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is this normal for a brand new bike? nearly killed girlfrien

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MaybeGuy
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PostPosted: 23:05 - 30 Aug 2007    Post subject: is this normal for a brand new bike? nearly killed girlfrien Reply with quote

bit of a long one... FUCKING READ IT!!! tha's right

so... lifan samurai? you remember the posts...

less than 1 year old and absolutely shit eye.
i've had 2 'offs'. both of which were minor and resulted in cosmetic only damage.

my exhaust manifold bolts sheared off due to engine vibrations, the warranty didnt cover it because they couldnt get it out again, so it was left as it was.

apparantly this voided my warranty because they couldnt sort it?

so now, 2 days ago, the bike starts feeling a bit shakey and spongey around corners, when i noticed this, i stopped soon as soon as i felt this and had a full check of the bike, didnt notice anything odd, chain was ok, bushes were ok, engine running ok in neutral and revving freely...

so the missuses dad wants to have a talk to her (about family stuff), so i wait outside as i dont really want to intrude, and i get bored and have another check of the bike...

turns out just underneath the radiator the FUCKING FRAME SNAPPED!!!!

a clean snap!

so this annoys me a bit, because the bike is 11 months from new,
so i ride SLOWLY to the bike shop for them to tell me 'nope, were not doing anything about it because its crash damage'.


crash damage??
surely the frame should be stronger than the CLIP ON handlebars??
so apparantly when i had my off's (most recent about 4 months ago) it snapped the frame!

so yeah, the mothers a lawyer so legal action Thumbs Up
for free! Thumbs Up Thumbs Up

these past 5 days ive had the missus riding bitch, and this frame could have properly snapped at any second!

all my other bikes are over 20 years old, one of which had a bad crash and ive restored to roadworth, and no frame damage or even sign of it!
what does this say about that?

i even asked for a new frame from manufacturer and id even pay registration for it, but they were set in their ways...

1) what should i do about it?
2) is this grounds for legal action?
3) do i have a leg to stand on?

sorry about the gayness of the post, it just angered me.

cheers queers xxx
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Blue_SV650S wrote: it was a sh1te wheelie, but it proves that he can get it up in 3rd and can do angles. In summery, mattsprattuk is a gobby little sh1tebag, dopehead tw4t, but sadly for all of us, he probably isn't THAT full of sh1te!! Mr. Green
Kickstart wrote: Hi I tend to agree with Matt. All the best Keith
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truslack
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PostPosted: 23:18 - 30 Aug 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

Didn't read any of that. But from the title: Yes, almost killing your girlfriend with a new bike is normal, either A) when she finds out how much it was or B) when she faints from being scared you might kill yourself.
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MaybeGuy
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PostPosted: 23:21 - 30 Aug 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

ya.. try reading it next time, you might get the gist of it...
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Blue_SV650S wrote: it was a sh1te wheelie, but it proves that he can get it up in 3rd and can do angles. In summery, mattsprattuk is a gobby little sh1tebag, dopehead tw4t, but sadly for all of us, he probably isn't THAT full of sh1te!! Mr. Green
Kickstart wrote: Hi I tend to agree with Matt. All the best Keith
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Jamie S
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PostPosted: 23:29 - 30 Aug 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Cb Frame won't snap because its not made of monkey metal!

Lifan built quality is not the best lets face it, What do you expect !
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iooi
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PostPosted: 23:36 - 30 Aug 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
my exhaust manifold bolts sheared off due to engine vibrations, the warranty didnt cover it because they couldnt get it out again, so it was left as it was.

apparantly this voided my warranty because they couldnt sort it?


You should have gone over the dealers head and straight to the manufacture when that happened..... The fact they could not fix ?? (What sort of dealer are they) should have no bearing on the warranty at all.
Get onto the manufacture and see what they say...

Oh and find a new dealer who can fix stuff.... Rolling Eyes
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Evo
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PostPosted: 23:45 - 30 Aug 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

truslack wrote:
Didn't read any of that


If you can't be assed to read his opening post. Who's going to read your reply ?


