Dual Compound Tyres

[calum17]

Hi, i recently put new tyres on my bike but after a few thousand miles the rear needs changing again. this is mainly down to a few long rides on straights with luggage and a pillion!
so im thinking about getting dual compound tyres to make them last longer, but are they really any good? do they actually last much longer and are there any which are better/worse than others. what's their grip like in the dry and wet, upright and leant over?
the bike is a ZZR600.

just want some info really before i go put more tyres on the bike which may be worse than what i have anyway

thanks
calum.

[Seb]

I put 3000ish miles on a set of roadsmarts on my ZZR600 much of which was dual carriageways, I didn't measure them but whilst I'm certainly not a hard and aggressive rider, they were not squaring off and easily had another 2k+ miles worth of tread on the rear.

They always felt a little twitchy at 70+ compared to the 020s they replaced, but the fact that they felt vastly superior in the wet more than made up for that. Great tires, I'm looking forward to getting a set on the RST.
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2010 Triumph 1050 Sprint ST

[southeastpete]

i used pilot sports for a while. but then cos i do a few long motorway trips, i switched to pilot road 2's. they are amazing. grip is comparable for fast road riding (i have 0 chicken strips and regularly break limits, on straights and corners) i honestly havent found myself in much rain since i bought them, but many reports say they are the best handling wet tyre about. i've put about 3k on them and reckon they have at least that left in them.
best 230 quid i spent on the bike. expensive tyres, but when i consider that with the sports i would have had to change them already, its well worth it.
if you do the motorway hauls every now and then, its well worth it. i did 1000 miles in one weekend, just about all of them motorway miles. and they werent squared off one little bit, looked almost new!
i will shout the road 2's praises everywhere i go!

[The Tot]

Just about to have a go at the Dunlop Roadsmarts next month as the 020 is just about totally squred off after 6000 miles. My front, an 014 is squaring off too. I WOULD get the pilot road 2's, but I can't justify the extra 20 quid despite what other people have suggested.
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The Tot 2019 Z1000SX - 2007 R1
Never argue with autism

[calum17]

thanks for the replies
i have BT014's on the bike now, and the rear has done 3500 miles and is squared off a bit and the sentre of the tyre is probably past the limit.
i will look into the Pilot Road 2's if they are thought to be good for all sorts of riding, as i do push hard sometimes (probably not compared to other people, but i dont go easy either) but still ride on dual carrigeways a lot too, and with a good wet grip they are perfect for me (i spent 10 hours riding in the rain and high winds in may!)

thanks, i'll call into the local shop to ask about them ... i dont have any money, but if i know the price then i start saving if i find a new job.

[Keen]

Another for Pilot Road 2's....

I was swayed towards them after a great review in Bike magazine, definately grip better than either the bridgestones or the conti sport-touring tyres I had on before- the conti road attacks would spin up on drain covers or white paint when it was wet and they were cold, never had that happen once with the michelins. I've put over 6000 miles of reasonably hard riding (including 2 big touring trips) on them and they still look good with no squaring off.

Bike magazine (again) did a review of touring tyres more recently though and they reckoned that the new Pirelli equivalents are better, might also be worth a look
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"he who makes a beast of himself gets rid of the pain of being a man"- Dr. Johnson

[Mr Nice Guy]

[leatherpatche...]

I've used all sorts of tyres for commuting and general riding. When I bought my current bike it had a nearly new BT014 on the rear and that lasted under 1500 miles

Currently have Dunlop Roadsmarts on and I'm really quite pleased with them. They've done just over 3000 miles of mixed riding including 1500ish miles of dual carriageway, 1 track day and 4 or 5 'spirited' rideouts and they're holding up really well - very little squaring off. I was particularly pleased with their performance on the track where, for commuting tyres, they held their own really well. The centres were a little squirmy on hard acceleration but the edges were soft enough to do their job quite nicely.

