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Alergic to Chlorine (pools) and Biological washing powder?

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G
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PostPosted: 13:55 - 14 Apr 2009    Post subject: Alergic to Chlorine (pools) and Biological washing powder? Reply with quote

A while ago I worked out I was allergic to biological washing powder.
Ended up with an itchy back than went from a slightly mottled affect in patches on my skin to a load of spots.
Changed to using Fairy non-bio and not have a problem since really (apart from in a Hotel a while ago.)

After using the swimming pool at my gym, seems to have a similar issue.
Wonder if it may actually have been a chlorine bleach-style thing in the washing powder.

Anyway, anyone else suffered from this?
Suspect there's nothing I can do about it, but it'd be nice if I could take some magic pill to stop it Razz.
I have got some anti-chlorine shower gel, but not sure how much difference it will make. Also going to make an effort to shower more thoroughly before I get into the pool.[/list]
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Kwaks
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PostPosted: 17:16 - 14 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here is a link that shows some related articles

https://allergy.wegohealth.com/chlorine-allergy.html

Some good info on there
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cagiva gezzer
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PostPosted: 19:04 - 14 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Try changing pools as some pools have horrendous control parameters for water chemistry.

More scum in the pool -> use more chlorine to get desired levels of active chlorine -> higher levels of chloramines in the water -> more chances of being itchy.

Try a newer pool with better control or even a pool that uses chlorine dioxide instead of chlorine.

*sits here smelling of bromine from playing with cooling towers . . *
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G
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PostPosted: 21:38 - 14 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cheers for the link kwaker. Had a read through and those seem to relate to 'standard' chlorine allergies, while mine seems to be a bit different - I don't really suffer any of the 'normal' symptoms.
Seems to be a 'type 4 skin allergy'.

Unfortunately this is not only the gym I'm paying stupid amounts of money for, but more importantly the one that is about 150m from my work!

Going to be in a beach-side hotel in a few weeks, so thought I'd try and brush up on my, frankly, terrible swimming a bit before getting there.

Might try and get myself to the Doctors (bit harder with new job, though), but doubt they'll offer any thing useful apart from 'avoid stuff that makes you itchy'.
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instigator
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PostPosted: 21:57 - 14 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Beach side hotel eh, off somewhere fancy?

I developed an allergy to Biological Washing powder early last year which resulted in the symptoms mentioned by yourself. My reaction was almsot immediate, feet were burning and hands went a very bobbly red. Visible effects were mostly restricted to my hands and feet though - perhaps it only happens when the clothes are wet. Switched back to non-bio and was fine. Haven't found out if it was Bold or Persil that caused it though.

Am fine in all swimming pools though - having said that I don't swim much! Laughing
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Handsome
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PostPosted: 22:01 - 14 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can't use Biological washing powder as I go the same as you G, washed a load of my socks and boxers in it once, never again !...

Strange though as I never used to be allergic to it, now using Non-Bio... Thumbs Up
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G
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PostPosted: 22:06 - 14 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not really - Teneriefe for a week. Lots of fun stuff to do not too far away; a couple of years ago they'd have all been cheap too, but sadly not now with the state of the pound Sad.

I used to be fine with Bio, only a few years ago that I found I wasn't. Took me a bit of time to work out what it was, too.

I shall try going for another pool-swim tomorrow, making an effort to wash well before and then after with this anti-chlorine stuff and see how it feels. Unfortunately the symptoms don't show for a few days, so it's hard to tell.
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Phil_G
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PostPosted: 22:41 - 14 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

cagiva gezzer wrote:
Try changing pools as some pools have horrendous control parameters for water chemistry.

More scum in the pool -> use more chlorine to get desired levels of active chlorine -> higher levels of chloramines in the water -> more chances of being itchy.

Try a newer pool with better control or even a pool that uses chlorine dioxide instead of chlorine.

*sits here smelling of bromine from playing with cooling towers . . *


In Swimming pool terms, Chloramines are created when you have a nitrogen based compound in the water this combines with chlorine. This then creates what are known as "Chloramines" and gives rise to a vapour on the pool surface which also gives the horrible chlorine smell that is so commonly associated with public pools. The only way to get rid of chloramines, in a pool, is to add more chlorine . This is a slightly generalised answer, however.

G - ask to see the water test records of the pool you use, and be sure its not something to do with perhaps a shower gel you use at the gym. Please PM me if you want, as I work for a swimming pool company.

PH should at all times, and irrespective of sanitiser be between 7.2-7.6
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yambabe
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PostPosted: 22:45 - 14 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

You could try an anti-histamine before going in as well, something like Piriton might help to subdue the symptoms a bit.

Or cover yourself all over in goose grease like the channel swimmers used to use? If the water can't actually get to your skin through the slimy layer it can't react............. Wink
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Phil_G
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PostPosted: 22:49 - 14 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

babyyam wrote:
You could try an anti-histamine before going in as well, something like Piriton might help to subdue the symptoms a bit.

