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Smack/crack addicts

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Give 'em free dope?
Yep, give it to them free
62%
 62%  [ 18 ]
Nope, we should carry on as we are
37%
 37%  [ 11 ]
Total Votes : 29

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killa
Won't Shut Up



Joined: 18 Oct 2004
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PostPosted: 11:26 - 15 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
Annabella wrote:
Actually, I think you may be wrong... I don't have access to crime figures but I do have access to those in treatment and those who are referred by the police (in relation to crime) so an interesting point that I would like to find out!


One thing you missed though is that not all of them are going to be murderers which is the point he was trying to make.
Remember taking drugs is illegal to and so is dealing, along with a whole load of other drug related crimes which don't involve killing someone.
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Annabella
Like a person, only smaller



Joined: 03 Feb 2002
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PostPosted: 11:39 - 15 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
killa wrote:

One thing you missed though is that not all of them are going to be murderers which is the point he was trying to make.
Remember taking drugs is illegal to and so is dealing, along with a whole load of other drug related crimes which don't involve killing someone.


I wasn't writing in reference to Mister James' or JonB's statements, I was getting distracted by non-related interesting facts Smile sorry.



However on that matter, I think one lone drug addict can commmit more crimes than a lone psychotic killer, with the drug addicts problem being easier to rectify (I'm not saying it's easy to 'cure' an addiction, but it is certainly easier and cheaper to treat). Therefore offering treatment and support to drug addicts is seen as a way of offering rehabilitation and allowing them to enter back into society.

A murderous sick paedophile is never likely to be 'cured' and that is why people are more willing to allow a murderer to die than a junkie.
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JonB
Afraid of Mileage



Joined: 03 Jun 2004
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PostPosted: 11:46 - 15 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
killa wrote:


I'm probably also correct in saying most of the drug related crimes are carried out by foreigners and black people.
But i'm just generalising there, as are you. Wink Thumbs Up

Probably not actually as that is area specific and you didn't say what level in the drugs ladder we are at.

Most drug dealers at the end of the drugs chain of a small rural Somerset town like mine are mostly early 20's white males.

Look at the bigger picture with the cartels and Jamaican "Yardies" then I guess you could have a point.
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Mister James
I want to believe!



Joined: 10 Aug 2004
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PostPosted: 23:13 - 15 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
Burglary is overwhelmingly carried out because of the need to bankroll a drug habit, and it is equally overwhelmingly carried out by white people.

Quote:

A stealing junkie may piss a fair few people off, but robbery is something you get very pissed off about. Though its not likely to deeply affect you for the rest of your life.


I was referring to burglary rather than robbery - where someone breaks into your house and nicks all your kit. I think you'll find that most people find that quite violating and traumatising, especially the elderly or vulnerable who no longer feel safe in their home. While I made no attempt to compare the impact of a single such crime to the family of a murder victim, I think you'll find that dozens or even hundreds of these crimes can be committed by each junkie every year - that's a whole lot of rage/grief/violation/fear/trauma.

Robbery - the removal of your personal belongings by the threat or use of force - is equally upsetting, because once again it renders you impotent to defend yourself somewhere you believed yourself to be safe. Again, this can be very traumatising and have long-lasting effects.
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Mister James
I want to believe!



Joined: 10 Aug 2004
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PostPosted: 23:14 - 15 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
killa wrote:
innominate wrote:
Thats just retarded


No, that's just Mr James Sorry, i had to


Oh my, you are a funny little fellow aren't you?
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NinjaBoy
Scooby Slapper



Joined: 13 Aug 2006
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PostPosted: 10:07 - 16 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
Problem is, if you give it to them free of charge, somewhere along the line they'll stockpile this stuff inside they're crappy jackets and start dealing. This will lead to debts, people getting "visits" and teeth getting kicked out until money is payed.

Circulating problem!! Good idea though Thumbs Up
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gadfium
Trackday Trickster



Joined: 30 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: 18:56 - 16 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
NinjaBoy wrote:
Problem is, if you give it to them free of charge, somewhere along the line they'll stockpile this stuff inside they're crappy jackets and start dealing. This will lead to debts, people getting "visits" and teeth getting kicked out until money is payed.

Circulating problem!! Good idea though Thumbs Up


By giving it away free there is little point in people dealing! Why buy when you can get it free????
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edd
Nearly there...



Joined: 06 Jul 2005
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PostPosted: 11:33 - 22 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
dragonfly wrote:
I dont think serious hard drugs such as herion,speed,E etc should be legalized. Hash yes maybe.
I really can't believe that you would put speed and E's in the same group as heroin.