After 1800 miles and immediately after trackday:

https://i280.photobucket.com/albums/kk181/leatherpatches/dunlop.jpg

Current condition, after about 3000 miles - loads of tread left and very little squaring off:

https://i280.photobucket.com/albums/kk181/leatherpatches/tyre3000miles.jpg

The one grumble I do have with them is the sheer bloody obvious nature of the change of compound from about 800 miles on, but that's a looks thing and doesn't really matter (you can see what I mean from the photos).

I reckon I'll get 6000 miles out of that rear and probably 10k out of the front, the way they are going. As someone who has never got more than 6000 miles out of any rear tyre on any bike I've had I think that's pretty good going. They cost me £199 fitted to bike for the pair. Would have been even cheaper fitted to loose wheels.

It's currently cool to say bad things about Dunlops and write them off without knowing much about them but I'll certainly give the Roadsmarts a [/img]

[Fisty]

Another for roadsmarts, Im upto 4500 miles on them with little sign of wearing!
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Quietly and consistently taking the piss.
TL1000R | Hayabusa | ZXR400 | TL1000S | Bandit 400 V
Fatter and faster than Fret

[neatbik]

Ive just replaced my rear bt014 with a bt021 and to be honest i find it very grippy, it feels better than the 014 did.
Ive still got the 014 on the front, and im finding it a lot more confidence inspiring

[ncrn]

Bt021's are great, I got them fitted to my NSR125, and before the gearbox went I was very very impressed with them, I only got like 300 miles on them though so can't comment on the last-ability.
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Past: 55 Sym Jet, 91 ZZR250, 03 NSR125R. Present: 97 ER-5.
https://www.nsr125.co.uk - NSR Owners forum.

[The Tot]

Update on this thread:

Just got roadsmarts fitted on my ZX6R and i have to say that profilewise, they're very stable in the corners and very good in the wet (lo and behold, the first ride i had on tyres whilst scrubbing them in was in the wet!). Once it dries out, i'll whip out my helmet cam and go for a ride but so far, on first impressions, they're not as sharp as BT014s and don't drop in so suddenly which is a good thing. I don't particularly like flicky tyres. The only problem for me is that i'd have to spend a good while getting rid of my chicken strips but difficult to do because the A7 is closed due to a landslide!
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The Tot 2019 Z1000SX - 2007 R1
Never argue with autism

[craigs23]

Thanks for the recommendations - I always thought Dunlops weren't too great in the wet - but that was based on GPRs I had fitted to a couple of bikes a few years back.

I know my 015s fitted as OE to my RR won't last the commuting miles I tend to put on the bike, so might opt for a pair of Roadsmarts on my next change - they also seemed to score quite well in Bike Magazine's recent test.

Anyone have a comparison between Roadsmarts and Pirelli Diablo Stradas?

[The Tot]

Craig (edit. just realised you already had the BIKE magazine) So for all the others that haven't read the articles and are interested, here they are. The only thing i've got for comparison was from the Bike Tyre test for sports tourers (they used a Triumph Srpint ST 06). I'll copy and paste what has been said about them... The only comparison i can personally make is between the roadsmart and the qualifiers (both good tyres, the profiles are pretty similar), and also with the BT020 (i hated them because they were too twitchy unless it was VERY warm and dry)

Right, for your interests here's what's been said on BIKE JUN08 Pg 177

Dunlop roadsmarts

Weights: Fr/Rear (kg): 4.5/7

Tyre temp after riding (not really relevant if its not under control situations): Fr/Rear (deg C): 48/74

Tester says: Similar in feel to dunlop's sportier tyres but with no obvious trade-off. Straight line stability is good and under acceleration over tarmac joins in the runway, they're fine. At the end of the runway, braking and turning in at 165mph feels remarkably stress free.. everything was under control. The dunlops are on par with the pirellis, both very sporty and suit the bike (triumph sprint ST) very well. Only time will tell how they stack up after a few thousand miles but the dual compounds of the roadsmart could give dunlop and advantage.

