Some newbie questions

[Spurs19]

Hi, I recently purchased a DRZ400 and have been trying out a bit of green laning. However I quickly realised it isn't quite as easy as I thought it would be and that I didn't really have a clue what I was doing. So I thought I would ask here as you all seem like pretty knowledgable chaps.

What is the correct riding style? I noticed most seem to stand up, is there a reason for this? I tried doing it but just felt really unstable (and i was only going about 10mph ) so sat back down. I covered the clutch the whole time just incase something went wrong, anything else I should be doing/not doing? Should I lower my tyre pressure?

Also, helmets. Why is the enduro style helmet/goggle combination preffered to a 'normal' helmet?

Sorry if this all seems a bit obvious to you but any shared info would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers

[garyd]

Watch some trials riding you will see why we stand up ,greater balance,try to adjust your tickover so that it will pull on a closed throttle ,then all you have to do is steer,rather than opening/closing throttle all time,dont be rushed ,go at YOUR pace ,any knowledgable lead rider will account for your lack of skills and keep the pace accordingly,and will wait at every lane end and even back track after not seeing you follow,just enjoy it ,
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CRF230 all you need

[Imonster]

Disclaimer: Not an expert by any means...

Re: Helmet.

Offroad lids are more practical for the purpose. In a road lid, you get very hot, very quickly and your vision is reduced greatly.

RE: Standing up.

Two reasons really to my mind.

First is that if you sit on the bike over the rough stuff you only have two points of suspension - front and rear. If you stand, you then have your elbows and knees predominately, but also shoulders and ankles. The better the suspension is, the smoother your ride becomes

Second point is that, if you're sitting down and the bike wants to take a dive, then you've given yourself nowhere to go and you'll follow the bike towards the deck before you've realised what's happened. If you're standing, you can let the bike move about beneath you, whilst still maintaining balance. I can't really explain it in more detail than that, apologies.

Standing up feels awkward to start off with - make a conscious efort to stick your pelvis forward and make sure the balls of your feet, not the insteps are on the pegs. You may need to adjust your brake and clutch levers (normally up a bit), and gear and brake pedals to feel comfortable.

Perservere with standing up on the rough stuff mate - it makes sense in the end
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Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable.

[Imonster]

[imanupstart]

[Tonka]

I started green laning in July and managed to find two clubs locally (TRF and an independent) not sure if there is anything near you? You shouldn't really ride alone and if you can, get out with other people as you can follow them - their line and their riding style.

I consider myself to have been really fortunate, as I have been riding 2 or 3 times a week since with people helping me learn. The standing up had me flumoxed too but I had a couple of rideouts where I followed the rider in front standing when they did and just perservered - it really does make a difference. I will still sit for the rutted muddy bits as it's good to have your feet low to stop the bike going over, also I'll sit if I lose a bit of confidence, but it's happening less and less.

See if you can find a club and some kind people who are keen to encourage new riders, as having a mentor has made such a difference to me and I'm now trying wherever I can to help other new riders to our club. It's a bit like the blind leading the blind but at least they can get out at a slower pace and hopefully get their confidence
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'The core of a man's spirit comes from new experiences'
Suzuki SV650S (Clean); Yamaha XT250 Serow (Dirty)

[G]

Note the big thing with standing up is to keep your arms and legs bent slightly and relatively 'relaxed'. This means they do act as springs to absorb the bumps, rather than transferring them straight to your torso.
Bar risers and playing with the position of the bars can help while doing this.

There's a good series of articles available to download on the internet on 'enduro skills' (pdfs of a magazine I think). Have got them saved *somewhere*, but not sure where at the moment.

[Imonster]

[garyd]

The idea of the higher idle makes very good sense ,were not talking 4000rpm here
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CRF230 all you need

[Imonster]

Honestly not trolling here. Why does a higher idle speed make very good sense offroad? I'm always willing to try new ideas, but as said above, to try and ride a slow downhill would be tricky if the bike still wants to pull?

If the bike starts to run away from you, you can either clutch in, which won't slow it down - or brake, which won't slow it down cos the bike's still pulling...

Even on flat lanes, I reckon you being in charge of the throttle has got to be a better option than the bike being in charge of it?
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Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable.

[Flipsta]

The use of the open helmet (without a visor) for me is ALOT easier to hear the bike. With my full face helmet with visor I can barely hear my bike when amongst other bikes or when on the road, cars.

Since my bike doesn't have a rev count or anything, I really have to play by ear and having an MX helmet helps a bit.
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-Yamaha DT 125cc RE 2007 (right) >> Decal facelift
-Peugeot Jetforce 2009 50ccIce-Blade
-Peugeot Speedfight 2 100cc

[Spurs19]

Thanks alot for all of the responses. Some really helpful stuff there

It seems like the whole standing up business would be useful on bumpier road/faster speeds so its something i'll have to keep practicing. Still not sure about the idle revs and not decided if i should raise them or not, i'll have to have a think about it. It seems like the helmet does have its advantages, can't really justify splashing out on one at the moment though.

