Brakes - an easy guide to keeping top stoppers

[MarJay]

Brakes- maintenance

It goes without saying that your brakes are important. I would say second only to tyres for safety importance. Therefore it also goes without saying that you must look after your brakes. Here are a few things that you need to regularly check/do on your stoppers to keep them in tip top condition.

1.) Brake Pads

Your brake pads are the part of your brakes that do most of the ‘stopping’ work. They grip the brake disc and provide friction which acts against the spinning wheel to slow you. Brake pads must be in good condition for you to stop well, so they must be regularly checked for wear. You usually don’t need to take anything apart to do this, you can just check them by looking at the wear groove / lip on the edge of the pad. If you look where the disc enters and exits the calliper you’ll see what I mean. If you can’t see a groove or lip on the pad material (on either edge of the pad), then they need replacing.

2.) Brake Discs.

Brake discs provide the other half of the stopping force in your brakes, they spin with the wheel and are slowed when the pads grip them. They too, like pads, need to be checked for wear and they usually have a minimum thickness stamped on the disc carrier (bracket). If your discs fall below the minimum thickness, then they need replacing. When you fit new discs, you must also fit new pads so that the old pads don’t score or damage the new discs. Don’t worry though because I doubt you’ll need to replace brake discs until the bike has done at least 10,000 miles.

3.) Brake Lines/Hoses.

Your brake hoses transmit the force provided by your fingers on the brake lever down to the pistons in the brake calliper via hydraulic fluid. They need to be regularly checked for cracks or leaks, and some people prefer to replace their rubber hoses for braided steel hoses. (See fitting braided hoses FAQ) This is often a good idea because rubber brake lines don’t last all that long and can become soft meaning that some of the force transmitted through the lines is lost when the hoses flex.

Strip and clean

So now you’ve checked all of these things but your brakes still don’t seem to be doing what they ought to. The next thing to try is to strip and clean the callipers. If you are unsure of doing this then you must get somebody who is sure to talk you through it or do it for you. There’s no messing around when it comes to brakes. The writer or anybody else other than the reader (you) cannot be held responsible for any loss damage injury or any other bad thing that comes of following this guide. You have been warned.

Disassembly

OK. One of the first things you need to buy beg borrow or steal is a torque wrench. The second is a Haynes or other workshop manual to find out the torque settings for your brakes. Got those? Good. Now you’ll need a ball of string, some copper grease and a can of spray brake cleaner (Halfords is a good bet) (blimey it’s like writing for Blue Peter). Whilst you do this DO NOT TOUCH THE BRAKE LEVER it could have some extremely expensive consequences. Also on twin disc systems only ever do one side at once… believe me it makes life sooo much easier!
First you need to loosen the pad pins which should be visible on the back edge of the calliper. Next, remove the calliper bolts which hold your calliper onto your fork legs. Ok now ease the calliper off of the disc, being careful not to twist, bend or otherwise damage the brake hoses. Now get a piece of string and tie the calliper so that the brake hoses are not under any tension (to the mudguard or something). Now remove the pad pins and catch the pads as they drop out of the bottom of the calliper.
Hooray, you’ve successfully learned how to take it all apart… what now?
Well you need to check the pads for wear, if they’re okay and they’re not contaminated with oil or something, then you need to put them in a safe place. Away from where you are working. And anything Oily.
OK? Good.

Cleaning

Spray brake cleaner liberally over the inside of the callipers and all over the pad pins. If your pad pins are corroded, then they may need replacing, or you could give them a good seeing-to with some very fine emery paper.
There is often a small springy bit of metal that is stuck inside the calliper at the back. This is the pad spring. Make note of which way round it goes and pull it out carefully. Spray that with brake cleaner too and behind where it was in the calliper. Right, now comes the Science bit. Concentrate:

Copper grease is slippery. Therefore you DO NOT want to get any on the brake pad or on the disc. You’ll never get it all off and you’ll have to buy new pads and discs.
Ok preach over. Once everything is dry and you’ve given it a going over with an old toothbrush to remove any bits of crud, you can open the copper grease and put a small amount around the pistons in the calliper. Once you have done this you must push the pistons back inside the calliper housing with your fingers so that about 1mm of piston is showing above the calliper body. Yeah I know its messy, but just bear with me will you? Ok. Now you can put the pad spring in place and smear a THIN LAYER of copper grease on the prong like bits on the spring. Now put the spring back in place. OK. Now go and find your old pads or open up your nice spangly new EBC HH brake pads.

Re-assembly

Again carefully smear a thin layer of copper grease onto the bits of the pad that are going to be pushed by the piston (I.E. the back). Usually on pads that aren’t new there’ll be ring marks on the back of the pads. Use these as a guide, and on sliding (2 piston) callipers (Most NSR’s I expect, old CBR600s, SV650s and believe it or not the new Yamaha Fazer – Yikes!) You’ll have one pad that’s not pushed by pistons but rests against one side of the calliper. Wack a small amount of grease on the centre of the back of this pad too. Your pads might have some metal plates on the back, these are called anti squeal plates and they need to stay in place.

