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Officer resigns over BNP badge

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owdamer
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Joined: 06 Oct 2004
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PostPosted: 12:37 - 03 Oct 2008    Post subject: Officer resigns over BNP badge Reply with quote
https://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/manchester/7650105.stm

Quote:
Officer resigns over BNP badge
A Greater Manchester police officer has been forced to resign after he was seen wearing a British National Party (BNP) badge at a football match.


Now I wouldn't vote for the BNP myself, but aren't they a recognised political party?
Would he have been forced to resign if it had been a vote labour badge? Rolling Eyes
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mackrilld
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Joined: 11 May 2008
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PostPosted: 12:43 - 03 Oct 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote
I personally think that is out of order freedom of speech anyone in his eyes proberly feels they will do a better job then labour!!!
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Mister James
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Joined: 10 Aug 2004
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PostPosted: 12:48 - 03 Oct 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote
The BNP has long been identified as an organisation that you cannot belong to while holding down a wide variety of government jobs - something that's been true under both Tory and Labour governments.

Regardless of the rights and wrongs of that ruling, it's made quite clear when you join up that it's incompatible with your role as an officer. In effect, he resigned because he had breached the terms of his employment.
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owdamer
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PostPosted: 13:07 - 03 Oct 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote
Mister James wrote:
The BNP has long been identified as an organisation that you cannot belong to while holding down a wide variety of government jobs - something that's been true under both Tory and Labour governments.

Regardless of the rights and wrongs of that ruling, it's made quite clear when you join up that it's incompatible with your role as an officer. In effect, he resigned because he had breached the terms of his employment.


I thought that was probably be the case. It just seems odd a policeman cannot be a member of a recognised, (if dubious) political party.
Can a white policeman join a black police association then?
(Only asking... Very Happy )
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Mister James
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PostPosted: 13:24 - 03 Oct 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote
Yes - although why you'd want to be associated with an organisation which just seems to be a pawn in upper-echelon power-plays I don't know.

Personally I've always found it a little inconsistent that it's usually only the far-right groups that are identified by name in these matters. That said, plenty of the lefty-equivalents fall under other banned categories - plots to overthrow parlimentary democracy, domestic terrorism, that sorta stuff!
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colin1
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PostPosted: 18:08 - 03 Oct 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote
I dont think far left groups have views which could make the public concerned about whether or not they would be treated fairly.

Many policemen have views which many non-white people would consider racist. Those views do affect the way they treat people.

Non-white people would have reason to be concerned if they thought particular policemen had these views. The BNP badge is advertising them and embarasses the force.

Political freedom, and freedom of thought are high ideals, but in reality not always practical in all situations.
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Didge
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PostPosted: 17:51 - 06 Oct 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote
colin1 wrote:
I dont think far left groups have views which could make the public concerned about whether or not they would be treated fairly.


Really? Tell that to BNP supporters. Who makes all the noise and fight the police at so-called anti-nazi demos?
That's right. Followers of the extreme left. How democratic of them. In fact, the far left are the least democratic of all groups.
Left wing politicians are renowned for their love of control. Always have, always will.

colin1 wrote:
Many policemen have views which many non-white people would consider racist. Those views do affect the way they treat people.

Non-white people would have reason to be concerned if they thought particular policemen had these views. The BNP badge is advertising them and embarasses the force.


Apparently, he was not wearing a BNP badge. It was a English flag badge, available from many places, including the football ground he was in at the time.

https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/c/1070445_cop_resigns_over_bnp_badge

C&P from the letters. There are a few more explaining the facts among the letters from his (ex)work mates :-

I continue on here to tell people he didn't wear the badge, and he isn't a supporter of BNP. I wish I could go into a lot more detail regarding this case, but I'm not sure of the legal standpoint on this. Stuart Janaway was wearing an England football badge which wasn't visible as to exactly what badge he was wearing on the video footage (I know... I've seen it). The fact he was accused of it being a racist badge by somebody who had a feud with him meant the police had to take the allegation seriously. The GMP had no solid proof what this badge was and chose to believe it was their only course of action to make themselves look good and increase their statistics.

I have known Stuart for over 20 years and if he had these views I wouldn't let him near my family. I am a loyal friend, but not a friend who would accept racism. If he believed these things I would no longer wish to associate with him. He's a decent bloke who people are passing judgement over because the GMP have made what I believe to be a huge injustice.

