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DVLA Tossers

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NSR Mick
World Chat Champion



Joined: 26 Jun 2005
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PostPosted: 10:20 - 23 Feb 2009    Post subject: DVLA Tossers Reply with quote
Apparently it's an offence not to inform DVLA that you've sold a vehicle. Twisted Evil

Partly my fault for not sending the V5 back but a letter lands on my doormat informing me I've commited an offence.

£55 pound fine £35 if paid quickly, I'm sure I've forgotten to send a V5 off before and nothing came of it.

What are they going to come up with next to get more money?
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Itchy
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Joined: 07 Apr 2005
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PostPosted: 10:25 - 23 Feb 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
Nowt comes of it if the other party sends a V62 asking for a new V5c thus informing the DVLA that the vehicle has been sold.

If you send the V5c off yer supposed to wait 2 weeks and a thanks for telling us you've sold your vehicle letter comes through the post. If you don't you are supposed to give them a call.

Infact I have to phone the DVLA today to see if they have registered the transfer of ownership of the Africa twin.
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NSR Mick
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Joined: 26 Jun 2005
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PostPosted: 10:31 - 23 Feb 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
Itchy wrote:
Nowt comes of it if the other party sends a V62 asking for a new V5c thus informing the DVLA that the vehicle has been sold.


It does now it would seem.
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truslack
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Joined: 08 Apr 2007
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PostPosted: 12:15 - 23 Feb 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
Phone them / send a letter and say it was sent on XX/XX/XX. They'll drop the fine.
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D O G
World Chat Champion



Joined: 18 Dec 2006
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PostPosted: 12:29 - 23 Feb 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
truslack wrote:
Phone them / send a letter and say it was sent on XX/XX/XX. They'll drop the fine.


Yup, I'm sure the 'pup will be along in a minute and tell you the bit of legislation which means that your duty ends at putting the letter in the post, which of course you did.

Think he may also have some stats on how many letters the PO and DVLA loose in a year, which can be used in your favour, or summat.
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truslack
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Joined: 08 Apr 2007
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PostPosted: 12:32 - 23 Feb 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
They tried to do me with the £35 fine when I sold the Senda 50 - quick phone call saying it was sent the day after I signed the bike over, and that they had lost it internally or the post office had lost it and it was sorted.
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Finglonga
World Chat Champion



Joined: 27 Jul 2004
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PostPosted: 17:18 - 23 Feb 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
Been like that for a few years now.
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st3v3
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Joined: 16 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: 08:43 - 24 Feb 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
Damofo D.O.G. wrote:

Yup, I'm sure the 'pup will be along in a minute and tell you the bit of legislation which means that your duty ends at putting the letter in the post, which of course you did.
When I broke my moped up for parts years back, I sent the log book in marked scrapped although they said they never received it, we went on disputing it for quite a few months and their standing point was that I had no record I'd sent it(only 1st class), I said that's a given but they have no proof they haven't recieved it....

I ended up paying a 30 quid fine just to hear the end of it, fine was supposed to be 60 or something but the pleb putting the payment through got confused and debited the wrong amount, I just said that's fine, but I aren't authorising another debit so that's paid as far as I'm concerned. Cool
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sickpup
Old Timer



Joined: 21 Apr 2004
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PostPosted: 11:27 - 24 Feb 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
Damofo D.O.G. wrote:
Yup, I'm sure the 'pup will be along in a minute and tell you the bit of legislation which means that your duty ends at putting the letter in the post, which of course you did.


Strange you should mention that I'm working on something inline with this at the moment.

Universal postal union act to which the UK is a signatory states that within the UK once you post a letter it becomes the property of the addressee.

Section 7 of the interpretations act 1978 states that all you have to do is stamp, address and post the letter and it is deemed served in the normal course of mail unless DVLA refute service which is quite hard for them to do as they weren't expecting the letter.

I also now have proof that DVLA are losing post internally after having signed to receive it.

DVLA stating that you need confirmation letters from them as the only acceptable proof that they have received postal items is of dubious legality. One might consider that they are writing new laws which of course would be illegal under the 'Bill of rights' as they are to all intents and purposes the crown in this matter.

I would also like to see a scan of the letter they have sent as I believe they may have failed to follow the law in sending it.
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NSR Mick
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Joined: 26 Jun 2005
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PostPosted: 11:38 - 24 Feb 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
sickpup wrote:

I would also like to see a scan of the letter they have sent as I believe they may have failed to follow the law in sending it.


I'll dig my scanner out.
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sickpup
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Joined: 21 Apr 2004
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PostPosted: 11:41 - 24 Feb 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
Cheers mate.
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NSR Mick
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Joined: 26 Jun 2005
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PostPosted: 15:49 - 24 Feb 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
Scan of letter. Sorry it's not great my scanner is playing up.
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lydanial
Brolly Dolly



Joined: 12 Jun 2007
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PostPosted: 22:09 - 24 Feb 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
i had one of these in january, i phone them and they informed me that as i had not recieved a letter comfirming the transfer of the bike that i was responsible.

i pleaded that i had sent it and that the post office must of lost it..

didnt work so paid £35 as i cant be arsed fighting over something that i have no clue over and would probably lose.
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stinkwheel
Bovine Proctologist



Joined: 12 Jul 2004
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PostPosted: 22:31 - 24 Feb 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
So folks. What action exacty, other than to whinge at you or hire someone to whinge on their behalf, does anyone think the DVLA are going to take over £35 or £55?
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Kickstart
The Oracle



Joined: 04 Feb 2002
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PostPosted: 22:39 - 24 Feb 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
Hi

From experience, issue you with a summons for the small claims court (for SORN).

