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BULLDOG BASH 2009

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killa
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PostPosted: 09:57 - 05 Aug 2009    Post subject: BULLDOG BASH 2009 Reply with quote

So....whose going?

If you fancy hooking up at some point gimme a shout on PM or something. Will be going Friday morning and straight on the beers and rock. Cool Thumbs Up
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AngelGrinder
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PostPosted: 09:59 - 05 Aug 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

I will be going up on the Friday afternoon and will also soon be on the beers!

Anyone been before? Is it much of a show during the day, or is it just about being drunk and watching bands?

I'm up for hooking up with people if they want, just give me a shout!
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Peirre oBollox
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PostPosted: 10:56 - 05 Aug 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

AngelGrinder wrote:
Anyone been before? Is it much of a show during the day, or is it just about being drunk and watching bands?

theres various stuff to do, take a lot of money though, be prepared to pay over the top, for over priced poor quality food & beer
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NickD
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PostPosted: 11:08 - 05 Aug 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Peirre o`Bollox wrote:
AngelGrinder wrote:

theres various stuff to do, take a lot of money though, be prepared to pay over the top, for over priced poor quality food & beer


Beer is a little dear, but always ice cold (nothing to stop you taking a bit of your own as long as it's not visible). Not sure how POB rates cans on quality? Food's not at all bad generally, and for that kind of event, in the UK, I reckon it's reasonably priced. If you've never been before there's tons to do, you'll struggle to fit it all in. Best just to chill and take it as it comes... just do what you fancy, when you fancy.
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NickD
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PostPosted: 13:21 - 05 Aug 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Also probably worth a mention is the fact that, having failed to get the licence revoked, the filth have promised to be as annoying and obstructive as possible to bikers going about their lawful business. So if your smoking habit lands you slightly outside the law from time to time say, you might want to ensure that any materials are unlikely to be found when they search you for the nasty weapons that they know we all carry.... or little camping knives etc, when they can't find anything signifiicant to justify the huge waste of public funds.

There are a few basic but useful bits on the website at https://www.bulldogbash.eu/bulldog-bash-2009-stop-and-search.html on stop and search gubbins. Might be worth having a read through in case you're one of the unlucky ones.

If you make it as far as the site without getting thrown in the cells for possesion of 20 vicious looking tentpegs, I'll be the heavily tattooed fatty looking like 80% of everyone else there. Mr. Green
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Peirre oBollox
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PostPosted: 14:09 - 05 Aug 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cans of beer I can drink, my local offy sells em for around 50p a can. however my preference is for a cold draft beer in a glass (or at least a plastic glass)
The restrictions placed upon the licence for event such as the bully (as with any other event) usually prohibit you taking your own cans to the rally. Anyone want to speculate on the cost of cans from the bar onsite? 4x £5? 4x £10?

I guess I`ve been spoiled recently, having done a couple of rallies in spain & portugal, where draft beer at the bar in the beer tent is the norm (60-70 cents each).
1 such rally of 500+ people, the 25 euro entry fee got you 10 tickets entitling you to:
(all you can eat)
a BBQ & drinks the 1st evening
a hog roast later that night (with beer).
breakfast (sandwiches, fruit, fruit juice, coffee or beer) the saturday morning.
11`s saturday (a BBQ & drinks)
lunch (2pm ish saturday) BBQ pork & chicken
another hog roast later that night (with beer).
an invite to a local resturant, which laid on a free (all you can eat) 3 coarse meal, (with as much wine as you can drink)
breakfast (sandwiches, fruit, fruit juice, coffee or beer) the sunday morning

oh, and don`t forget the T-shirt & rally patch that I got when I paid my entry fee
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NickD
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PostPosted: 14:26 - 05 Aug 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Peirre o`Bollox wrote:
Exactly what I knew he'd say...


Hence my inclusion of the line 'for that kind of event, in the UK'. Rolling Eyes
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NickD
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PostPosted: 14:26 - 05 Aug 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Double post..... Sorry! Embarassed
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Peirre oBollox
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PostPosted: 15:15 - 05 Aug 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

nice mis-quote Rolling Eyes

Though the latter part of my previous post about foreign rallies was seperated from the main text about the bully
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yuri2085
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PostPosted: 17:11 - 05 Aug 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Reading the stuff about section 60, I wonder if you are stopped for a search and police officer is filming you what right you have to avoid being filmed.
They are allowed to film in a public place, they have the power to stop you for the search, but they do not have the POWER to film you.

By mixing the two previous rights/powers they recieve a third; does anyone know if we as citizen have any powers to avoid the filming as we are FORCED to be in the place that is being filmed.
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yambabe
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PostPosted: 18:11 - 05 Aug 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Still wavering. Embarassed

Wasnt going to cos my bike is still in bits and due to go back together on Sat but I don't actually need to be there for the rebuild........... Thinking

Now the weather is looking pretty good too, especially for Sat, and I have my other bike to go on, and it is the Bulldog, hmmmmmmmm.............
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Clanger
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PostPosted: 18:17 - 05 Aug 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Too big an event for my liking.