Tonka: After looking there is a TRF meeting about 30 miles from me so will have a look at that.

G/Imonster: If you happen to stuble across those articles it would be greatly appreciated if you passed them on.

Thanks again everyone, any furter ideas/advice is welcomed!

[Flipsta]

I haven't got a proper MX helmet yet, I still have my full face and a cheap motocross one. Father x-mas should hopefully be able to bring me a nice fox one .
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-Yamaha DT 125cc RE 2007 (right) >> Decal facelift
-Peugeot Jetforce 2009 50ccIce-Blade
-Peugeot Speedfight 2 100cc

[ben_wheely]

[.....]

As the others have said - stand up, it really does help. Also, if the bike starts sliding through mud etc then get on the power a bit/a lot depending on the situation. It doesn't seem natural at first but does work.

And one last thing, keep your mouth shut through deep puddles

Where do you live? There might be some people on here local to you to show you the lanes.

[drzsta]

Im always standing in mx and on the trail, not only does it give you that more control with your elbows and knees, it allows the bike to go where it wants - so its that much smoother if that makes sense - so it does most of the work under you. just remember to grip the bike with your knees.
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Current Bikes - BMW S1000RR ‘17 & KTM 690 SMC-R ‘12

[Blue_SV650S]

[drzsta]

oh yea, and remember to ALWAYS LOOK AHEAD, NEVER look down at your front fender, if your seeing your fender your looking too low.

Trust me on this - it makes everyone faster, and you dont get the wobble.
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Current Bikes - BMW S1000RR ‘17 & KTM 690 SMC-R ‘12

[Spurs19]

ok, after reading all of your advice I went out again today. I found standing up alot easier going at slightly faster speeds (although never realised how much it makes your legs ache after a while) and looking as far ahead as possible was a big help.

I still didn't really feel comfortable when standing up though, as i am stooping forward too much. The bike already has bar raisers:

https://img35.imageshack.us/img35/2600/dsc02598x.jpg

although i'm sure its largely just down to practice.

I found that releasing the throttle made things alot harder generally so tried to keep it open as much as I dared to (can't help but feel I should have started out on something a bit smaller).

All in all it was a much more enjoyable experience than previous times. So thanks for all the help.

Oh and a pic of the bike for anyone interested (bound to get comments about tyres (Dunlop Trailmax) but bike is used mainly on road)

https://img502.imageshack.us/img502/9703/dsc02597o.jpg

[G]

Well, yes, it does seem that to make things a hell of a lot easier, proper off-road tyres would be the most obvious step .

Have you looked at how much a set of spare wheels would cost you? May even get some with tyres already on.
With a mx stand it'll take under ten minutes to change.
When you come to sell, can sell them separately and hopefully not lose much if anything.

If you've got a way to ride to get to your dirty play areas, I've been really liking the MT21, which seems to handle road stuff (does make a bit of noise, but doesn't wear excessively from high speed) and handles the off-road nicely, especially at low pressures.

On that, if you're not letting your tyres down, that will help also. Try around 17 psi - don't go too low if you don't have rim locks.

[Blue_SV650S]

[Spurs19]

You are probably right. I have some off road tyres but they are such a pain to change. Had a look on ebay for some wheels but all seem very expensive. Any ideas on roughly how much a set would cost? There were some for around £350 which seemed a bit steep to me or is that about right? Cheers.

[G]

Seems very expensive for a DRZ. Think the last set I got for a KTM (there are more wheels around, but they are more expensive to start with) was a bit over £200 I think, including discs and some knackered tyres.

The more you change tyres the easier it gets, but I still haven't done it enough to make it convenient. Does seem to be easier with the tubliss system I've got on the 690, but that costs a fair bit too.

On ebay I found:
4 bids, £51

£190 buy it now

Supermoto wheels £395

£100 1 bid including good condition knobbly tyres

[Blue_SV650S]

Having to change tyres every time you want to go laning would be a right PITA ... especially with tubed tyres ... so I don't even see that as an option. Swapping over a set of wheels every time is very doable though!!

If you go to a specialist DRZ site, there might be wheels from other bikes (DR600, RM?) that are either a direct fit or just need some spacers - as I said, you can widen your market by looking at both a set of offroad and SM wheels.

Like G said above, it seems a lot for a set of wheels as an outlay, but in the long term, you probably won't lose money on a set as they probably won't really de-value significantly come time to sell again.

I'd expect a mint pair for £300, you would be lucky to get a set (that are straight and with discs) for <£200 I reckon ... unless the wheels are shared with a plethora of other Suzuki bikes!!
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The purpose of life is to fight maturity.

[Spurs19]

G - thanks alot for finding those links to the ebay sales. Very useful. Unfotunately several of those have sold now but I will keep my eyes open from now on.


It seems like a sensible option to get a second set of wheels and if they don't really de-value much then I don't really have much to lose.

Thanks again for the help.