All the best

Keith
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MinhDinh
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Joined: 01 Jan 2005
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PostPosted: 22:40 - 24 Feb 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
I didn't even read your post, but I agree with the title.

DVLA Middle Finger
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stinkwheel
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Joined: 12 Jul 2004
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PostPosted: 23:28 - 24 Feb 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
Kickstart wrote:
Hi

From experience, issue you with a summons for the small claims court (for SORN).

All the best

Keith


Nah, they farm that out to Moorcroft recovery these days who, if told assertively enough that they can only have their £85 when they pry it from your cold, dead hands "Will have no option other than to referr the matter to their court division.". They then do exactly nothing.

My oppinion is that these letters are nothing more than a fishing expedition. They count on most people sending them a cheque.

If it were me (and admittedly it isn't), I'd totally ignore the letter and if they issue a small claims summons, go to court and pay it if/when ordered to. Doesn't count as a CCJ on your credit record if you pay it right away when ordered to.

I haven't heard of them ever prosecuting someone for the actual offence they are accused of, only taking them to court for failure to pay the "Out of court penalty." as if it were a debt, which seems a bit screwed up if you ask me.

It also implies to me that they are deeply uncertain of their legal position with regard to actually prosecuting for the offence itself.

EDIT: It occurrs to me. This £55 charge is actually worded in law as an out of court settlement, as is the £85 one for SORN offences. I don't see how this can regarded as a debt? I may go for this tack in the unlikely event I am ever actually taken to court for it

viz The alleged "debt" was actually was an "out of court settlement". At no time did I say I would take them up on this offer. Therefore they had two options when I didn't pay it. 1) Take me to court for the offence (now to late to do so) or 2) Drop the matter.

If you are offered a fixed penalty notice for speeding and choose not to accept it, the police don't chase you for the £60, they take you to court for speeding.
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“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.”
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.

Last edited by stinkwheel on 23:39 - 24 Feb 2009; edited 1 time in total
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Kickstart
The Oracle



Joined: 04 Feb 2002
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PostPosted: 23:37 - 24 Feb 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
Hi

I did get a court summons for a SORN rip off penalty. No sign of a debt agency.

All the best

Keith
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Itchy
Super Spammer



Joined: 07 Apr 2005
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PostPosted: 23:37 - 24 Feb 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
Doesn't the small claims court have a £200 deminis limit anyway?.
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Kickstart
The Oracle



Joined: 04 Feb 2002
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PostPosted: 08:53 - 25 Feb 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
stinkwheel wrote:
viz The alleged "debt" was actually was an "out of court settlement". At no time did I say I would take them up on this offer. Therefore they had two options when I didn't pay it. 1) Take me to court for the offence (now to late to do so) or 2) Drop the matter.


Think the offence is not done as a court prosection, more a debt in payment for services. Hence they think the time limit is irrelevant (well, unless you can delay them for 5 years to stop a small claims court claim).

More tempting for fun would be to try and get them for demanding money with menaces. Or by trying to avoid court for attempting to pervert the course of justice.

All the best

Keith
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Skudd
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Joined: 01 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: 09:15 - 25 Feb 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
I like the start of the letter saying it appears that, then goes on to say if you are responsable for the crime. It is stating as fact something it is not sure of.


The moon appears to be made of cheese, are you the person responsable for eating the moon on toast.

The letter implies the "crime" has been committed and wants to know who is responsable. It doesn't try to find out if a crime has been committed, just takes that for granted.

Just tell them you sent everything off to them at the time of the sale.
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Walloper
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Joined: 24 Feb 2005
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PostPosted: 11:43 - 25 Feb 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
DVLA are Welsh Fuckers. They are based in Swansea purely coz they required idiots to run the show for the government.
I have met nice people from Wales loads of times so where do they find those absolute tossers who work for DVLA.
They must have an 'Ineptitude Test' for the positions......

Mad

End of Message!
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sickpup
Old Timer



Joined: 21 Apr 2004
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PostPosted: 13:24 - 25 Feb 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
They've allowed time for service which is new with DVLA, guess I'm causing them problems.
There's still the answer that you sent the V5 and anything that happens after you posted it is down to them.
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NSR Mick
World Chat Champion



Joined: 26 Jun 2005
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PostPosted: 14:15 - 25 Feb 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
I'll go down the I've posted it route. I'll report back anything that comes of it.
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NSR Mick
World Chat Champion



Joined: 26 Jun 2005
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PostPosted: 15:55 - 25 Feb 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote
Rang DVLA today and I have to put it in writing that I informed them of a keeper change. Wink

Although reading the letter I may have come accross a flaw.

the letter states

Quote:
failure to notify DVLA forthwith of the change of keeper is an offence


Now seeing as the new keeper applied for a new V5 did he not fulfil that requirement??
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