5 stars



Pirelli Diablo Strada

Weights: Fr/Rear (kg): 4.25/6.85

Tyre temp after riding (not really relevant if its not under control situations): Fr/Rear (deg C): 40/68

They feel like dedicated sportsbike tyres. They're easily capable of being better than the bike will allow. There's loads of grip, you can flick it into turns, it's accurate and you can turn tighter than you can think possible. In every area - on the brakes, midcorner stability, under acceleration and flat out - they perform perfectly. You can ride much harder if you choose to, than any of the other tyres allow. Outstanding potential.

5 stars


And just for comparison with everybody's favourite, Michelin Pilot Road 2CTs


Pilot road 2CTs

Weights: Fr/Rear (kg): 4.69/6.50

Tyre temp after riding (not really relevant if its not under control situations): Fr/Rear (deg C): 40/68

Fantastic. In all the areas we're considering - stability, confidence, feel and handling - they're really good. They were stable on all parts of the track and all surfaces. The steering was lighter than other sets which seemed to ehance "feel" and give the rider beter feedback. They let you turn in fast and maintain a good rate of direction change. a very good replacement tyre offering sporting potential with user friendly characteristics.



4 stars


Well there you go guys. Personally, it depends on your riding style. Many of the folk i spoke to said the the 2CTs were flickable BUT as i mentioned, i prefer stability. Besides the roadsmarts are usually 20 quid cheaper than the pirellis if you order off t'internet. But i can't image getting rid of the chicken strips on either tyre to be very difficult. I've seen the bright side after figuring i can lean my BT020's further than my qualis (probably after more experience on the bike) and it proves that sports touring tyres ARE credible, even on supersports - it's wise money, particularly when you're seeing 6000+ miles on a set if you've got a 600.

In the AUG08 edition of bike, pg 183, it says this about the roadsmarts, also giving them 5 stars - this time fitted onto a CBF600N.

"Very stable on the front end at higher speeds and good under braking and turning in is especailly good on the higher radius turns. These feel on the sporty saide and they're definitely less flex in the sidewalls than the bridgestone BT021 and definitely better all round than the continental road attacks. (tyres were blind tested). I'd rate them as my all round favourite here and you'd have to ride like a maniac on the road to find the limits of the tyres.

On an interesting note, for that particular bike, the dunnies were rated better than the diablo rosso and Michelin pilot powers (NON-2CT's)... so tyre choice is also dependent on bike's geometry and dimensions.

So conclusion being, the general concensus is that there's rave reviews going on about the dunlops and what with them costing the same price or possibly cheaper than the pirelli strada's, i'd say, give it a go!
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The Tot 2019 Z1000SX - 2007 R1
Never argue with autism

[The Tot]

Okay, so here's the story:

After the Sachsenring GP qualifying, I took a gamble and decided to get my kit on and go for a hoon. I reset the trip meter this morning when i first picked my bike up.

https://w3.bikepics.com/pics/2008%5C07%5C12%5Cbikepics-1351012-800.jpg

And then i went hunting for MY sort of roads, fast twisties... so i decided to head along the city bypass and head down the A703 road to peebles, then the A72 to galashiels before heading up the A7 to edinburgh... Loads of very tricky switchbacks that i took at >90mph... On the roads, had it not been for traffic, i would have averaged at least 75mph through the sections. I'm not bragging about anything, LukeVFR stylee here, because I think that i'm the kinda person that appreciates good scenery and a technical challenge by exploring roads that I ain't been on before... not a roundabout surfer or stunt maniac. Now if this criteria suits your style of riding, then i MUST IMPLY that the dunlop roadsmarts are THE tyre to get!

Overall impressions are that it's very netural and stable in the dry and you can really push it. On a few corners on the A7, i was going at least a good 5-7mph quicker through them than with my Bridgestone BT014/020 combo, such was the confidence that they inspired in me. You can feel like your riding on a magic carpet... the ride is very smooth and you wouldn't be unfluttered if you were going over cats eyes or other pebbles whilst cranked over (bearing in mind i have a riding style where i hang off LOADS and am very animated).

