Considering 1st Track day (now with Write up of Race School)

[deanoet]

Was gonna post in the track day forum, but my main question is leathers so more general, so will post here.

I have done a Single Seater Experience at oulton park a few years ago, and that is about my limit of experience with these things.


The only thing holding me back is the leather requirement
That problem being I just dont have them. I assume no where rents them? Guess they would get pretty stinky quickly, maybe not a sensible option anyway

There are some on e-bay that look okay to me which are around £150 mark, do these cut safety corners? I dont wanna spend a fortune, but i equally dont want to risk myself, as i only have 1 body, and i kinda need it to be working

1 Piece EG
Must admit i quite like them, feel free to educate me though.


I will tag these on, while i am posting, but these are probably track day specific ones.

Which circuit would you recommend? I am in Blackpool, so Snetterton, as nice as it is, isnt really local. Done oulton Park before (short circuit) so kinda know part of that track

Own Bike, or rent one? Would prefer to use my own bike, as that is the point of a track day isnt it? So sub question: Pay extra for track day insurance? or not bother?

Where to book one? Direct through the Circuit? Through a site like
Trackday.co.uk or an experience company?


Thanx for any responses / general pointers
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CBT Passed 18th July 2007 : Previous Bikes> CG125 : Current Bike> Hornet 600 : PASSED DAS 30th Oct 2007
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[vt6]

If your not sure on leathers to buy or take your own bike or rent one etc, have you considered an experience day? I did ron haslam race school few week back, cant recommend it enough it was only a half day thing but it was awesome learnt a hell of a lot from it

[G]

Trackday forum is a better bet.

Personally I'd suggest a trackday is a better bet than an 'experience' day.

Good fit is still important for leathers.
What I've done in the past is buy decent leathers that are a little too big for me from ebay (around £70-£80) then get them altered to fit (£90-£100).
Very good 'value' for decent made to measure leathers.

I'd suggest using your own bike; take it easy to start with and only get faster a little bit at a time and you should be fine.

Book through the trackday company (in some cases this is the circuit) - the 'brokers' stick a lump on top usually.

While I'd recommend a simpler circuit, most seem to enjoy it what ever one they do.

[deanoet]

Thanx for moving the thread.
Was 50 50 on where to post it.

The leathers on that e-bay site come from preston, so i dare say i would be able to pick up, so no postage. Even if they wont let me try on exchanges should be simple enough. I didnt think of buying big and getting adjusted if needed, will definately consider that one.
What sort of makes are £70 - £90, any links?


I was looking on that site i posted in the OP and it said snetterton was good for beginners, which is why i mentioned it, not really helpful when it is the opposite corner of the country though.
On a related note is it doable in a day? Or will I be toast after riding the track and best to stay somewhere for the night? If i stop over it is of course more cost, but on the safety side i dont want to be riding back if it isnt safe to do so


Must admit this is starting to look affordable, was looking at the leathers in Honda and Yamaha and they are like £300, which is waay over my budget.


Why are some days really cheap? Like £45 for the track day? is it cos they are close dates?

Also on that website, looking at the list of days available:
3 Groups p/h, 105 db
What does that mean?

3 groups, easy enough, novice, inter, and advanced i assume

p/h??

105db i assume is the max allowed engine / exhaust noise

Some say "evening" as well, is that an evening only? or it goes on into the evening?

I cant see any explainations on the site, i may just be being blind though. (likely)
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CBT Passed 18th July 2007 : Previous Bikes> CG125 : Current Bike> Hornet 600 : PASSED DAS 30th Oct 2007
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[G]

Sorry, meant to say second hand on ebay - thus you can get good makes for £70-£80. Wouldn't trust new leathers for that money.

I'd agree Snetterton being good for a first trackday - a quite 'basic' track with fairly simple corners, so you're not having to link corners or brake and change direction mid-way around a corner.

Expect to be knackered for the ride home, but shouldn't be too big a problem. Might be worth finding somewhere to stay the night before though, but consider if that'll mean you do get more sleep or not.
A lot of circuits will let you camp at the track, usually for a small fee.

3 groups (easy, inters, fast) per hour as you say - and noise limit.
Evening sessions are just evening so offer limited time, worth it if it's not far to travel.

[dhaninugraha]

for trackdays, i'd prefer to ride my own bike...
agree w/ G, it's best to start out slow, since exploring the track and your bike takes quite some time...

as for leathers, personally i got myself custom-made... it costed me around 3,000,000 IDR (about 160-170 GBP)... really worth it, though... because i'd rather spend lots of money on leathers than spend lots on hospital bills, etc...
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Riding isn't dangerous, crashing is.

