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| pa_broon74 |
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pa_broon74
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 Posted: 15:48 - 08 Oct 2007  Post subject: Victimless Crime and micromanagement by Da Man! |
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On commenting in another thread about gloves being made compulsory we kind of got off-topic into vehicle tracking and erosions of freedom and the ability to move around without being monitored along with government micro-management.
In order to not hijack the thread I thought I'd start one here. My question is: Do you think that there are too many laws now in place who's sole purpose isn't to primarely prevent crime/punish criminals but to A]manage the populace and B] generate revenue?
I was just thinking (I'm at work, so bored) about the percentage of laws where if you infringe them there'd be no victim as opossed to those where there definitely is (murder,theft, assault etc.) There seems to be more and more laws that are so easy to break yet harm no one (except your wallet) and these laws are prosecuted with the most frequency and gusto. 
I'm no rabble rousing firebrand or Urban renegade (  ) I just prefer to remain unnoticed and unmolested, but; if they do insist that my movements are tracked, I will be criminalised for no good reason that I can think of.
This is me just rambling, if you don't have any views then feel free to let this thread die on its arse, I don't mind. 
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| Cigaro |
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Cigaro
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| Kickstart |
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Kickstart
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| cestrian |
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cestrian
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| TheShaggyDA |
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TheShaggyDA
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Posted: 16:02 - 08 Oct 2007  Post subject: |
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The whole "guilty before you've actually done anything" culture pisses me off no end. As an example, I used to work for a company that I now contract to now and again. I worked there from 1989 to 2004, and since the primary business was supplying software to the finanace sector, there were occasions to sign non disclosure agreements. I've no problem wth that, I had to sign something for some Civil Secrets Act to work on the Met Police's crime statistics softare.
The bit that boils my piss is that the Royal Bank of Scotland have now insisted on security checks for all staff that are to work on their systems. Screw the fact that I'd been working on their software for the best part of 17 years, they now want my passport, my driving licence and a recent utility bill. Not copies, the originals. These will then be sent of to a third party for a background check.
The process takes 6 weeks. Who the fuck do they think they are?
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| pa_broon74 |
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pa_broon74
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| Shay HTFC |
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Shay HTFC
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Posted: 16:22 - 08 Oct 2007  Post subject: |
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Lots of people argue that these laws are 'preventative' in that getting done for speeding will stop you accidently killing someone.
But yeah, on the whole more and more of these laws are coming into effect.
TheBassJunky, you mention weed. Other drugs such as heroin may cause problems to other people (i.e. you are so messed up all teh time that you steal because you can;t get a normal job etc), but weed is more comparable to alcohol.
A friend told me about this and its quite interesting. Have you ever thought that maybe the government's hand on weed is being forced by the massive brewing companies. They make millions/billions each year from selling alcohol, much as the government do on taxes so its in their interests for weed to be illegal.
What happens if it became legal and then you or I thought "Hang about, lets do weed tonight" instead of going out and spending £20 on alcohol? Multiply that by millions and you get a large total of lost revenue for these massive corporations.
Have you heard the song The Irony of it All by The Streets. Great song and makes you think really!
Don't want to change this thread around, but they are valid points.
With regards to nanny laws, it is quite worrying. We are told that these laws stop crimes being committed in the first place, but surely the Police are there to punish you after you're done the crime.
How long till that film (Minority Report I think) is the norm (i.e, they look at your DNA or whatever and arrest you before you're done the crime) |
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| Hetzer |
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Hetzer
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| Posted: 16:25 - 08 Oct 2007 Post subject: |
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I don't think I need to set out my stall in this particular thread, my opinions on the matter are pretty well known already. 
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| cestrian |
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cestrian
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| iooi |
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iooi
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| Itchy |
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Itchy
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| Posted: 18:46 - 08 Oct 2007 Post subject: |
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| TheShaggyDA wrote: |
The bit that boils my piss is that the Royal Bank of Scotland have now insisted on security checks for all staff that are to work on their systems. Screw the fact that I'd been working on their software for the best part of 17 years, they now want my passport, my driving licence and a recent utility bill. Not copies, the originals. These will then be sent of to a third party for a background check.
The process takes 6 weeks. Who the fuck do they think they are? |
erm this isn't the fault of the RBS, its the Money laundering regs introduced in 2003, the law is badly written but it has complicit rules thus if they don't go through all that BS with your THEY are liable to be imprisoned, the stupid part of this law is that it needs to be redone every few years even if you know people ,
it upsets clients badly
it has no deminis limit, thus while doing accounts if I spot 1p that looks supicious I HAVE to report it , or go to prison.
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| Itchy |
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Itchy
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Posted: 18:55 - 08 Oct 2007  Post subject: |
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| pa_broon74 wrote: | Relieving a person of their money is an effective punishment (and possibly deterrent) to certain crimes, I'm more worried about the idea that these laws are passed not to prevent bad things from happening to innocent people, (heh! Thats kinda what they are, except the victim of the crime is the perpetrator ) but to manage everything we do, everywhere we go, everyone we speak to and what we can and can't say. |
BUT it presumes guilt over innocence which is a key principle, HMRC are looking into taking money OUT of your bank account if they think you owe that money, without asking first , they want this power sounds good doesn't it? , to relieve say a tax payer who is dodging tax?.
The reality is HMRC are deadly incompetent and to prop up the holes in the economy they will just take large wads off people then refund it bacl a few months later, a couple months for a few £100 in a bank account will make me and you nothing , but HMRC has accounts that have billions in them and they make loads of interest on those accounts.
A typical example is coding out of bank interest, ie say you have £1000 in the bank you have 5% interest say £50 , HMRC has a nasty habit of moving to take the 20% tax £20 before it is even due.
Again student employment pre 1997 it was fine to fill in a form and work tax free as a student as long as you didn't make more than the personal allowance at the time.
Around 1998-99 it changed so that you were taxed normally and your income was presumed to be month 1 x 12, and you'd have to claim it back which takes months and months , my £1000 tax over payment a couple years back took 9 months to get back to me.
Thus such laws are made to make the government money directly and indirectly and are also for the purposes of job creation the fine example being 10 years ago took 2 people to process a tax return now it takes 7 + 3 7 to deal with the actual return 1 to have to amend stuff which they alter on purpose, another to check 18.1/18.2 and another to demand they release payment of overpayments of tax which they hate doing,
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Spain 2008France 2007Big one 2009 We all die. The goal isn't to live forever, the goal is to create something that will. In the end, your life will flash before your eyes. Make sure it is worth watching. |
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| Mister James |
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Mister James
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| Hetzer |
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Hetzer
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| Posted: 12:00 - 09 Oct 2007 Post subject: |
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| Kickstart |
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Kickstart
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| Hetzer |
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Hetzer
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| Posted: 13:37 - 09 Oct 2007 Post subject: |
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| pa_broon74 |
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pa_broon74
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| Posted: 14:09 - 09 Oct 2007 Post subject: |
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Mutlinational corproration are undoubtedly evil. What bothers me more is in the village where I grew up, the corner shop (which used to be just that; a corner shop with wooden signage ran by Mr Mathie) is now a generic Keystore ran by a weirdo who when he tells you how much you're due says things like: "That'll be one hundred and seventy six finest english pennies" in an irritatingly cheerful squeek. 
My childhood memories sold down the river and replaced by a tawdry nationwide franchise. 
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Old Thread Alert!
The last post was made 18 years, 363 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful? |
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