking, and tend to run cooler.
Make sure the laptop processor is designed for mobile use,(Centrino for Intel and Sempron Mobile for AMD are two examples.) and hasn't just been fitted as a cheap alternative.
As always, ask yourself "What am I using it for" and work from that basis; don't buy what you don't need.
HTH
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DucatiEVO
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PostPosted: 23:50 - 06 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

Core Duo and Core 2 Duo is a newer design and hence slaps a P4 for breakfast, even though it's clocked slower. Thumbs Up

Amd used to be the better performance choice until the above came out recently!

Very Happy
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400bandit
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PostPosted: 23:55 - 06 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK, thanks for all the replies. I will be using it for a fairly wide range of tasks, I'm about to start a Computer Systems Engineering Degree (see I told you I'm not a complete noob Laughing ) And then also my own interests, a little Flash, Fireworks and soon DreamWeaver, Music and playing my guitar through it (using a GuitarPort - a completly under rated bit of kit)
Here's a pretty good deal IMO https://cgi.ebay.co.uk/NEW-DELL-INSPIRON-6400-LAPTOP-1-6-GHz-DVD-1024MB-RAM_W0QQitemZ230024557926QQihZ013QQcategoryZ177QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItem What do you think? it's a good price and I could collect and may be able to tempt him with cash at a lower price Cool Laughing
Thanks again, Joe
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Bigeds
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PostPosted: 09:27 - 07 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you look on Dells website you can buy this laptop for £549 inc VAT and Delivery Exclamation

The hard disk is only 60Gb rather than 80Gb but you get a DVD Writer rather than an CDRW/DVD-ROM

Smaller disk but can burn DVD's, direct from Dell, cheaper. I know which one I'd go for. Very Happy

I've attached a pdf of the basket, showing the full spec.

Ed
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DevilWAH
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PostPosted: 10:49 - 07 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

ah the old AMD / intel debate!!!

IT all depends what you want.

In simple terms it works something like this.

AMD processors run at a "slower speed", (this means they proform fewer cycles per second. )

However they do more work per clock cycle.

The way to look at it is the old man walking becide a child.
Man being the AMD chip and child the Intel chip.

Both cover the same distence in the same time. but man takes slow long steps. and child takes fast short steps.

Waht this means in the real world. is that for simple number crunching tasks (video editing, compressing files, Data base serching) intel are a faster chip. but for multi media and games the AMD can be better.

Now the best AMD and the CORE DUO are about eaqul for all real world applications.
Unless you are seriously in to proformance then you wont really notice a difference.

At the lower end of the market AMD still are better price proformance. The core duoes only start to show a proformance advantage when you are buying the toprange proccessors and this is when you are spening £350+ just for the processor!!!!
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DucatiEVO
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PostPosted: 11:57 - 07 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've been debating the CPU brand (AMD/Intel etc) wars ever since I used my Opus Technology 8086/10Mhz (NEC V20 processor) Wink

I was an AMD man (current is AMD 2600+ - no rush to upgrade), but now I've seen what the new Core 2 Duo can do, and at a good price for the power (sub £140) I know what my next PC will be based on! Thumbs Up
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Spoonman
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PostPosted: 12:40 - 07 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

first - if you want a computer to last - don't get a dell! sony, toshiba, or ibm - and preferably sony or IBM - although you'll pay bucks for either.

sony lead the way for media - best displays this side of an apple mac and top notch hardware to boot.

toshiba and IBM are the most durable so if it's gonna be getting bashed about, they're the way to go.

in a laptop you either want, as already said;

-centrino core duo (have they released the mobile core 2duo yet?*)
or
-sempron mobile

*if they have then get it - best by miles!! other two are about even

as has also already been mentioned;

up until the release of the intel core 2duo processor, AMD has been top dog for everything except media encoding - however, the new processor has turned that on it's ear now and intel are once again king of all(and i am by no means an intel fanboy!).

so, if you have to buy now - then stop reading here! if you can afford to wait a while read on.


now - the "state of the market" bit that you weren't expecting:

