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Why do big V-twins eat tyres??

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david916
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PostPosted: 10:34 - 22 Nov 2006    Post subject: Why do big V-twins eat tyres?? Reply with quote

My SV1000S needed a new rear Michelin Pilot Sport at only 3869 miles and it needed a new front Michelin Pilot Sport at 5386 miles. It will need another rear when it goes in for its 7500 mile service next week as that is now at the wear limit (after around only 3600 miles use). I had heard previously (and the chap at the bike shop mentioned it too) that big V-twins do go through tyres quite quickly. However, can anyone tell me, in easy to understand terms, why big V-twins eat tyres more than other bikes - something about the power delivery? I realise that I could change to another type of tyre or make, but I quite like the feel and grip of the original spec Michelin Pilot Sports!
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Last edited by david916 on 10:49 - 22 Nov 2006; edited 1 time in total
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Suzuki
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PostPosted: 10:40 - 22 Nov 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's a normal amount of miles for that type of tyre.
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joe black
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PostPosted: 10:47 - 22 Nov 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

i think thats quite good , 3000mls rear my gsxr1100 streetfighter dunlop 207.
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P4LERIDER
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PostPosted: 11:38 - 22 Nov 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

to be fair that's not bad milage... i certainly wouldn't be unhappy with that.

It's said that big twins munch through tyres quickly because of the fat torque they put down... same thing with most 'big bikes' really Smile
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landy.s11a
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PostPosted: 11:39 - 22 Nov 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

agree with all above you did well getting that amount of mileage out of your rear Thumbs Up
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Keen
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PostPosted: 11:48 - 22 Nov 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Currently own/regularly ride :
Suzuki SV1000S K4, BMW R1150RT, Kawasaki ZX-10R, Kawasaki ER-6n, KTM 990 Super Duke, Suzuki GSX-R600 K6, Triumph 955i Daytona


mate, you own all those bikes or somehow have access to them? you bastard.

I don't think you should be surprised with that tyre milage. If you use the bike alot, switch to sports touring tyres. They grip nearly as well but last shit loads longer. I keep saying it but continental road attacks are great, done 4000 miles on mine and they still have alot of life left and grip has never been an issue, good enough to scrape the pegs Thumbs Up
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Pete.
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PostPosted: 11:51 - 22 Nov 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

Big V-twins have huge low-down torque where inline-4 engines lack it. This is what chews up your tyres.
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extreme3d
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PostPosted: 12:20 - 22 Nov 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

Geri wrote:
Big V-twins have huge low-down torque where inline-4 engines lack it. This is what chews up your tyres.


Not really, a 1lt IL4 like a GSXR1000 has the same torque low down as a 1lt V-twin. You just don't notice it on an IL4 as the top end power is even more, which gives the illusion there is less down below. V's simply have a flatter powerband which makes them much more useable and predictable, so they are essentially a lot easier to thrash.

V' have other advantages which are more to do with geometry of the bike over an IL4, but power is not one of them Wink
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finpos
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PostPosted: 12:33 - 22 Nov 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

big singles, twins = longer stroke = more low end torque.

finpos.
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extreme3d
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PostPosted: 12:43 - 22 Nov 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

finpos wrote:
big singles, twins = longer stroke = more low end torque.

finpos.


G has already posted numerous posts (with graphs) showing how the 1lt IL4's have the same torque low down as 1lt V's. I wish it wasn't the case as I ride a V'twin but there it is Wink
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Dan 4RR
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PostPosted: 12:54 - 22 Nov 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

I assume motorbikes go through tyres at a quicker rate than cars because of the power at the rear? Embarassed
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dainesefreak
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PostPosted: 13:00 - 22 Nov 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would say that a 1000 - 1500 is heavyish tyre wear and anything over 3000 miles is a bargain.

On a seperate note, what do you think of the Super Duke? Wink
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finpos
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PostPosted: 13:16 - 22 Nov 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

extreme3d wrote:
finpos wrote:
big singles, twins = longer stroke = more low end torque.

finpos.


G has already posted numerous posts (with graphs) showing how the 1lt IL4's have the same torque low down as 1lt V's. I wish it wasn't the case as I ride a V'twin but there it is Wink


Damn his scientific approach Smile

finpos.
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Ranger05
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PostPosted: 13:17 - 22 Nov 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

My old bike, gixxer 600 eat up a rear every thousand miles. Bridgestone BT012's

That was without even doing anything stupid like burnouts etc. Just fast road riding.
3000+ miles is pretty good.
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sickpup
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PostPosted: 13:27 - 22 Nov 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

extreme3d wrote:


G has already posted numerous posts (with graphs) showing how the 1lt IL4's have the same torque low down as 1lt V's. I wish it wasn't the case as I ride a V'twin but there it is Wink


V-twins have more torque per bang then. Razz
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MarJay
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PostPosted: 14:23 - 22 Nov 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually a four should shred the tyre more than a twin, because the power is continuous on a four, meaning that it is more likely to break traction.