[deanoet]

Sorted

The Ron Haslam school on the 10th Sept, then hopefully Anglesey track day on the 12th.
Both birthday presents. \o/
The agreement was mum would pay if i did the raceschool first. So result. (the CBR600RR one, not the fireblade )
Me and a mate are going on them both, looking forwards to it

just need the leathers now
Going to go to a local shop and see what size I am, then look online
Will prob go for those Akita ones. The local Yam main dealer sells their textiles, so they cant be a bad make. plus they are the price that I can afford at the mo, IE not a lot. if they last a year or so i will get better ones if i like it.
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CBT Passed 18th July 2007 : Previous Bikes> CG125 : Current Bike> Hornet 600 : PASSED DAS 30th Oct 2007
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[Kickstart]

[vt6]

[deanoet]

Yeah, would rather get some training before i unleash myself onto the track for the first time

Really looking forwards too it
Really really really.


Side question
Mate who I am going with has got a flip up helmet, do these class as the required full face?
Not a problem for the Ron Haslam day as all kit is provided if needed, but for the trackday if he isnt allowed on it wont be good.
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CBT Passed 18th July 2007 : Previous Bikes> CG125 : Current Bike> Hornet 600 : PASSED DAS 30th Oct 2007
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[flossi46]

dont forget a back protector! and 1 that fits properly too. its as much importance as leathers and helmet.
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smile.................and everyone wonders what you've been up to
2011 is a ROSSI year

[deanoet]

Okay
Last couple of questions..
Promise...

Back protector That do the job? The ones in the shops are like £70 and upwards...


And boots.
I have proper bike boots, but they are the low ones, not full length ones. Will I be allowed on track wearing them?
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CBT Passed 18th July 2007 : Previous Bikes> CG125 : Current Bike> Hornet 600 : PASSED DAS 30th Oct 2007
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[MarJay]

[flossi46]

oh god back protectors are essential, there was a fella last year at the end of park @ cadwell, he's wishing everyday now that he had worn one, now maybe the outcome would n't have changed, but then again he might just still be walking had he wasted £100!
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smile.................and everyone wonders what you've been up to
2011 is a ROSSI year

[MarJay]

[G]

I've crashed a large number of times without an 'after-market' back protector and it's been fine (there has always been some kind of 'armour' in the back of my leathers, however). Remember also that in some cases back protectors can do damage where none would have happened without.

I'm not saying don't wear one, just don't expect it to perform miracles; as with everything in life it’s a gamble; the trick is to get a good idea of the percentages before putting your money down!

[flossi46]

well yea when you put it like that i guess there are pro's and cons, i know they never used to be heard of apart from like G said whats already in the leathers, but id still rather have one than risk it, then again im a wuss and a sucker for all the latest safety gear that comes out!
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smile.................and everyone wonders what you've been up to
2011 is a ROSSI year

[deanoet]

Had the Rom Haslam Race school today, quick write up of it...

WOW!!! Was ace.... !!!!


Much much longer write up of it (may need to get a coffee)
Iam not writer, so the format will be all over the place, so my apologies now.


Arrived in plenty of time, got signed in and kitted up and taken into the first briefing room,
Taken through the flags and their various uses, nothing surprising here, accept if someone comes off they will red flag it so the bike and rider can be recovered totally safely, yellow will only be used if someone runs wide and is rejoining so is going slow, which is fair enough.

Got shown the different corners, and explained the various cones. Red was braking, yellow was stop braking and turn in, green was apex and start accelerating.
The red was a guide, they dont change it for wet or dry days, so it isnt gospel.

First briefing ended and we were taken into the pits, given another quick brief about the day in general, there to have fun, ride your own pace, dont exceed your comfort zone, if you come off it is policy that they dont let you out again, so take it nice and easy and build up. Follow the instructor. if the person you are with turns out to be much faster or slower than you the groups will get reshuffled. The first session will be used mainly for the instructor getting to know our abilities and our confidence levels

Introduced to the instructor in groups of 2, me and my mate were kept together and the instructor was Dave Johnson from British Superbikes. (result)
He ran through a few basics and went through a few hand signals, hand to the left or right was keep left or right and expect to be overtaken, half way through the session he will put his hand up and spin it round so one at front slows down and swops place with the one at the back


So, first session
i was bike 6, (all CBR600RR), mate was bike 5, so he was at the front first.
Started off, nice and slow, following his lines, braking when his light came on (he was on a hornet 900). Nothing eventful till the second lap, just before going under the dunlop bridge over the crest the front wheel rose up into the air, which once i had discovered i hadnt had a trouser accident was a great feeling.
We were going quite well and came in as the 2nd group.
session finished with no further incidents

Debrief 1
Mate was doing good, good body position and he was happy with it.
I on the other hand was okay going to the right, but left i was leaning right and keeping upright, so got onto a bike they had on a paddock stand in the pits and he got me to lean to the right, bum half off the seat and told that is the position, same to the left, and he sorted my foot position out as well as i was riding like a "duck" with my feet sagging down, which is nice and comfy for road riding, but on a track i will catch my feet on the floor

He said the second session he will up the pace, if we are right behind him he will speed up, if one falls back we will match the slowest one of us, as it happened it was a case of "if he can go that fast, i must be able too" so we were quite even all through the sessions.