- DON'T BUY ANYTHING FOR THE NEXT 6 MONTHS unless you really have to!!

why?
because after an 18 month state of stability in the computer hardware industry, we are now at the start of a fresh battle between AMD and INTEL, and NVIDIA and ATI.

for the next 6 months or so, we are going to see market models becoming outdated within weeks of hitting the shelves as the titans battle it out.

there's a whole new wave of motherboards on the way in with all new and improved bells and whistles.

graphics are getting a revamp with the impending arrival of directX10 - meaning new graphics processors are en route

software to make full use of multicore systems is still in it's infancy and needs time to be developed to a stable working state hence there are going to be multitudes or updates and revisions flying around.

now these battles never hit laptops as much as PC's but the point is that if you can afford to hang on for a few months you are going to see a dramatic shift in the pricing and quality of what is currently top notch hardware.

now i know someone is going to come on here in a bit and say that that's always the case and that there's no point in waiting but for the uber geeks among us (as this will probably go over your head but anyways) - how long has the ASUS A8N-sli series mobo been top dog for socket 939?? - the market does and will stabilise and the man who can afford to hang on until it does will get a better deal.
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DevilWAH
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PostPosted: 14:09 - 07 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

why the hell would you want a sempron mobile ?? (its the lowest of the mobile CPU range they do!! what about the duel core 64bit turions??
there are far better amd mobile chips out than that.

Also the low/mid range core duo's and the equilivent AMD chips are almost exact match for price/proformance. even up to about £300 you get the same proformance for the same price at the moment.
Its only when you start going to the £400+ that the core duo's leave the AMD chips behind.

Also, no the market will never stablise. next year AMD will be bringing out there quad core CPU's that look like they will walk all over the Core duo's.(and they are already looking at 8 core versions) AMD are going to bring out yet another socket for there CPU's (939 socket is old now, M2 is the current socket)

You have physic cards comming on the sceen. which will not be mainstream for at least another year.

So i would say dont wait.
do a bit of reserch on the current technology on offer. then set a price and go for it.

Like i say unless you do a lot of extreem processor intensive tasks, there is no point in spending lots of money!
I have 4 PC's at home.

1 is a duel 3.8ghz processor 4 gig of ram, 1Tbyte drive space etc etc... server

A 4ghz amd system with 2 gig of ram, and 6800gs graphic card..

A 2.5 ghz amd 4 year old system,

And a 1.7ghz laptop.

for doing web browsering and office stuff there is not a lot of difference between any of them.
And when it comes to game's both the desktops can handle most of the games on the market and run them at resonable specs.

As you say you can affor a 1.6ghz system, then i would get one now. other wise you will be constantly waiting for the latest technology on the market to fall in price so you can get it.

Yes DirectX 10 graphics cards will be comming out early next year. but it will not be untill the end of the year/year after that they will have fallen in price to be resonable to get.
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Bigeds
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PostPosted: 14:11 - 07 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

A year or two? Smile

Can't agree with the moan about Dell. As with so many things its all down to your own personal experience and no doubt friends and aquaintances etc. My experience of buying Dells for the company I work for over the last 5 years is that they are very reliable. Thats Desktops, laptops and the PowerEdge Server range.

We have had senior execs insiting on having Sony but they have then had all sorts of problems with them. Mind you isn't that the way. Gotta have what they percieve to be top dog, don't understand what they are doing and cause havock with the hardware and software.

I also see that Dell are saying its the Sony manufactured cells in their laptop batteries that are causing the problem that has resulted in their battery replacement programme Smile

