the End of London?

[Itchy]

Rejoyce? ,

according to:

https://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/7225527.stm#map

Most lorries etc will have to pay a £200 a DAY Low emission charge, effectively anywhere inside the M25,

Right folks time to lay siege to London and effectively starve everybody inside the M25?.
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[Keir]

according to that page, when tests were conducted last year only 10% of the 120,000 lorrys would have failed. As its pre 2001 lorrys that are mainly affected its going to hit the small firms harder than the large ones with their shiney new fleets.
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[JonB]

To be fair it's about time the government started pointing fingers at the manufacturers rather than the consumers.

Let's hope one day the councils will stop punishing the end user for the stupid amounts of un-necessary packaging manufacturers use for the products.

I'm not saying a climate levy is entirely fair at all, just saying that I and many other individuals in the UK are fed up with paying taxes for something we contribute very little to.
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[Shay HTFC]

I don't see the problem.
They only need to raise the price of a cup of coffee about £2 (only 10% of the sale price) to the consumer

[Kwaks]

[owdamer]

[Grav]

London is seen as the blueprint for road charges that are being considered for Britain's major cities. Manchester is expected to introduce congestion charges in the next three years and you can bet that the Low Emission Charge will follow shortly afterwards.

It is also a safe bet that these charges will ultimately be passed on to the consumer as the large haulage companies will have no choice but to pass it on down the line and we will bear the brunt of it. I fear for the future of the smaller haulage firms as they will be effectively priced off the roads.
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snigger.....

[Itchy]

[TheShaggyDA]

Makes me want to get a Diesel Enfield and chug around the city all day.
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[iooi]

Considering that London has the best public network in the UK, well in terms of not having far to walk from getting off to where ever you need to go, it would make far more sense just to ban cars... This would then leave the roads clear for the wagons to get in and out a lot quicker, thus creating a lot less poulition....

As a added side effect, biking would be so much better as you have not muppets saying SMIDSY..

Also these wagons create less smog than the cars anyway.
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[iooi]

Double post stupid dam busy server......
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[Silver]

[andrew]

I don't see how they can say they want to help the environment one minute, then consider another runway at heathrow the next.

It's a total sham and will do fuck all for the environment.

I don't suppose anyone here knows where the £200 daily charge is going to be heading?

[Grav]

[thegubner]

Over 12 ton?

Surely you will just end up with double or close to treble the numbers of 7 and half ton wagons in London then? Making more money on the usual congestion charge and clogging the streets up even more, and with more wagons meaning more emissions its pointless.

[Al]

It says by 2010 that it will include small trucks and some vans, So using more 7.5 ton trucks would only work as a temp measure.

It also says that cars and bikes are exempt from the charges, but I bet it won't be too long until they come up with some kind of extra charge for older cars and bikes entering the zone.

The smaller haulage firms and the owner drivers will be the ones that lose out as they won't have the cash to replace all there older trucks straight away.
With an extra £1000 a week to pay out, on top of all the other expenses, plus the fact that that there already being undercut by foreign companies and drivers. Its looking very bleak for the little men of the British haulage industry.

Meanwhile the big companies that get a new fleet of trucks every year or two pick up extra trade as the small ones fold. Which is great for the fat cat bosses but not so good for the little guy trying to make a living.
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[Silver]

[WildGoose]

It's a total farce, from what I have seen. As the majority of the trucks on our roads meet Euro III already it will have little to no effect on congestion (I know thats not the point) but as has been mentioned, banning cars would be the far better step forward both for congestion and pollution. But they would never do it, because it would be totally unenforceable.

The haulage industry, already totally over regulated is a nice soft target, because they know they will bend over and say "ok". They want £1000 if you enter the zone in an unapproved vehicle without letting them know in advance. £1000!!! A handful of contraventions (read; missed signposts) could put the small man+van type operators right under for months.

As has been mentioned all the big haulage firms, don't even come close to being affected because they get a new fleet of trucks every few years, which beat the minimum standards for the zone by a large margin.

The small one man bands will be the ones that suffer, and furthermore they won't be able to sell that vehicle to buy a more up to date one, because any company/individual from birmingham downwards isnt going to want a truck that can't cross the M25. So the value of that vehicle has effectively been reduced to zero, unless you want to spend thousands fitting a catalytic converter. Or retrofitting modern engines.

The company I was working for a while ago, ran all old trucks, Euro II emission standards. You can send such vehicles for a special test to see if, despite what they are badged as, they are able to pass a specific emission standard in a real time test, some passed, some didn't. A very slow and tedious process.

It doesnt stop there.

They use the term large vans, read carefully and you will realise this means basically anything that isnt a car based van, like a transit connect or astra van.
So as of October 2010;

[cestrian]

Maybe they need to find some cash quick

https://www.thisislondon.co.uk/standard/article-23435992-details/Brown%27s+%C2%A32bn+Tube+bail+out/article.do

[chris-red]

Motorised transport only causes 3% of world carbon emmissions I believe, this includes all the countrys that single use leaded fuel.

200 day for some trcuks to go into london is just gonna piss people off and do fuck all to chance anything.
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[Itchy]

[bazza]

[400bandit]

This nearly stung my dad, he has a 2001 DAF CF85 which he paid £60,000 for only last year and was quite an upgrade from his older Volvo FH12 (Made into plant lorries hence the stupid prices). Then all of a sudden he's getting angry letters from VOSA saying he will have to buy a catalytic converter that will cost 5 grand or pay the 200 pound a day fine. This came as a massive shock to him and he's in London (well when they say London they mean anywhere within the M25 - not the old congestion zone area) most days.

There's a checking thing on the TFL website that you put in your number plate to see whether it's legible for a LEZ (Low Emission Zone) certificate and it came back negative! After this my dad was pretty much convinced that he had to buy the cat (I'm sure many others have too) but it turns out in the end (after lots of searching) that is able to go in free of charge! TFL published a list online of engines saying what will pass and what won't, now this list then say yes or no next to the appropriate engine. My dad's engine was in the no zone seemingly unfortunately but then after more searching and revealing a case study on a horse box it turns out that the yes no business is whether they are eligible for a RPC (Reduced Pollution Certificate) - that's not the same standard as EURO 3 FFS - it's higher! I managed to persuade him to go to a testing station and I armed him with all these bits of paper that I printed out. He goes down there and they wouldn't even test his lorry! That's mad, he had already in advance paid the 28 pound fee and then the guy was like no it won't pass so I'm not going to test it! After my dad persisting, another guy in a white coat was called over who let the lorry be tested and low and behold it passed! - What a load of shit. Even the people at VOSA said that they don't really know enough about it.

There must have been so many people that have paid a lot of money for un-necessary modifications to their Lorries just because A) Livingstone is a nob and B) VOSA hasn’t got a clue.

As has already been said, it will kill the small haulage companies and I think it will murder the coach companies when it hits them in 2010.

Rant over

Joe

(Sorry about that)
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