The bikes came back in from group 2 and we went out again


Session 2
I started at the front this time, and we went out second. Soon got into the rytham of it, he was indicating that i wasnt leaning to the left and tapped his foot, my feet had dropped again so sorted that out, and started to get the hang of it, finding it much easier on the Foggy Esses to switch from one side to the other, clipping appexes and generally (IMO) Riding God.
Got passed the first group and were going damned fast IMO (no speedo). Over the crest before dunlop bridge was getting really good wheelies off that, wheel landing and more or less straight into braking, setting myself up for the next corners with hanging off the seat, sit up, brake, off the brake at the yellow cone, lean in
Just coming up to the Dunlop bridge he indicated to the left, so pulled behind him and one of the Litre Fireblades wizzed passed so couldnt get the wheel off the ground that lap. The fireblades wheel was well offt he ground though, which looked damned impressive

We switched round half way through and the session ended, we were both buzzing totally. Just the feeling of speed and trust that you need in the bikes. thoughts like "okay is his brake light working, we really should have braked waaaay back there".

De-brief 2

100% improvement for me, body position was good and he was happy with that.
He said the only corner i am not great at is the last one as i cut in too early, follow his line. My line isnt wrong, but his line is quicker, carries more speed, and gets faster down the pit straight.

We went into the technical brief, which went through the corners in depth, when to brake, what line you need and WHY, saying if you get the first corner wrong you lose half your lap cos each corner flows, same after the Old Hairpin corner, smoothness is the key. if you feel you go away from the day thinking you could have gone faster it is a good session, over ride it and you will make mistakes and be slower.
In the Melbourne hairpin he said dont watch your knee, you will stay down too long and lose time, common mistake, yes your knee will be close..
Told not to think about gear too much, if in doubt go up, get a low gear and a clumsy fist full of throttle will launch you straight on, best to be slower and keep your confidence than picking the bike up waiting for the lift back to the pits


Went back to the instructor and asked what speeds we were doing, and he said, well 3rd redlines and 125mph ish and we were hitting 3rd redline very often.
he said round Hollywood, craner and old hairpin we were going about 100mph which is a good start for a first time. Didnt feel that fast really

Quick chat about his various experiences on the track, and his crash at knockhill and the bikes were rolling back in, so we got kitted up again and set off out


Session 3

I was in the lead again to start with, and as we finished first we went out first. Clear track and the pace picked up quickly. Came round Mcleans and he pointed to the left, surely not, we are much faster than last time, no one took over us, slowed right down, Shoulder check, where is my mate, no sign, oh s**t, hope he hasnt come off, keep following instructor right round coppice, mate appears again, thumbs up, thank god for that and we continue. Not sure what happened but we were going a fair bit slower than we were in the last session, can only assume my mate had a problem.
End of the first lap pace started to pick up again, faster and faster, started short shifting up into 4th round hollywood, craner and old hairpin so the throttle was less harsh as was getting close to redline in 3rd (over 100mph round corners O_o), so speeds were picking up round there, really dropping it into the corners now, hitting my toe on some of them as drop to the right feeling the peg push up as i touch it down, totally buzzing. Foggy esses throwing myself round the bike like a loon.

Instructor puts his hand up and we switch positions, pace keeps quickening as we get more and more confident, going over the crest before the bridge we are both getting wheels well into the air, then mate lands his, and panic brakes for some reason and hits the back brake, back wheel locks up, massive fish tail, me dowsed in white smoke, i anchor on more to give him space just incase. He gets round the esses okay, obviously a bit shaken up and the speed drops for a few corners again, instructor gives the "slow it down" signal after passing the start finish to indicate pushing too hard and we settle back into the routine, after a few corners he gives the thumbs up and mate returns it, so we settle back into the routine.

