The Benefits of a Power Commander

[Graham88]

Just saw one when browsing eBay and was wondering what good they are?

Seller is saying they're are 5bhp gains and more with aftermarket exhaust and K&N filters?

Is this one of those useless things such as "Electric Superchargers?"

5bhp doesn't seem much but then I suppose for a bike it means more than in cars which is what I'm used too!

How do you put them on and set them up etc, what do they actually do?

[Kickstart]

Hi

They are used to tailor the fueling. Normally to go with modifications such as pipes and filters. Would doubt you would get 5bhp just from a properly set up power commander on a stock bike (although you might smooth out the power delivery).

Fit one and set it up badly and you could easily loose power and screw up the power delivery. The power gains are really to do with what else you do, and the effectiveness of the power commander is pretty much down to the skills of the person who does the mapping for you.

All the best

Keith
____________________
Traxpics, track day and racing photographs - Bimota Forum - Bike performance / thrust graphs for choosing gearing

[Graham88]

I thought there would be more to it than simply plug and play.

Not really worth it on a road going bike then, cheers.

[Kickstart]

Hi

Worthwhile if you have done mods. Without it the chances are that lobbing on an aftermarket can will screw up the power and power delivery.

All the best

Keith
____________________
Traxpics, track day and racing photographs - Bimota Forum - Bike performance / thrust graphs for choosing gearing

[Graham88]

So if I'm correct in what you are saying, I have a Remus Revolutions Exhaust and no other performance mods, so this will make it slower than one with a standard can, unless you do the relevant mods (Power Commander) to make the aftermarket can actually have some performance gains?

[Kickstart]

Hi

Good chance yes. Aftermarket exhaust will affect the fueling requirements, and affect it differently at different revs. So you might gain at some points and might loose out at others (more so than otherwise). Power commander allows the fuel map to be fiddled with to optimise it for your exhaust (etc) and so should give you the gains for the exhaust.

All the best

Keith
____________________
Traxpics, track day and racing photographs - Bimota Forum - Bike performance / thrust graphs for choosing gearing

[Graham88]

So presuming this is the same as putting an uprated ECU in a car, can you download maps from the internet specific to the bike and the exhaust fitted?

Or do you need to take it to a Dyno and get it setup properly?

[Kickstart]

Hi

Yes you can download maps, if you can find one someone has done. However best results are if you get it set up properly.

All the best

Keith
____________________
Traxpics, track day and racing photographs - Bimota Forum - Bike performance / thrust graphs for choosing gearing

[baldy]

I suppose it is down to what you want it for. I got mine just smooth out the power delivery as kickstart says. The blade hasnt exactly got the smoothest fueling as standard. I just plugged it in and uploaded one of the maps that came with it. Its made a huge difference at small throttle openings. Most of the jerkiness has gone, but im shure that a trip to the man with a dyno would fix it. Also i completely disagree with all this emissions control b@ll@cks. The P.C. comes with a connector thing to disable something to do with it. (cant remember what its called, but it looks like a tooth that you plug into a connecter.)

As soon as i can afford it, a full system is going on without a cat, so maybe a few hp there to be had as well as a decent weight saving over stock.

Dont get one thinking it will give you loads of extra power, because it wont. Unless you're going to get the engine tuned. I cant even notice if it has got more power, i wouldnt care anyway. I think 160 odd bhp is plenty for my needs.
____________________
One day i will rule the world, just not today.

[craigs23]

[ZaphodBeeble]

As usual what Keith is saying is correct. Powercommanders can make a nice difference to throttle response and fuelling throughout the rev range. A couple of horses can be expected to whinny their way to the top end of your rev range but the best thing is the better fuelling low down will give you better torque and hence longer power curves.

Loading a map into a Powercommander 3 USB is very straightforwards. You plug it in like you would a digital camera into your PC. Install the software from the website or CD, download a suitable map (if they dont list the exhaust that you have just try another map that has a similar exhaust) then load the map to the PC3 using the software supplied. If you haven't got the PC3 connected to the bike they usually supply a power-up cable which you can plug into the PC3 and connect a 9V battery to get it up and running for map loading purposes.
____________________
Current bike: VTR1000F Firestorm. Previous: Firestorm (written off) - XJ600 Divvy - NSR125 - DT125 and a load of offroaders.