Though I know plenty of peeps who are going, plus both Adam and DJ-X are doing separate gigs in the dance tent...though it's 'rumoured' they may do a set together as LAB-4 (if you're lucky). Cool
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Peirre oBollox
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PostPosted: 19:30 - 05 Aug 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

babyyam wrote:
Now the weather is looking pretty good too, especially for Sat, and I have my other bike to go on, and it is the Bulldog, hmmmmmmmm.............

Don`t hesitate, pack your stuff and go.
tbh if I wasn`t being sent to prison this weekend I`d consider going myself
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Mister James
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PostPosted: 19:47 - 05 Aug 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

yuri2085 wrote:
Reading the stuff about section 60, I wonder if you are stopped for a search and police officer is filming you what right you have to avoid being filmed.
They are allowed to film in a public place, they have the power to stop you for the search, but they do not have the POWER to film you.

By mixing the two previous rights/powers they recieve a third; does anyone know if we as citizen have any powers to avoid the filming as we are FORCED to be in the place that is being filmed.


Whoah whoah whoah! 95% of the threads on this site seem to include a quick post on how it's legal to film anything you damn well please in public - so why the sudden turnaround when it's focused at you?

You can film the police, the police can film you - it works both ways.

You aren't forced to go to the Bulldog Bash - rightly or wrongly (and I lean towards the latter) we all know it's going to be heavily policed, so you know what you're letting yourself in for.

Sect. 60 also allows police to remove disguises or face coverings - so don't think that slapping on a Burqa is going to help either!
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yuri2085
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PostPosted: 19:53 - 05 Aug 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am not suggesting they should'nt be allowed to film, but legislators have not choosen to give them the power to force you to be filmed, you are allowed to move away from an officer filming you and no rules saying you have to submit to filming while being searched, or a picture etc.

So you being filmed while being searched is clearly a loophole that should not exist. This isnt about what power should be legislated for its about what to do about powers that ARENT legislated for.

The police dont own the bulldog bash, and yes you cant stop them filming you walking into the entrance, this is not a problem because you were not held there against your will.

I know you think the government and people emplyed by the government should have ultimate power in all ways against us lesser folk. I personally think wanting to be somewhere for 3 seconds as I walk through is different to being forcebly held there.
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Mister James
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PostPosted: 20:07 - 05 Aug 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

yuri2085 wrote:
I am not suggesting they should'nt be allowed to film, but legislators have not choosen to give them the power to force you to be filmed, you are allowed to move away from an officer filming you and no rules saying you have to submit to filming while being searched, or a picture etc.

So you being filmed while being searched is clearly a loophole that should not exist. This isnt about what power should be legislated for its about what to do about powers that ARENT legislated for.


You're talking gibberish.

They are allowed to film you - that isn't a power, you have exactly the same right. They are allowed to search you - that is a power, and one you can hardly say you haven't been warned about.

There is no loophole there - it's just how it is!

Quote:

I know you think the government and people emplyed by the government should have ultimate power in all ways against us lesser folk.


You know nothing of the kind because I don't. I just take issue with sloppy, hypocritical arguments.

Edit

For the record, I don't see the point of antagonising a large portion of the Biking community in this particular case - as others on here have pointed out, the recent murder was carried out on the motorway miles away, Section 60 searches at the gate ain't gonna stop that. I agree with owners of the 'Bash that it seems to be something of a personal crusade on the part of the senior plod in charge of the operation.
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Dr. DaveJPS
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PostPosted: 20:36 - 05 Aug 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

i think where people take umbrage with the situation is that in the example where you film a police officer they have the right to seize and inspect the images. Then, as i am under the impression, delete them in the suspicion that they may be used for terrorist activities as they identify officers.

Whereas the motorcyclists do not have this right to protect their identity and have no idea what the images taken will be used for or how long they may be stored.

(for the record i don't like backpatchers as they are just aping the american gangs, instead of following the british sidepatch route)
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AngelGrinder
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PostPosted: 21:14 - 05 Aug 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Police I will just be doing my best to ignore, I've got nothing to hide and have told my friends not to bring anything that might anooy them.

If we all just go about it as much as possible without them there, we can only build support for getting rid of the over-policing of such an event.

I think the police are trying to get support from the locals by winding them up as much as possible, so the locals eventually say 'We don't want to bulldog bash here anymore, it ruins our town for a few days'.

Hopefully they will realise that the bikers aren't the problem, it's the police!

I have no problem with the police being there to oversee and to be there just in case, but going overboard like this is just rediculous, spending over million to police a show? How much do they spend to police certain concerts that people have been stabbed/killed at?
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Mister James
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PostPosted: 21:22 - 05 Aug 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

DaveJPS wrote:
i think where people take umbrage with the situation is that in the example where you film a police officer they have the right to seize and inspect the images. Then, as i am under the impression, delete them in the suspicion that they may be used for terrorist activities as they identify officers.


Police have the right to seize as evidence anything they think IS evidence of an offence. Stop'n'search laws have not changed this in any way.