Or cover yourself all over in goose grease like the channel swimmers used to use? If the water can't actually get to your skin through the slimy layer it can't react............. Wink



GRRR.. Do that, and you won't need the gym as you will have the pool engineers chasing you out the building with a big stick.. that grease will play havoc with the filters! Razz
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panrider_uk
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PostPosted: 00:08 - 15 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

babyyam wrote:
You could try an anti-histamine before going in as well, something like Piriton might help to subdue the symptoms a bit.



Piriton are very good for itchyness.
I get fairly drowsy an hour or so after taking one so also good sleeping pills Smile

Mark
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Wafer_Thin_Ham
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PostPosted: 11:04 - 15 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

G wrote:

Might try and get myself to the Doctors (bit harder with new job, though), but doubt they'll offer any thing useful apart from 'avoid stuff that makes you itchy'.


They may offer you emoillients to help clear it up, although that's more an ecexma thing. Maybe worth rubbing some E45 or similar on it for when it flairs up.

I'm the same. It's all about the Fairy Non-Bio.

Never thought I'd see a thread about washing powder on a rough tough bike forum. Laughing
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Annabella
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PostPosted: 11:23 - 15 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

panrider_uk wrote:

Piriton are very good for itchyness.
I get fairly drowsy an hour or so after taking one so also good sleeping pills Smile

Mark


Exactly what I was going to say - it'll work a treat to stop the itching but if you fall asleep swimming and drown then you'll have the lovely Babyyam to blame Wink
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Charlie
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PostPosted: 19:30 - 15 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Different swimming pools use different types of chemicals, it should depends on the pH levels of the water, they should pick the opposite (e.g. acid tap water, alkaline disinfectant) so moving to a total different place could be worth it.

Also ask how it is disinfected as there are different methods, chlorine is one way, using ozone is another and UV is starting to get used to. So might be worth asking around local pools if you want to start swimming. Although all of the pools will still probably need to use chlorine to an extent because ozone and UV aren't active in the pool all the time.
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Louise
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PostPosted: 20:51 - 15 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

few years back I had major problems with my back.
Was really itchy - to the point it felt like I was itching one part and it felt like 'things' were running down my back so I had to itch there.
It was very weird - but I am allergic to bio powder and its not a very nice thing Thumbs Down
I had to buy my own washing powder at my old place of work (they would wash the chefs whites) but wouldnt swap powder for me Rolling Eyes
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Phil_G
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PostPosted: 22:01 - 15 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

ds55 wrote:
Different swimming pools use different types of chemicals, it should depends on the pH levels of the water, they should pick the opposite (e.g. acid tap water, alkaline disinfectant) so moving to a total different place could be worth it.

Also ask how it is disinfected as there are different methods, chlorine is one way, using ozone is another and UV is starting to get used to. So might be worth asking around local pools if you want to start swimming. Although all of the pools will still probably need to use chlorine to an extent because ozone and UV aren't active in the pool all the time.


Hi,

You will commonly find that public pools are run on alkali disinfectants. Calcium Hypochlorite (powder/tablet) and Sodium Hypochlorite (liquid) are the two commonest chlorines in use at the pools i deliver to. The only acidic chlorine is what is known as Stabilised Chlorine. More expensive and more commonly used on pools subject to a lot of sunlight as the acidic element (cyanuric acid) serves to slow the loss of chlorine to sunlight.

Indeed it is good to use a sanitiser that is of an opposing ph to the tap water, as it reduces the PH correction needed and thus chemical use. However, this is by and large a point that is overlooked on the presumption that the PH doser will do it's job and maintain PH at the correct level. The only time we commonly make this choice is on domestic spas. It's also noteworthy that the tap water more often than not (in my area anyhow) is around 7.4. Any variation from this and you tend to find its being pulled from a bore hole and is not of mains origin.

You are quite correct that a lot of public pools are moving towards ozone or UV but I am yet to see a system utilising these that doesn't recommend using a chlorine for background sanitation (certainly UV isn't terribly effective against stuff like legionella but great at other things), so there has been a movement back toward "traditional" chlorine as it's simply so damned effective as a broad spectrum disinfectant. Indeed, this point was discussed in an industry magazine about a month ago.

I don't fully understand how the UV and ozone aren't effective all of the time though. Could you elaborate on that point for me?

Thanks

Phil
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Charlie
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PostPosted: 10:29 - 16 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bear in mind I am only NPLQ qualified and have only picked this stuff up while at work from pool plant qualified staff.

I think the idea (well my idea) to it not being active all the time was that if a certain part of pool water isn't constantly being cycled round then areas could form which haven't had ozone and UV treatment to them, hence a bit of chlorine is needed to try and cover these areas.