Bit of a confusing one to think about as crash damage does indeed void warranty and since you've only made them aware of it after a crash - You openly told them ?

Hopefully you have something to go on but can't see how to go around it.
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truslack
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PostPosted: 23:51 - 30 Aug 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

mattsprattuk wrote:
ya.. try reading it next time, you might get the gist of it...


Sorry, it was a joke Embarassed


I read most of it, but got confused with the exhaust manifold bit.

Do you mean it vibrated itself to pieces? I'm sure this should be covered under warranty because its a design fault if that's what happened.
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MaybeGuy
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PostPosted: 00:06 - 31 Aug 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

truslack wrote:
mattsprattuk wrote:
ya.. try reading it next time, you might get the gist of it...


Sorry, it was a joke Embarassed


I read most of it, but got confused with the exhaust manifold bit.

Do you mean it vibrated itself to pieces? I'm sure this should be covered under warranty because its a design fault if that's what happened.


basically yeah, it vibrated itsself to peices!
ill admit im no bike expert, but i know a lot more than the average about the mechanics and stuff, and this stuff just 'happened', no tell tale signs or anything to prevent.

to put it simply 'it vibrated so much that the frame snapped'.

what we're going to do is get a bike mechanic to see to it on saturday and confirm that its vibrated itsself to peices, then we bring in the mummy-lawyer to give them a good hiding Very Happy

so hopefully if all goes to plan we'll have a brand new lifan being shipped over.

just one final question...
its a single cylinder 4 stroke with 2 exhausts.
one exhaust is blowing quite clearly.
its been doing it a while, would this make the engine vibrate a LOT more? ie: enough to snap a frame?
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Blue_SV650S wrote: it was a sh1te wheelie, but it proves that he can get it up in 3rd and can do angles. In summery, mattsprattuk is a gobby little sh1tebag, dopehead tw4t, but sadly for all of us, he probably isn't THAT full of sh1te!! Mr. Green
Kickstart wrote: Hi I tend to agree with Matt. All the best Keith
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truslack
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PostPosted: 00:09 - 31 Aug 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is it the metal bar that has snapped, or a weld?

It MAY be enough to make a crap weld snap, but a metal bar shouldn't unless it has been under severe tension. How big is the gap between the snapped parts?
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MaybeGuy
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PostPosted: 00:13 - 31 Aug 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

its the actual bar thats snapped in 2 and its about a 1cm gap between the 2 ends.
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Blue_SV650S wrote: it was a sh1te wheelie, but it proves that he can get it up in 3rd and can do angles. In summery, mattsprattuk is a gobby little sh1tebag, dopehead tw4t, but sadly for all of us, he probably isn't THAT full of sh1te!! Mr. Green
Kickstart wrote: Hi I tend to agree with Matt. All the best Keith
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.Chris.
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PostPosted: 00:16 - 31 Aug 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you tell them you've got a lawyer in the family who'll sue them for you at no cost to yourself then they may cave in. Also threaten to write to all the bike publications with your story about how crap the bike and their aftersales service is.

Chances are they won't want a dispute over a snapped Lifan frame to get that public as it won't do their sales much good.
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truslack
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PostPosted: 00:21 - 31 Aug 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

mattsprattuk wrote:
its the actual bar thats snapped in 2 and its about a 1cm gap between the 2 ends.


As if both sides of the bar are being pulled apart...

Sounds as if something was fitted in the wrong bolt holes, and was trying to force the frame to bend outwards, but this bar was stopping it.

Lots of vibrations, and a small knock later it snaps because of the tension.

Design fault, warranty should cover it.

[edit] https://www.bikechatforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=104667&highlight=chinese+125
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G
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PostPosted: 00:32 - 31 Aug 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

RXS100_Chris wrote:
If you tell them you've got a lawyer in the family who'll sue them for you at no cost to yourself then they may cave in. Also threaten to write to all the bike publications with your story about how crap the bike and their aftersales service is.