There are plenty of people in the UK who take drugs and arent a mess, keep up a good job. E's are a drug I've never understood the classing system for, they arent addictive, they dont make you violent (in fact the opposite) and very few people have ever died as a result of taking them. This number would be much lower if pills were standardised and you knew what you were taking, and also knew that the drug labs hadnt got it wrong and created PMA or something. I'm absolutely sure that no-one has ever gone out and robbed a granny so that they can get some pills, they probably have a less detrimental effect on society than cannabis, ciggarettes or alcohol. Speed is one of the most unpure drugs in the UK, which causes a great deal of its problems, its also (IMO) horrible and not worth talking about, but it still certainly isnt heroin. Cannabis should have been legalised years ago, for much the same reasons, (ie: it affects no-one else, since its not physically addictive, wont make you go out and rob people, and doesnt make you violent. The majority of smackheads say that they started with cannabis, It is a so called "gateway drug" If the smackheads hadnt been buying their weed from the same person (or kind of people) who were supplying heroin, they more than likely wouldn't be smackheads now. I think all drugs should be legalised, as this gives control back to the authorities, stops the drug trade funding organised crime, and stops smack users robbing old grannies for their next hit.
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Dragonfly
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Joined: 05 Sep 2005
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PostPosted: 19:03 - 22 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
Suppose your right there about the E's just i seen alot of people messed up over them. Have been there and done it myself. Its a good point legalizing it all but would that not encourage more to take drugs then?
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edd
Nearly there...



Joined: 06 Jul 2005
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PostPosted: 00:05 - 23 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
I really dont think it will. Very few of my friends smoke, but fags are legal. I think legalising would probably mean less people would take drugs. Chavs wouldnt buy them purely for the "gangsta" value.
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octane
Trackday Trickster



Joined: 24 Aug 2004
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PostPosted: 19:13 - 23 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
I used to be all for legalising/treatment, then I lived above a smack head for 9 months.

After 9 months he was moved to a mental health unit at the local hospital. When I heard he commited suicide there, I smiled broadly.

Parasite cunt was the bane of my life for 9 months.
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Ste
Not Work Safe



Joined: 01 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: 22:09 - 23 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
dragonfly wrote:
Have been there and done it myself. Its a good point legalizing it all but would that not encourage more to take drugs then?

Being illegal doesn't work as a deterrent for lots of people so when's it time to try a different approach?
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Dragonfly
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Joined: 05 Sep 2005
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PostPosted: 19:42 - 24 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
Ste wrote:
dragonfly wrote:
Have been there and done it myself. Its a good point legalizing it all but would that not encourage more to take drugs then?

Being illegal doesn't work as a deterrent for lots of people so when's it time to try a different approach?


Would make it harder for them to get when its illegal, would hate to think some 12 year old could gettheir hands on it that easy if it where legal. Measures would need to be brought in. But you dont know until you try these things (not the drugs).
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edd
Nearly there...



Joined: 06 Jul 2005
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PostPosted: 21:55 - 24 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
Loads of young kids are already into drugs, being illegal makes kids able to get thier hands on drugs much easier, because the poeple supplying them have no responsibility whatsoever. When I left school there were several kids in year 7/8 who regularly used to smoke weed on our school bus. No-one gave a shit really.
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Ste
Not Work Safe



Joined: 01 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: 23:16 - 24 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
dragonfly wrote:
Would make it harder for them to get when its illegal, would hate to think some 12 year old could gettheir hands on it that easy if it where legal. Measures would need to be brought in. But you dont know until you try these things (not the drugs).

Agree it would make getting hold of them easier but as people generally can already get drugs without too much hassle I don't think that's a very valid point. It would also mean what people are getting hold of is what they're wanting rather than other drugs/chemicals/shit and that's got to be a big advantage.

12 year olds wouldn't be able to buy anything, kinda assumed that this was being talked about as something for over 18. Strict ID requirements, harsh penalties for anywhere found serving underage people, good control over licensing premises to mean they're not too freely available and are being dealt by (vaguelly) responsible people/ companies would all help.

The more you tell people that they can't have something, the more they want it. Since people are able to get hold of said drug(s) anyway, the only changes would be the market and drugs being controlled by someone other than criminal gangs which has got to be good for Joe Public.
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SoND
World Chat Champion



Joined: 10 Jul 2005
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PostPosted: 23:39 - 24 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
dragonfly wrote:
Would make it harder for them to get when its illegal, would hate to think some 12 year old could gettheir hands on it that easy if it where legal. Measures would need to be brought in. But you dont know until you try these things (not the drugs).


Being illegal wont really stop anyone from taking them if they wanted to in the first place and all it is doing is forcing the market into the hands of criminals with no regulation to how the drugs are produced.

If they started legalising things then people could finally start to get purer, clean drugs which would be safer than the filth that is available at the minute.

The governments entire approach to education is going the wrong way. All they do is tell people that they'll get addicted, it could kill them and they could be sent to prison if they dare to take them. No one listens to that. It would be better to be more down to earth and face it that telling people not to do it wont work. They need to explain about the safest way to take things and what to do if things do go tits up.
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Itchy
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Joined: 07 Apr 2005
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PostPosted: 08:10 - 25 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
do what they do in Holland , if you want heroin you can get it from the semi national health (you need medical insurance in Holland and there are still waiting lists) , you just have to use it there and then and are not allowed to take it and the gear to use it off site.

they are nick named shooting galleries.
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Dragonfly
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Joined: 05 Sep 2005
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PostPosted: 09:35 - 25 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote
Note i didnt say it would stop people from taking them if they where illegal.

Good point ste that was what i was looking for.

In Holland its cool though there are a few dodgy streets with herion addicts and people selling drugs down them but there are no young ones about them streets i noticed. Last time i was there i didnt see druggies all over the place i saw happy people (or maybe that was the drugs) Thinking
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