The fact that the GMP wish to banish somebody from duty for "believing" him to be wearing a political parties badge is another issue altogether. Whilst the BNP is clearly not my thing, people on here have a point that even if they continue to believe this... it's hardly a crime to lose your job over due to the fact that this party can actually win seats during elections... proving them to be a legitimate political party... despite not having values that most of us agree with. salfordred1
4/10/2008 at 09:18

colin1 wrote:
Political freedom, and freedom of thought are high ideals, but in reality not always practical in all situations.


Says a left-winger, and confirms what I said earlier in this post.
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Itchy
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Joined: 07 Apr 2005
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PostPosted: 18:08 - 06 Oct 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote
I dunno I think colin is right in that democracy freedom etc are actually really inefficient, if we were run as a benevolent dictatorship we would in all probability be a much more advanced civilization.....

Just look at the 700bn USD thrown at the banks! ..

or the 110bn

(for now) bail out for the banks , if they can build the CERN accelerator for 7bn , for 50bn they could buy up Libya and the Sahara, and cover it with heliostats and solar panels with gigantic DC cables under the med , which would guarentee our powersupply for the next 50 years and completely remove our dependency on oil...

Saudi would rot so would the Russians , China would probably copy us with the Ghobi desert and Russian frontiers.
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carlnicholson...
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PostPosted: 22:21 - 06 Oct 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote
It's wrong that a person should face disciplinary procedures in their employment for their personal political views, but despite the best efforts in recent years by the BNP in making the public perceive them as a pukka political party, the fact remains that the actual public perception of them is of a fascist, neo-nazi, extreme organisation. Whether this is accurate is no longer the case.

Companies or public offices cannot be seen to be associated with such views which are so well established in the mass public pshchie. (Please forgive the typo!)

Remember, you never get a second chance to make a first impression. If the BNP want to be taken even a bit seriously by the mainstream then they must disband and reform in a totally different guise with different views and making very different noises.
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Mudskipper
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PostPosted: 22:52 - 06 Oct 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote
Why does this thread make me think of Jewell? Thinking
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chris-red
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PostPosted: 00:38 - 07 Oct 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote
Mudskipper wrote:
Why does this thread make me think of Jewell? Thinking


Because he is out of a job?



The guy should have been sacked,


"Acting Assistant Chief Constable Terry Sweeney, head of the Professional Standards Branch, said: "Item six of the Chief Constable's Order of 2004...makes it clear that officers are banned from being members of the BNP, Combat 18 or the National Front.

"This requirement extends into the private lives of police officers and police staff." "



If you can't follow the rules...


But I do not agree with the rule in principle if they are recognised as a political party why should you not be able to support them.
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Didge
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Joined: 02 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: 21:33 - 08 Oct 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote
chris-red wrote:
Mudskipper wrote:
Why does this thread make me think of Jewell? Thinking


Because he is out of a job?



The guy should have been sacked,


"Acting Assistant Chief Constable Terry Sweeney, head of the Professional Standards Branch, said: "Item six of the Chief Constable's Order of 2004...makes it clear that officers are banned from being members of the BNP, Combat 18 or the National Front.

"This requirement extends into the private lives of police officers and police staff." "



If you can't follow the rules...




Apparently it was a English flag badge, not a BNP badge, so he was following the rules. Read my earlier post.
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Mudskipper
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Joined: 22 Aug 2006
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PostPosted: 08:23 - 09 Oct 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote
Didge wrote:
Apparently it was a English flag badge, not a BNP badge, so he was following the rules. Read my earlier post.


'Apparently'. Any firm source for that? I've had a look but can't find anything.

I suspect that there is more to this story than a badge - but the badge angle is whats been latched onto by the press.

If not, then:
Quote:
"Acting Assistant Chief Constable Terry Sweeney, head of the Professional Standards Branch, said: "Item six of the Chief Constable's Order of 2004...makes it clear that officers are banned from being members of the BNP, Combat 18 or the National Front.

"This requirement extends into the private lives of police officers and police staff." "


There is no mention anywhere of him actually being a member? Confused

Abhorrent as I find the BNP, in this case it doesn't seem like he deserved to be sacked.
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Old Thread Alert!

The last post was made 17 years, 335 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful?
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