In the past I've seen this sort of aggressive stance being met with an even sterner rebuttal - people don't like being threatened, I guess.
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MaybeGuy
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PostPosted: 00:32 - 31 Aug 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

truslack wrote:
mattsprattuk wrote:
its the actual bar thats snapped in 2 and its about a 1cm gap between the 2 ends.


As if both sides of the bar are being pulled apart...

Sounds as if something was fitted in the wrong bolt holes, and was trying to force the frame to bend outwards, but this bar was stopping it.

Lots of vibrations, and a small knock later it snaps because of the tension.

Design fault, warranty should cover it.

[edit] https://www.bikechatforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=104667&highlight=chinese+125


not as such...



https://aycu19.webshots.com/image/26258/2000779052563186990_rs.jpg


thanks for that link, i'll keep that for evidence.

pic shows where crack is, they claimed 'if it was dropped, the shock would crack that part of the frame'

bollocks!
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Blue_SV650S wrote: it was a sh1te wheelie, but it proves that he can get it up in 3rd and can do angles. In summery, mattsprattuk is a gobby little sh1tebag, dopehead tw4t, but sadly for all of us, he probably isn't THAT full of sh1te!! Mr. Green
Kickstart wrote: Hi I tend to agree with Matt. All the best Keith
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sickpup
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PostPosted: 01:00 - 31 Aug 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

G wrote:


In the past I've seen this sort of aggressive stance being met with an even sterner rebuttal - people don't like being threatened, I guess.



I've also heard people don't like it when you drive a Transit van into the front of their shop, walk in and rip all the phones out of the wall, take hammers to everyone's mobiles and politely ask if you can have a refund.

Each to their own I guess. Very Happy
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Jamie S
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PostPosted: 01:29 - 31 Aug 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorted , now go ride the damn thing ! Laughing
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MaybeGuy
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PostPosted: 02:15 - 31 Aug 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

wow thanks for that jamie, not only does my bike look like something from dangermouse,
it now looks like something the IRA would do driveby murders on!
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Blue_SV650S wrote: it was a sh1te wheelie, but it proves that he can get it up in 3rd and can do angles. In summery, mattsprattuk is a gobby little sh1tebag, dopehead tw4t, but sadly for all of us, he probably isn't THAT full of sh1te!! Mr. Green
Kickstart wrote: Hi I tend to agree with Matt. All the best Keith
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iooi
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PostPosted: 09:44 - 31 Aug 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

G wrote:
RXS100_Chris wrote:
If you tell them you've got a lawyer in the family who'll sue them for you at no cost to yourself then they may cave in. Also threaten to write to all the bike publications with your story about how crap the bike and their aftersales service is.

In the past I've seen this sort of aggressive stance being met with an even sterner rebuttal - people don't like being threatened, I guess.


That will be because 99.9% of people who make the threats never go through with them......

Just because you make the threat, does not mean they will cave in, you have to push it forward, you go the the press and they will contact them for their comments... Thats when they may cave in... To save bad press.
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.Chris.
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PostPosted: 11:27 - 31 Aug 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's worked for me before. If they just take the piss (trying to fob off a snapped frame on a minor spill) when you ask nicely then you have to ask a bit less nicely!

They obviously don't care about you because you're not going to buy another Lifan from them = no more money for them. Therefore you have to hit them where it's going to hurt them, i.e. their future sales. Don't let them get away with it or they'll just do it to other people.
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MaybeGuy
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PostPosted: 11:39 - 31 Aug 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

the thing is, they have a very misleading parts warranty.
basically anything thats possibly expendable is not covered.

the only thing that is covered really is the clocks and SOME electrics, its bloody rediculous.
i managed to squeeze a reg/rect from them and an indimacator relay at a push.

ive spoken to the mother this morning and she says that its not their fault, i need to go above them to the manufacturers...

i dont speak chinese! :'(

so we'll threaten them a bit more, im going there on the GIX before i take it to the MOT tomorrow to get it picked up by the RAC, then ill tell them whats what.

ill explain that im getting free legal action (thanks chris Very Happy) and im getting it checked out by an independant mechanic (ie: bloke who is doing my MOT tomorrow).