Twins usually deliver their power in one short lump before having a longer time with no power. This gives the tyre time to 'recover'.

Or so MotoGP engineers think. This is why 'Big Bang' engines were invented!
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G
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PostPosted: 14:41 - 22 Nov 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

MarJay wrote:

Twins usually deliver their power in one short lump before having a longer time with no power. This gives the tyre time to 'recover'.

It could be that the lump with more power may make the tyre work hard.

However I'd suggest peak power and it's use is what tends to shred tyres - as the more powerful bikes can get through tyres even quicker than the above.

3d wrote:

Not really, a 1lt IL4 like a GSXR1000 has the same torque low down as a 1lt V-twin. You just don't notice it on an IL4 as the top end power is even more, which gives the illusion there is less down below. V's simply have a flatter powerband which makes them much more useable and predictable, so they are essentially a lot easier to thrash.

Well, at least I half agree with you Wink.
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sickpup
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PostPosted: 15:30 - 22 Nov 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

MarJay wrote:
Actually a four should shred the tyre more than a twin, because the power is continuous on a four, meaning that it is more likely to break traction.


I think you have this the wrong way around.

If I hit you once a second for 4 seconds using a quarter of my strength you will probably be ok. If I hit you twice in 1.5 seconds using half of my strength each time you will probably fall over. See what I mean?

Not a threat just the best analogy I could come up with.
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Captain Caveman
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PostPosted: 16:06 - 22 Nov 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

sickpup wrote:
If I hit you once a second for 4 seconds using a quarter of my strength you will probably be ok. If I hit you twice in 1.5 seconds using half of my strength each time you will probably fall over. See what I mean?

Not a threat just the best analogy I could come up with.


For scientific reasons this should be tried recorded and posted up her for us to laugh at.

PS: You been watching to much Jack Ass!!
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Grubby
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PostPosted: 16:11 - 22 Nov 2006    Post subject: Re: Why do big V-twins eat tyres?? Reply with quote

david916 wrote:
My SV1000S needed a new rear Michelin Pilot Sport at only 3869 miles and it needed a new front Michelin Pilot Sport at 5386 miles. It will need another rear when it goes in for its 7500 mile service next week as that is now at the wear limit (after around only 3600 miles use).

You think that's bad, you should see how far I can get out of my Busa's tyres. I have to replace them both at the same time too as the braking forces involved with a lardy arsed bike like that chew the shit outta the front tyre.
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Keen
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PostPosted: 16:44 - 22 Nov 2006    Post subject: Re: Why do big V-twins eat tyres?? Reply with quote

Grubby wrote:

You think that's bad, you should see how far I can get out of my Busa's tyres.


I'm curious, how long do they last?
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Cillit-BANG
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PostPosted: 17:31 - 22 Nov 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
If I hit you once a second for 4 seconds using a quarter of my strength you will probably be ok. If I hit you twice in 1.5 seconds using half of my strength each time you will probably fall over. See what I mean?


It's not the strength/power though that is the issue, it's the wear of the tyre. To keep with your thinking; If you were to put a rubber strip on your boxing gloves, and punch a wall in the two methods you describe, you will wear the rubber strip down quicker with the frequent yet softer punches.

Marjay is right with this, the Inline 4 big-bang engine is designed to give bigger pulses of power less frequently to give the tyre more chance at traction.

How this affects tyre life I don't know Thumbs Up
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MarJay
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PostPosted: 18:22 - 22 Nov 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

sickpup wrote:


I think you have this the wrong way around.

If I hit you once a second for 4 seconds using a quarter of my strength you will probably be ok. If I hit you twice in 1.5 seconds using half of my strength each time you will probably fall over. See what I mean?

Not a threat just the best analogy I could come up with.


Like the analogy! Smile

Yeah I did think of that after I had posted...

Tis funny you use that analogy cos in Wing Chun kung fu, you hit as fast as you can as many times as you can. The idea being that it is better to punch lots of times and land a few of them, to do one huge punch and miss completely.
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phk6
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PostPosted: 19:31 - 22 Nov 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

it may be because big V twins deliver lots of torque (turning power) at very low revs, so say for town riding while u are going slow at low revs your bike is sending alot of torque to the rear wheel which obviously is going to put more stress on the tyre its self therefore reducing the life of the tyre.

in theory anyway
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hairychipstic...
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PostPosted: 19:32 - 22 Nov 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

the gsxr1000 has more low down torque than all the litre twins, as would the zx10r i would imagine
the 2004-2006 r1 would be a weaker low down litre bike, more revvy with a massive top end, thats why theyve gone and changed their engine to a 4 valve set up and added that YCCT thing to try combat their short stroke design
ive heard of people going through rear tyres in 1000 miles on litre bikes so thats fairly good mileage, i got 600km out of mine, but 1500 of that was running it in in winter :p
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