Now grab one of the pad pins and put some copper grease on the smooth part.
OK, now put the faces of the pads together so that they touch each other, (careful your hands are bound to be all greasy; hold the pads by the back plate) and put the 2 pads back into the calliper. Grab the pad pin that you just covered in grease and push it into its hole. Jiggle the pads around a bit until the pin goes right through. Now grab the other pin and smear it in copper grease. Bung it through the other hole in the calliper. OK. Now Pull the two pads apart (its probably best to wash your hands before you do this) and slide the calliper onto the disc.
Jiggle it into position and replace the calliper bolts. Once they are tightened to the correct torque setting you need to tighten up the pad pins to the specified torque. Wohoo! You’ve just stripped and cleaned your brakes!! Not quite. One more IMPORTANT thing is (once you’ve done both sides on a twin disc system) is to pump the brake lever until it no longer comes back to the bar. That would have been fun if you’d ridden the bike like that wouldn’t it??

Road Test

OK now you’re ready for a road test. BE CAREFUL on your road test, just in case you’ve forgotten, overlooked or generally ignored something that could prevent your brakes from working. If you’ve just fitted new pads or discs then you’ll need to take it easy for a few miles to let them bed in properly.

Congratulations you are now a master of your brakes!
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British beauty: Triumph Street Triple R; Loony stroker: KR1S; Track fun: GSXR750 L1; Commuter Missile: GSX-S1000F
Remember kids, bikes aren't like lego. You can't easily take a part from one bike and then fit it to another.

[Demonic69]

Nice one mate! Cheers
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Back on a Blade. Just feels so right.

[Korn]

This is what I do:

* Unbolt the calipers (one at a time)
* Take the pads out
* Put a piece of wood between the pistons and pump the lever to extend them
* Pour some clean brake fluid into a small bowl or something (only a little is needed)
* Use a cotton wool bud dipped in the brake fluid to clean the outside of the pistons
* Once the pistons are clean push them back in
* Repeat 2 more times or until you're happy with their movement
* Clean off excess brake fluid and bolt the caliper back on, now do the other one
* Remove master cylinder cover
* Pull in brake lever (quite far) and gaffa tape / cable tie it in place
* Leave it overnight

Next morning give the brake lines a good tapping with a screwdriver, starting near the calipers and working your way up. Leave it for a few more minutes then release the lever and bolt the master cylinder cover back on.
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3516 Miles, 11 Countries

[MarJay]

Korn,
Brake fluid is pretty nasty stuff though, I'm not sure that would do your piston seals any good... Brake cleaner is better, cos it evaporates away before it can damage stuff like that.
Pushing them out with a bit of wood between is a good idea though...
And I've heard that tying the lever back to the bar is a quick way of bleeding your brakes, and I've used that method a few times. I've found that it doesn't seem to last as long as properly bleeding them. Not really a problem though because you can do it more often than the 'proper' method.
Oh and my MS word spell checker insists on changing the word Caliper to the word Calliper. .. god knows which one is right!
____________________
British beauty: Triumph Street Triple R; Loony stroker: KR1S; Track fun: GSXR750 L1; Commuter Missile: GSX-S1000F
Remember kids, bikes aren't like lego. You can't easily take a part from one bike and then fit it to another.

[Korn]

I think the idea behind using brake fluid is that it lubricates rather than just cleans, plus your seals are in constant contact with the stuff as it is - from the inside.
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3516 Miles, 11 Countries

[MarJay]

Thats true, never thought of that ... its not good for your paintwork though I know that. I've heard of someone who had to strip the paint off of his entire caliper after using brake fluid to clean 'em - although an article in RiDE mag a few months ago reccomended brake fluid... so I'm probably wrong on that one.
Oh well, I thought what I wrote was good...
____________________
British beauty: Triumph Street Triple R; Loony stroker: KR1S; Track fun: GSXR750 L1; Commuter Missile: GSX-S1000F
Remember kids, bikes aren't like lego. You can't easily take a part from one bike and then fit it to another.

[G]

Brake fluid definitely does eat paint, and contact should be avoided at all costs (unless the paint happens to be on a police/boy racer's car ). However I don't see any harm in using it to clean the pistons, as there shouldn't be much paint in that area.
It's generally quite nasty stuff (well DOT 4 is anyway), so you probably want to avoid getting your hands immersed in it while you're at it .

[Dusty]

Useing brake fluid to clean the brakes is one option, it won't do the pistons any harm,- they live in it!!.