Back on track...don't believe 400Bandit can wait 6 months, then again if you can you might as well say hang on a bit longer for Vista Evil or Very Mad
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400bandit
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PostPosted: 14:26 - 07 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for all the input, much appreciated. I'm not a real gammer so I think some of the specs that have been discussed may be a little bit of over kill for my needs. I found this laptop on e-Bay https://cgi.ebay.co.uk/NEW-ACER-5102WLMi-DUALCORE-GAMING-laptop-12-Mths-Warty_W0QQitemZ330026091501QQihZ014QQcategoryZ177QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem Seems quite a good deal? I know I'm going to get shouted at now because it's a Accer but I really cant afford to go Sony and the like. I just feel that Accer and Dell offer more for the money? + I recently had a play around on a friends newly purchased Sony (cost near to £1000!) and I was not impressed, seemed to take an age to load and even when it did finally load it wasn't all that (well not for the money)
Thanks again, Joe
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Rookie
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PostPosted: 14:36 - 07 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd go for Dell over Acer. I got an Acer, and it leaves something to be desired to be honest. The screen is abysmal. It's 1 year old. I have a 6 year old Toshiba laptop, and the screen on that is considerably better.
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Spoonman
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PostPosted: 15:00 - 07 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

DevilWAH wrote:
why the hell would you want a sempron mobile ?? (its the lowest of the mobile CPU range they do!! what about the duel core 64bit turions??
there are far better amd mobile chips out than that.


fair point!

DevilWAH wrote:

Also, no the market will never stablise. next year AMD will be bringing out there quad core CPU's that look like they will walk all over the Core duo's.(and they are already looking at 8 core versions) AMD are going to bring out yet another socket for there CPU's (939 socket is old now, M2 is the current socket)


i'm aware that the M2 is the new socket. the point i was making was that the 939 was used for a year and a half and is still supported - i'm not saying it's going to be around forever but look at what happened to the socket 754, it was in general use for no more than 4 months(still used in some server apps maybe)!! and then dropped - and as you've pointed out, it's looking like the M2 is going that way as well. - not that any of this affects laptops. but the point is that the market does stabilise and when it does it the best time to buy if you're in the position to do so.

i've been building custom machines for 7 years now (think along the lines of falcon or alienware only better) and this is something that i have observed.

also, Intel have a quad core rumoured for release in 8 months as well as plans in the pipe for a 16x16 matrix core processor.

DevilWAH wrote:

So i would say dont wait.
do a bit of reserch on the current technology on offer. then set a price and go for it.

...for doing web browsering and office stuff there is not a lot of difference between any of them.
And when it comes to game's both can handle most of the games on the market and run them at resonable specs....


this is also true - if it's only simpler applications you're running then it really doesn't matter what you get.

DevilWAH wrote:

Yes DirectX 10 graphics cards will be comming out early next year. but it will not be untill the end of the year/year after that they will have fallen in price to be resonable to get.


this bit i don't agree with - just look at how quickly prices fell the DX9c cards... 6800, 7200,7600,7900 all went from €450-ish to the €230-ish mark in a matter of weeks and that's just the nVidia side. ATI's X700, X800, X850 dropped just as quickly and even now the X1300, X1600 cards are dropping all the time... so years is too long of a timescale.

bottom line on the market thing i think is that it's really a matter of opinion as to wether you should by or not and in fairness, i suppose it only really affects the top notch gear. when i started building machines first i thought the market never stabilised either but it has done several times now.

however, if it's only a middle range machine you're after then it really doesn't matter either way as they're all really quite similar performance wise.
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Spoonman
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PostPosted: 15:02 - 07 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

the one thing i will grant dell over the others is that their business support is excellent. i work in the electronics department in trinity college and everytime something has failed (and they do) we've had either a tech out or the part shipped within 48 hours.

but i still think that sony, IBM and toshiba are just better built machines.
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DevilWAH
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PostPosted: 16:51 - 07 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spoonman wrote:


however, if it's only a middle range machine you're after then it really doesn't matter either way as they're all really quite similar performance wise.


Sorry i think this was the point i was trying to make.
If you are not sure what you really need. then there is no point in arguing over the benifits of intel/AMD.

You are unlickly to be wanting to spend the money to get a real top of the range system. and as long as you shop around either system is going to be fine. and workj at much the same level

However if you really want to buy the latest system for a specific reson (be it games or video editing or such) and spend a lot of money. Then you are most lickely to know whats, what in the current manafactures wars, and will be able to decided exactly what you want to wait for. and waht part of the system is important to you.
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