Although saying isn't the water split into layer and only certain bits get the full effect of the chlorine?

From what I have heard hot tubs are the worst types of water to be, I am surprised I'd still think about getting in one after being told what they are like.

The water near us used to be lovely however they recently changed it which resulted it being mixed with all the water in the area... so we now get slightly chlorine tasting tap water. The pH of our pool is often about right- 7.45 most of the time which is meant to stop your eyes from sting as thats the same pH as your tears (apparently), and that is on the doser and when I do a pH test of the water.

Like I say this is only stuff I have tried to pick up from more qualified people at work.
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Phil_G
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PostPosted: 20:14 - 16 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

ds55 wrote:
Bear in mind I am only NPLQ qualified and have only picked this stuff up while at work from pool plant qualified staff.

I think the idea (well my idea) to it not being active all the time was that if a certain part of pool water isn't constantly being cycled round then areas could form which haven't had ozone and UV treatment to them, hence a bit of chlorine is needed to try and cover these areas.

Although saying isn't the water split into layer and only certain bits get the full effect of the chlorine?

From what I have heard hot tubs are the worst types of water to be, I am surprised I'd still think about getting in one after being told what they are like.

The water near us used to be lovely however they recently changed it which resulted it being mixed with all the water in the area... so we now get slightly chlorine tasting tap water. The pH of our pool is often about right- 7.45 most of the time which is meant to stop your eyes from sting as thats the same pH as your tears (apparently), and that is on the doser and when I do a pH test of the water.

Like I say this is only stuff I have tried to pick up from more qualified people at work.


With you now, that is entirely correct ref UV. You do find though, that the big commercial pools, they are left on 24/7 and as such, you wouldn't find that to be a real issue. Bare in mind also, that once the chlorinein your water is depleted that a pool will rapidly stagnate with no circulation in a very similar way.

7.4 is bang on the middle of the common operating range for the pool and what I would always personally aim for. It is correct that it is around the PH of your eye as well.

Hot-tubs, when properly sanitised are fine. The one thing to bear in mind is that the ratio of person to water is a lot higher than in a pool, as well as they are run hotter, so when the water goes "wrong" it happens very quickly.

I *think* what you mean about the water being split into layers is that you find something like 3/4 of the bacteria in the top foot (I think) of the pool.


Phil
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G
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PostPosted: 23:04 - 16 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cheers for the thoughts, all.

Interesting to see that quite a few others suffer from the biological powder thing too.

Other pools are out; this is the gym I pay stupid amounts of money for, for a start; more importantly, I go there five times a week and it's pretty much right outside my work.

It's definitely not a shower gel or similar as I've been using those showers when going to the gym for the last few months and it's only after using the pool that I've had issues.

It seems that what I'm getting isn't the 'classic' reaction to chlorine, so it could be the chlorine (pretty sure they do use some kind, though it doesn't seem that strong), could be something else.

Being silly, I forgot to take my newly-acquired anti-chlorine wash on Wednesday. Will go again tomorrow lunch time and have it ready in my top-box now!
I made more of an effort to wash well before and after and I think it may have made a difference, but it may also be that I've only been once in the last week or so and going again will make it worse.

Antihistamines do seem to have a decent affect on me - I need a lot less than the 'reccomended' two nytol generally. After breaking my leg I had some nerve damage in my right foot. They gave me some (tiny) antihistamine pills. Taking one at 10pm, I'd still get up around 9am after going to bed a bit after midnight, go to lay on the sofa (I did have a pretty beaten up body at this point still) with my laptop, then a couple of times I just lay there still awake with the laptop turned on but not logged in lying on my chest. Lay there until about midday, not asleep, but with no energy/enthusiasm to move enough to enter my password in the laptop.
Decided it probably wasn't worth it, especially as my foot didn't seem to be any better in itchy hurtyness for it.

I think I'm probably going to take my own sheets to this Hotel as I'll be there for a week and don't know if they'll use bio, be annoying if I have to avoid the Hotel pool - or more annoying if half way through I just come up really badly in itchy spots Sad.
Hopefully sea and sunshine might help a bit.

Not too bothered about starting swimming - I suck at it anyway - just trying to get a bit of practice in before the Holiday really, and a bit of variation in exercise is always good.

In the past I've found I got a bit of a spotty back - sunshine helped and worked out it was mostly from getting sweaty (push biking etc) then not showering 'tiill late that night (I'm aloud to be smelly in my own home! Razz) However, this definitely isn't the same symptoms as above.
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The999Kid
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PostPosted: 13:01 - 21 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

You could get a doctor to prescribe you some Chloramphiramine tablets... We (ambulance service) use it via IV to treat anaphylaxis, and it does the job fairly well (aside from the 40 - 60 min activation time)

Give it a bash!
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