If brake cleaner is used, when you have finished it is very important that you pump out and reset the pistons several times, this will make sure that both sides of the seals get coated in fluid.

[MarJay]

Alex,
OK Maybe not NEED to buy new brake discs, but do you reckon you could just wipe copper grease off of them? I'd never be sure that I'd got it all...
Yeah In hindsight I was being a bit stupid about brake fluid. But a Certain Mr Cater told me that I'd be stupid to clean my brakes in brake fluid... It'd waste a whole bottle for a start (its Hygroscopic so it absorbs moisture from the atmosphere) and I might spill it and fcuk up my paintwork... Maybe it was him who had to strip the paint off of some calipers or other. I can't remember. I appreciate the vote of confidence on the write-up though - cheers!

And as for piston seals, I always though they had like a smooth rubber coating on the inside and they were like a different type of rubber on the outside. The only thing that I can think would be similar are those little hopper things we used to have at school. The little rubbery things that you turn inside out and they 'hop'. They were smooth on the outside and almost porous on the inside... Thats why I though that the seals might not be too happy with B-F on the outside... I'm quite likely to be wrong on that one though cos its just a feeling I have.

Right I'm gonna shut up now I think!
____________________
British beauty: Triumph Street Triple R; Loony stroker: KR1S; Track fun: GSXR750 L1; Commuter Missile: GSX-S1000F
Remember kids, bikes aren't like lego. You can't easily take a part from one bike and then fit it to another.

[Scooby]

Those hopper things we had at school were awesome Free in packs of Weeto's at one stage I believe

Well, there's my input to the brake care thread
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A big enough hammer fixes anything!

[Akira]

Well I thought it was a good post. Thanks fella.

[Demonic69]

Thanks for all your advice on this. Followed your guides, then pulled a huge stoppy an stacked the Blade Brakes are a bit too sharp now. (And they still Squeek).
____________________
Back on a Blade. Just feels so right.

[MarJay]

Well there we go!
First hand experience of why we need to be careful with our brakes, and how much difference a bit of fiddling can make.
____________________
British beauty: Triumph Street Triple R; Loony stroker: KR1S; Track fun: GSXR750 L1; Commuter Missile: GSX-S1000F
Remember kids, bikes aren't like lego. You can't easily take a part from one bike and then fit it to another.

[tank]

the best advice with brakes is .if you don,t know DON,T TOUCH, if you want to know get a mechanic to show you properly .would you let your mate do open brain surgery on you. because hey i read how to do it and it looks easy enough .lol

[MarJay]

Brakes are a *little* easier than open brain surgery. You can test your brakes to see if they work before you take your bike on the road, unfortunately I don't think you can test your brain before you sew it all back up again!

Seriously though, I'm not a mechanic by any stretch of the imagination, but I do simple things like that on my bike because if you have a guide or haynes manual you can't go wrong really.
____________________
British beauty: Triumph Street Triple R; Loony stroker: KR1S; Track fun: GSXR750 L1; Commuter Missile: GSX-S1000F
Remember kids, bikes aren't like lego. You can't easily take a part from one bike and then fit it to another.

[Jack2004]

good advice, cheers.

[Deano]

[gfiandy]

Hi,

Just thought I would add my bit of experience with brakes. Be carefull when bleeding them that the brake fluid doesn't leak onto the pads as brake fluid is slippery and one the pads are contaminated with it they won't work nearly as well.

This may not be a problem on some bikes bit the bleed nipple on mine is right at the top of the caliper and if you aren't very carefull the fluid leaks straight onto the pads.

I also found that the area between loosened enough to bleed the brake and loosened so much it leaked seemed to be about 1/10 of a turn hence it was very difficult to work on. It is possible that the bleed nipple was damaged but both sides were the same.

Regards,
Andrew
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ANDY

[Big Bank]

First post for me so hope i'm in the right place. This is an old chat, but i dont see the link for starting a new one.
I'm looking for a tip on where to get two replacement seals for:

Suzuki AY 50 2001

front brake piston.
Sounds easy but ebay shows nothing that looks like what I have.

The scooter was left unused in the sun for 2 years and a neighbour suggested that since there was no pressure building up in the brake that it might be the seals that are no longer ok.

I hope I get some feedback and can take photos of the piston alongside a ruler if that would help. I'm not a mechanic but generally manage to keep machines running without going to garages for help.

Wish you all safe riding,

Big Bank
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Don't try to stop me,for your own good.

[MarJay]

You found a post by probably the only member that is still around from that era.

No, this was the wrong thing to do.

You click the quite prominent 'new topic' button on the top right of the page.
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British beauty: Triumph Street Triple R; Loony stroker: KR1S; Track fun: GSXR750 L1; Commuter Missile: GSX-S1000F
Remember kids, bikes aren't like lego. You can't easily take a part from one bike and then fit it to another.

[Robby]