Does having right of way mean you can stop looking?

[yambabe]

Had a "moment" on the way home from work tonight, that involved another chap on a bike (I was in the car). I've done a very crap Paint pic to show you the road layout and vehicle positins but basically coming out of work I turn right from a minor road into a major, and there is another minor junction just across the road from mine but staggered a bit.

So, I am turning right out of my junction and there is another car turning right out of the junction across the road. There are vehicles approaching along the main road but it's a 30 limit and they are a good way off.

We both pull out at the same time, and have to sort of manouvre round each other instead of pulling straight away, which slows us down a bit. Clearly visible to those approaching.

Mr Van who is approaching in my lane slows down a bit and kind of falls in behind me, no problems there. Mr Bike however (who was further away as we both pulled out) does not appear to alter his speed at all and has to slam on at the last second (hard enough to do a little stoppie, I was quite impressed he stayed upright) and stops literally inches from the bumper of the other car. He then proceeds to angrily berate the car driver with much waving of arms, shouting and rude gestures, before carrying on his way.

Now IMO we were both OK to make the turn as the approaching traffic was a good distance away, we both may have "got away" a bit quicker if we hadn't had to manouvre round each other but there should have been plenty of time for the approaching traffic to see what we were doing and adjust their speed accordingly. The van driver managed it!

Much as I sympathised with the rider from a biker point of view that he had a really close call, I feel that it was his own fault for not looking ahead and seeing what was going on. If you waited for a completely clear road before pulling out of those junctions you would never actually go anywhere!

What do you reckon?
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Sod falling in love, I wanna fall in chocolate.

[G]

He probably was going too fast and probably didn't see.
But then traffic turning into the road should be judging the speed of oncoming traffic and only pulling out if it's safe to do so without interrupting the oncoming traffic, I believe.
If it was me on the bike, I may well have seen the car about to get in my way and left breaking late (if it was good conditions etc), then redlined the bike a bit to point out they shouldn't be there .

Had a great one filtering through traffic after a Reading football match (my gym is just down the road from the stadium). See drunk people stumbling through traffic as I'm approaching on my bike.
I leave the braking quite late and as I come to a stop pull the clutch in and bounce it off the rev limiter.
Really droke bloke almost shits himself, while his mates either side both try and go different ways, spinning the really drunk one they are supporting around to face the other, still standing in my way.
I was suitably amused. Hopefully they may look next time.
(Awaits flaming for oh so dangerous actions.)

[St0rmer66]

If you'd done a nearside to nearside turn instead you wouldn't have had that problem .

But yes, the biker was just not paying enough attention by the looks of it. Strange for a white van man to be paying more attention than a biker!
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:: Honda XR 125 L ('53) => Kawasaki GPZ 500S ('02) => Suzuki SV650S ('00) => Aprilia RSV-R ('51) ::

[sagalout]

Sounds like the biker wasnt paying that much attention and braked at the last minute, but at the same time you shouldn't carry out a manouvre that causes other road users to have to brake. Put it this way it would be classed as a major on a test.

[Resurrection]

If you are already in the road either waiting to turn or in the middle of turning surely you have right of way if traffic was clear?

Res
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ZX9r

[Jull]

Always check even if you've got right of way. There's just too many idiots about not to

[Finglonga]

Depends on the type of person the biker was. He could be awful at forward observation (as said already) and just didnt see the car untill the last min'. Alot (in this area anyway) only look a couple of feet in front of their front wheel, an accident waiting to happen.

He could be one of these that looks for trouble and did it on purpose to try to prove a point badly.
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Andy Sez....
F.Y.Y.F.F.

[Louise]

Biker was at fault IMO - If the van was breaking, then the Biker should of seen this and act accordling.

[Ariel Badger]

Bike may have very well been looking out for fictional fuel spills rather than looking at the road.
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Bikers make great organ donors, get 115 on your licence today.