either way, they will have to pay for legal advice, and it will cost them more than shipping in and registering a new frame.

it annoys me how people like this can get away with it.
whenever im there, theres always someone else in a similar boat to me with one problem or another, and the manager there just bought himself a brand new goldwing with all the trimmings.
id be tempted to kick it over if i saw it, but it would probably just pick itsself up again Very Happy

cheers queers xxx
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Blue_SV650S wrote: it was a sh1te wheelie, but it proves that he can get it up in 3rd and can do angles. In summery, mattsprattuk is a gobby little sh1tebag, dopehead tw4t, but sadly for all of us, he probably isn't THAT full of sh1te!! Mr. Green
Kickstart wrote: Hi I tend to agree with Matt. All the best Keith
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Finglonga
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PostPosted: 13:54 - 31 Aug 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

1st thing the exhaust bolts. . . You have statutory rights, which means it must be fit for the purpose regardless of what the warranty says. It sounds like a design fault and should be rectified FOC. However you need to look after the bike, as in, if it has been neglected and it has caused corrosion they can fall back on that as a contributing factor. I would have a word with your local CAB, they might put you in touch with Trading Standards.

The frame snapping is more dodgy. If you have told the dealer you had an off they will use that against you. As they don't know how severe it was and the damage it may have caused. Your best bet at the time would have been to have it inspected by them for damage then if they gave it the all clear then they would be more liable now for the snap.
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G
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PostPosted: 14:09 - 31 Aug 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

mattsprattuk wrote:

ive spoken to the mother this morning and she says that its not their fault, i need to go above them to the manufacturers...

I would have thought it's the UK importers.

If it went to court, I don't know how far your "oh it was only a minor spill" would hold out, regardless of that being the truth or not. They can just say "well, obviously something hit that bit" or similar and it's going to hard for you to prove otherwise.
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MaybeGuy
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PostPosted: 14:13 - 31 Aug 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

what your saying is understandable, but even so, forensics would show that any impact would damage the yokes rather than the frame.
have a look at a lifan samurai on google images and see where the yokes are placed, nowhere near the break.
also there is no damage at all to the lower fairings.

its all a bit shit if you ask me.

if it is the case of it being the british importers rather than the manufacturers, then the shop is at fault? as they import the bikes.
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Blue_SV650S wrote: it was a sh1te wheelie, but it proves that he can get it up in 3rd and can do angles. In summery, mattsprattuk is a gobby little sh1tebag, dopehead tw4t, but sadly for all of us, he probably isn't THAT full of sh1te!! Mr. Green
Kickstart wrote: Hi I tend to agree with Matt. All the best Keith
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andrew
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PostPosted: 14:49 - 31 Aug 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

mattsprattuk wrote:
forensics would show that any impact would damage the yokes rather than the frame.


I don't think is anything to do with forensics. Like has already been said. You've had an off on the bike so it's going to be a bit hard winning in court in my opinion. You will have to have proof of the type of accident you had.

If you want experts to verify that the damage couldn't have been caused by the type of accident you had then you'll have to pay them and recoup the costs from the defendant/s.

I'm with sickpup on this, sod the court route, buy an old banger, put a brick on the pedal and point the fooker at their shop.....

Good luck getting it all sorted but i'm not sure that you have much chance of a win here..... My advice, don't buy cheap knock off crap in the future. Thumbs Up
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G
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PostPosted: 15:34 - 31 Aug 2007    Post subject: Reply with quote

If the shop imports them directly, then it’s them that the claim is against – otherwise you’d be trying to sue a Chinese company in British courts!
Even so, I thought in such cases it was usually who you gave money to that was liable – then it was up to them to pass it down the chain.

Can you afford to employ an appropriate ‘expert witness’, on the risk that he might not find in your favour also?
When I was being prosecuted for a tyre in an unfit state – something I am 100% sure wasn’t the case when the journey started – I was looking at, at the very least £2k for someone just to look at it.
Then if it went to court and I lost I’d be looking at the same again for a rival expert witness.

In the end I just bent over and took it, because I couldn’t justify the time or risk or losing money I didn’t have.
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