[Ben.]

so whats the best way the fiddle on a carbed bike?
im guessing the only way is to play with the jets on the carbs, which is going to be stupidly hard?
____________________
follow my racing season
Race bike - R6
Road bike - sv650

[Kickstart]

[ZaphodBeeble]

With carbs you can generally get away with setting them up by adjusting the needle circlip position. Raise the circlip and the bike will run leaner at 1/4 to full throttle, lower the circlip to make it richer. You also have to worry about the air/fuel screws (if the screw is on the engine side of the throttle slide/valve then it is an air screw, if its the other side its a fuel screw.) If you 'unscrew' the air screw you make the bike leaner between idle and 1/4 throttle. If you screw it in you make it richer at the same throttle positions. Same sort of thing if its got a fuel screw except you screw it in to make it leaner.

If you don't have enough adjustment with these things then you need to start changing jets and jet needles.
____________________
Current bike: VTR1000F Firestorm. Previous: Firestorm (written off) - XJ600 Divvy - NSR125 - DT125 and a load of offroaders.

[Graham88]

Thanks for all the replies

Certainly sounds easy to use and get maps.

What are rough prices for these? I can only find them for sale on American websites.

[ZaphodBeeble]

https://www.dynojet.co.uk/powercommander/power-commander-prices.php


____________________
Current bike: VTR1000F Firestorm. Previous: Firestorm (written off) - XJ600 Divvy - NSR125 - DT125 and a load of offroaders.

[Wafer_Thin_Ham]

Consider also the Tuneboy, Juice box, and the yoshimura cube. Although the PCIII USB seems to have become the standard issue now.
____________________
My Flickr

[ZaphodBeeble]

I thought the Yoshi box was for Suzuki only? I've not used one myself but I think they only alter the fuelling at 3 different throttle positions whereas the PC3 alters it over a much broader range.

Also the ProBike suzuki module is useful as it alters the fuelling over 5 different throttle psotions so slightly better than the yoshi box.
____________________
Current bike: VTR1000F Firestorm. Previous: Firestorm (written off) - XJ600 Divvy - NSR125 - DT125 and a load of offroaders.

[Graham88]

Roughly what would gains with a K&N filter, a full system and a power commander give on a 636?

Just interested as some people have said you'd be lucky to see 10bhp, whereas a few have said easily 20bhp?

[ZaphodBeeble]

Graham you would be extremely lucky to see 10bhp let alone 20bhp. I've seen gains of about 7bhp on litre bikes so don't expect a great deal from a 636. You seem to be missing the point a bit though too. The filter and exhaust opens the bike up and makes it rev quicker and also with more fuel being thrown in it will give the bike more torque which is very important. A couple of extra BHP is all well and good but I consider the throttle response and torque to be the main factors.

Think about being in 3rd gear at 8000rpm mid corner. If you open the throttle as you exit with standard exhaust you are nowhere near the top end of the rev range so you would either have to change down to get more power or just wait for the revs to pick up. Now if you had all the power mods on the bike it would have greater torque which would make the bike pull better at that 8000rpm zone. How often do you hit peak power when in mid corner? You don't, you let the revs drop and get back on the power at the apex. If you was at peak power you wouldn't be able to accelerate out of the corner without changing gear which is not nice when your toes are on the deck.
____________________
Current bike: VTR1000F Firestorm. Previous: Firestorm (written off) - XJ600 Divvy - NSR125 - DT125 and a load of offroaders.

[Wafer_Thin_Ham]

[ZaphodBeeble]

Oh I thought it was an ECU tweaking module like the Probike one I mentioned. Didn't realise you left it on the bike.
____________________
Current bike: VTR1000F Firestorm. Previous: Firestorm (written off) - XJ600 Divvy - NSR125 - DT125 and a load of offroaders.

[Wafer_Thin_Ham]

[Kickstart]

[Wafer_Thin_Ham]