Sect. 43 and 44 of the Terrorism Act 2000 give the power to inspect photos carried/taken by a person being searched to decide if they are likely to be of use for the purposes of terrorism.

A picture of dancing copper at Notting Hill would obviously not fall under this, nor would tourist snaps or even you filming a copper as he searches you - the pictures must be an offence under the following:

Quote:
Section 58a of the Terrorism Act 2000

Section 58a of the Terrorism Act 2000 covers the offence of eliciting, publishing or communicating information about members of the armed forces, intelligence services or police.

Any officer making an arrest for an offence under Section 58a must be able to demonstrate a reasonable suspicion that the information was of a kind likely to be useful to a person committing or preparing an act of terrorism.

It should ordinarily be considered inappropriate to use Section 58a to arrest people photographing police officers in the course of normal policing activities, including protests, as without more, there is no link to terrorism.

There is however nothing preventing officers asking questions of an individual who appears to be taking photographs of someone who is or has been a member of Her Majesty’s Forces (HMF), Intelligence Services or a constable.


There is no power to delete ANY pictures, and an order from a copper to do so is unlawful. If there is an offence committed they need to be arresting you - and if there is an offence, deleting the pictures would actually be destroying evidence which is an offence under another act!

Of course - they are quite entitled as private citizens to ask you not to take photographs of them, and to plead with you to delete any you have already taken - it's up to you whether you are nice and comply, there's no law forcing you to! Wink

Quote:

Whereas the motorcyclists do not have this right to protect their identity and have no idea what the images taken will be used for or how long they may be stored.


A data protection/FoI request will give you such information - more than a copper being filmed will get from most people.
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NickD
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PostPosted: 21:24 - 05 Aug 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

AngelGrinder wrote:


Hopefully they will realise that the bikers aren't the problem, it's the police!



I reckon they're already well aware of that. Obviously there are a few dissenting voices, but support from the local authorities and people has been overwhelming.

Every year there's a charity stall on site run by the local Rotary Club, staffed by sweet white haired old dears, and selling fruit, milk, etc.... y'know, healthy stuff. And the most damning criticism of the local constabulary I heard all weekend came from one of these sweet old dears.... They know what's going on.
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Mister James
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PostPosted: 21:25 - 05 Aug 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

AngelGrinder wrote:


Hopefully they will realise that the bikers aren't the problem, it's the police!

I have no problem with the police being there to oversee and to be there just in case, but going overboard like this is just rediculous, spending over million to police a show? How much do they spend to police certain concerts that people have been stabbed/killed at?


Concerts get shut down or heavily policed if there is likely to be violence.

As I've said before - a large number of police officers are bikers, and I bet plenty have attended the Bash themselves. This particular spat seems to have been orchestrated at a fairly high level by one or two senior plod. Even the event organisers accept that the police on the ground are not the ones causing the problem.

https://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/coventry_warwickshire/8185705.stm

Perhaps the HA should convert to Islam - might solve their problem!
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yuri2085
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PostPosted: 21:35 - 05 Aug 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok not going to bother going into it again (I didnt say filming was a power).
If you are being stopped, you do not have a choice about where you are..you cannot avoid a camera if you do not want to be filmed. That is all.

Ok sorry. I juest read your replies, it seems you were taking offence to my hipocrytical argument, when actually what I did was ask a question; which was whether it is possible to avoid being filmed while being searched..and tried to make an explanation why you should be able to.

You say it was hipocritical but you cant film a police man if he is not in front of your camera. (assuming he wont call you a terroist etc but we wont go into that)
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Mudskipper
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PostPosted: 21:41 - 05 Aug 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Say what you may about back patch clubs in general, but I for one am very grateful that the HA have enough power to challenge these egotistical morons. Thumbs Up

Shame for the smaller organisers that they don't. Sad Mad
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NickD
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PostPosted: 21:45 - 05 Aug 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mudskipper wrote:


Shame for the smaller organisers that they don't. Sad Mad


Indeed, the repercussions for some excellent shows, and some decent people behind them, have been severe. Mad
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Mister James
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PostPosted: 23:00 - 05 Aug 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

yuri2085 wrote:
Ok not going to bother going into it again (I didnt say filming was a power).


Earlier, yuri2085 wrote:

By mixing the two previous rights/powers (filming and stop/search) they recieve a third


Wink

With regards to my comments on hypocrisy - I apologise for the fact I didn't make it clear I was referring to the forum at large; not just you.

As you'll probably be aware, there have been plenty of threads bemoaning various incidents where police have been dicks and tried to curb people filming them - I lumped you in with a lot of people whose opinions you might not share in full.

It is not possible to avoid being filmed by the police in a public place - the exception probably being where they ask you to remove more than JOG - Jacket, Outer garment and Gloves. This has to be done out of public view - and I'd assume that also applies to being filmed as it's a dignity/privacy thing.

You are entitled to ask them not to - just as they are entitled to ignore you.

You are also entitled to ask them (probably by post) what pictures they have taken of you at an event, what has happened to them, and what they intend to do with them.
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