Needless to say, recommended scrubbing in periods are about 50-150 miles, taking it easy on the tyres... Fair enough, but this is a SPORTS TOURING tyre and i've managed to achieve this in the 1 1/2 hours i've had them on for!

https://w3.bikepics.com/pics/2008%5C07%5C12%5Cbikepics-1351002-800.jpg

Granted, i'm not trying to incite another argument or start a one-upmanship match regarding chicken strips, but merely just to indicate that if you had more skill than me (or balls) then i'm pretty sure that you'd have the tyre right on the sidewall within 75 miles, such is the level of grip they provide... i wasn't going to push it THAT hard because it was still damp in certain places and i was just getting used to how infinitely better these tyres were compared to the bridgeshites! That's about 5mm to the edge.. Its taken me 1 hour to do what took me 6 months to achieve on the bridgestones!


https://w3.bikepics.com/pics/2008%5C07%5C12%5Cbikepics-1351011-800.jpg

The front profile promotes plenty of leant over grip and increased contact patch.. It's much better than the BT014.


So, conclusion is.... If you have a sports bike, want to do loads of commuting miles, fancy riding in the damp or would think yourself as a bit of a "RegenMeister" like myself and want plenty of grip in the dry and have a 6000+mile tyre life, then these are MY tyres of choice! AS good if not MUCH better than the qualifiers which i had a year or 2 ago. Faultless fun. I may seem to have struck a nerve with some people when i mention Dunlop, Sticky, Confident in the same sentence... let me assure you they are leaps and bounds better than the D207s and D208s (i had 207s and hated them, then i read the rave reviews regarding the qualifiers and decided to give dunlop another chance.. disappointed with bridgestone, i went back to dunlop)... think about it this way, if you're a road rider, LOOK at which tyres are winning the IOM/Manx/NW200 races and make your decision form there because it's a good indication of the level of development which tyre manfacturers are pushing towards.
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The Tot 2019 Z1000SX - 2007 R1
Never argue with autism

[calum17]

[The Tot]

I'm saying that they are bloody good in the damp. There is no sense that you're going to slide your bike and the feedback through them is great through the roadwork riddled wet streets of edinburgh! Definitely one for the cards! Ideally, i'd need a rider that has ridden the aforementioned tyres on the same bike in the same conditions, but the performance reflects the rave reviews and its cheaper than the other choices... Dunlops no longer equal disaster or imminent death! If your a pansie dry weather rider who wants to waste their cash on supercorsas purely for mullering your local roundabout, i'd LOVE to see your faces when a well ridden bike with these tyres go around your outside! Cos i know WHEN it DOES rain in summer, you'll be crying home to your mummies whilst sports-touring-tyre clad boys will be able to surf the water confidently!
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The Tot 2019 Z1000SX - 2007 R1
Never argue with autism

[calum17]

haha. thanks for clearing that up for me
think i'll have to save up some money and get these tyres fitted. i ride all weathers, including a few hundred miles in some of the serious storms we've had this year and i find that the BT014's i have now give me very little confidence in the wet - even though they are ok and probably fine - they just aren't the tyre for me or my riding.

thanks for your review

[craigs23]

[The Tot]

Yeah Craig, i have to agree with your reasoning. I cannot fault the development in tyre technology over the last 2 years! You have sports touring tyres which just grip as well as supersport tyres AND have the added wet weather performance... gone are the BT020's, Michelin Macadams, Dunlop D220s and welcome the new wave of tyres.

Admittedly, my mate who had a duke 749 (he was in Bike about a couple of years ago for a tyre comparison test) suggested that the most suited tyres for him were the sports touring tyres. His order of preference were:

1) race tyres ( i think they were metzelers)
2) Sports touring (pirelli diablo stradas)
3) Road Sports (dunlop qualifiers)

So if that's the way it's going, i can see that ATAGNI/sunday riders have supersport tyres and daily riders/commuters with weekend blasts ride sports tourings. There is virtually no gap in them these days.

Leather patches... them tyres on your gixxer thou?
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The Tot 2019 Z1000SX - 2007 R1
Never argue with autism

[leatherpatche...]

Yep. Still loving them after 4500 ish miles. Wet grip is really rather good.