Getting to redline in 3rd and clicking up to 4th before we get onto the back wheel over the crest, but no consistency on that corner, wide or shallow, so I think, "right, gonna nail it this time"
Come out of Melbourne Hairpin and missed the braking point, by miles, mate is getting closer and closer, switch to the inside so i dont rear end him as no space on the outside, more brake, back wheel comes up "s**t", release the brake and pull the brakes again, back wheel up again "double s**t, this may hurt". Mate turns in, oh fook, consious decision that i have to miss him, so steer to the right (left hand bend) round the back of him and run waaay waaay wide, notice the marshalls on the inside of the corner in mid flow leaping up from their comfy seats, one preparing a red and one preparing a yellow flag, but i managed to get it slowed down enough and get round the corner.
Had that taste in my mouth when the adrenalin kicks in.
Got onto the main straight, instructor looking in his mirrors at me, mate looking around for me, instructor does the thumbs up, and i return it and we continue. heart going ten to the dozen down the main straight. Recompose myself and onto what turns out to be the last lap.
Uneventful lap comparitively, we did manage to catch and pass the Fireblade though, which was a nice feather in the cap

Discussion with the instructor and it turned out my mate had gone in too fast into mcleans on the first lap and panic braked, smoke all over the place, Instructor said he just saw a puff of white smoke and one minute he was in one mirror, the next he was in the other on the grass snaking about and he did well not to drop it. :-/

Then my moment. - Instructor said that when he saw my rear wheel lifting on that corner he throught he was going back to the pits with only one following, and that i did well not to just panic and launch myself head first off the bike.



Final debrief and the certificates were handed out. The instructor wrote a few lines and graded us out of 100
I got an 83, mate got a 78 \o/

Cant beat a bit of competition between friends, was mates consistency that let him down as he had a couple of moments and his position wasnt great for some of the laps. Still for a first time well impressed with how we did, leading the group we were in and lapping a fair few of them.



All in a very very good morning, really enjoyed it. Still buzzing from it now.
It makes you appreciate the skill that the pros have to control those things at race pace when they slide around in wet. Just a moments lapse in concentration and the rear wheel is in the air and you are wondering how cushioned that fence is, and that is no where near their speeds.


Would recommend it.
It may sound expensive, and it is (£269), but for the experience (no pun intended) it is well worth it though. really enjoyable morning and even though 3 x 15 min sessions doesnt sound like much, as my late braking moment proved i was getting tired, and my wrists were aching from all the weight on them from braking. Really feeling it now, achey back and really tired.

Really nice people there, totally geared towards you having fun, no pressure on you at all, go as slow, or fast as you like. instructor and group will be adjusted to suit your riding speed.

£19.95 and you get 5 professional photos posted to you. Will let you know what they are like when i get them

Only negative point is:
Didnt get my knee down.



next step..
trackday...
Didnt book this friday in the end at Anglesey.
So will have to wait..
Will prob still be sore from today though TBH...
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CBT Passed 18th July 2007 : Previous Bikes> CG125 : Current Bike> Hornet 600 : PASSED DAS 30th Oct 2007
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[Deano]

wow sounds good, i wanna do this but was thinking of doing california superbike school instead.

[Wafer_Thin_Ham]

[vt6]

Enjoy it then mate? lol. Sounds a similar experience to mine - fookin awesome day out. I ended up shuffled about after my first lap as i was with a v.quick lad and i was a bit slow for a first track experience, after I got paired with someone else they had to get a second instructor to take him as he wasn't keeping up, just shows the variety of skills there. Although i'm fair sure i was the most inexperienced rider there lol. My instructor was Guy Martin top bloke proper helpful with it all let us push as hard as we felt comfy.
I didn't get my knee down either just my toe sliders lol got some good pics from the day though.
On the whole its just a good fun day, had a laugh all the way through to the end brief think i scored 80's, good day

[Stelmer]

Sounds interesting. I can't wait to see the pics.

I wanna do one of these but i'm not sure if my back would last

[G]

CSS costs more but you get a lot more tracktime and more structured teaching.

To my mind the 'marking' is rather gimicky and points towards it being an 'experience day' rather than a bike event.

On the poor back - I've got a dodgy back, but I find it's much better after a weekend's racing than the same time at work in my office (I even have a kneely chair at my desk, though not in the lab)! I did try and get a bemsee round prescribed by my GP, but he wasn't having any of it .

[Deano]

[deanoet]

Yeah it was definately geared towards the experience rather than learning to race.

You found your own pace, you werent told that you can go much faster round here, and if you brake here and not here you will gain x seconds by here. You found your own level that you were comfortable with and that was all thagt was expected of you.

It was a chance to get onto the track though, not risking my bike and getting professional input as well during the time there.


Would recommend it for fun on a track in a controlled atmosphere.


So sore this morning, my shoulders and under my arms. Not used to the CBR riding position and then all that extra weight on my arms slowing down.
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CBT Passed 18th July 2007 : Previous Bikes> CG125 : Current Bike> Hornet 600 : PASSED DAS 30th Oct 2007
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