[skida]

[skida]

In answer to Yam:

Technically, if you pull on to a major road and cause another vehicle to have to brake, you shouldn't have pulled out. In real life though, the other vehicles should have exercised commom courtesy and slowed down to allow you to proceed. After all, what would that add to their journey time? 15 seconds, maybe?

[BFG]

[Shaun]

I never look if I have the right of way, that way I get a new bike when someone gets in my way.

[dew]

[Johnny GSX-R]

The bike had right of way, even if he was exceeding the speed limit. If the car has pulled out and caused him to brake such as described then I think the driver should visit 'Spec Savers'.

I agree that a nearside to nearside manouvre would have been favourable in this instance, although it would not have gone down well on a test.

It is the responsibility of the driver joining the main road to make sure they enter safely.

[map]

[FreshAL]

[st3v3]

i think from the pic, the biker has priority as he's on the main road, and vehicles pulling out from side road etc, give way to vehicles on the main road, this is what i got told at car my test
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Roger wrote: Women don't get damp for clingy puppies. Get some better happy pills, hit the gym & buy a medallion the size of a dinner plate. Job done

[EuropeanNC30R...]

Like Jonny said, if the van caused the biker to brake hard enough to pull an accidental stoppie it shouldn't have pulled out.

I have one of these sets of junctions by my house and while in the rush hour it isn't realistic not to expect someone on the main road to ease off and slow down a bit while you pull out, it's out of order expecting them to slam on.

[shorty]

Doesn't matter how much you are in the right or whose right of way it is when you are in the back of an ambulance!

Bikers fault IMO, if the van had time to adjust his speed without slamming on the anchors then the biker should have been able to.

Shorty
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Triumph Daytona 675 Triple
Triumph Tiger Sport 1050

[skida]

[Kal]

I'm with Shorty on this. No matter what is happening that is or is not legal, regardless of right of way, the only person responsible for my safety on the Bike is me. The person who is going to suffer most is me.*

From the sounds of it the Bike either wan't paying enough attention to where he was going - and pretty much evreyone has done that from time to time - or he assumed that the pair of you were going to boot it and be clear by the time he got there which kind of justifies the whole Hazard Awareness thing.


*Especially when the girlfriend finds out I've seriously hurt myself.
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Kal...
I Like To Hoon It Hoon It I Like To Hoon It Hoon It I Like To Hoon It Hoon It Ya Like To (HOON IT!).
1984 GB250 Clubman,1983 CB250N Superdream, 1999 GPZ500S

[Kickstart]

Hi

Rider probably should have spotted the situation and compensated. However think that pulling out and causing another vehicle to take avoiding action (such as braking) is classified as driving without due care and attention.

All the best

Keith
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Traxpics, track day and racing photographs - Bimota Forum - Bike performance / thrust graphs for choosing gearing

[colin1]

its exactly this sort of driving that annoys me

people who pull out into oncoming traffic, expecting them to slow down

on the rare occasion i have done this myself, i have felt accutely embarassed at my error, and grateful that the road users i pulled out in front of, were awake enough to break rather than go into the back of me

yes maybe the biker could have avoided the situation by breaking early, but why should he have to ?

many years ago, i drove a car, and pulled out in front of a biker, not realising the speed he was going, and how near he was and he had to brake and overtake. As he went past, he made it clear what he thought of me, and he was right.

Im amazed that someone could think that it was the bikers own fault, when someone has pulled out in front of him causing him to brake.

My driving instructor would have given me a severe ticking off if I had done that, so who on earth taught some of you lot ?

Makes me wonder if we should have compulsory retests for car drivers, as for HGV drivers.
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colin1 is officially faster than god

[Rookie]

That's all well and good Colin, but it's not particularly practical in a city enviroment. Try leaving a 2 second gap in London, you'd have a wonderful time! Sometimes you have to force your way into traffic in order to make progress.

Whilst the bike theoretically shouldn't have had to brake at all, realistically he should have been prepared to, instead of having to perform an emergency stop.