Sold a car - Problems with buyer

[Groove]

Short story...

Sold a 12 year old car on the 5th of Feb this year for a sum of £500.

We purchased the car around Oct of last year with a fresh MOT and put on 2k miles between then and the end of December when all the snow started and we stood the car up as i was out of work and we didnt need 2 cars.

The car had a couple of faults, 1 being a worn tyre and the 2nd being a comon problem with Renaults which was the central locking didnt work so you had to input the code manually. We was told by the guy we called out that it was probably the reciever in the roof and to get a new one but we never did.

At the end of Jan i used the car a handful of times probably covering 80-100 miles or so just nipping around places/going for interviews and such and listed the car as it was with everything mentioned we knew of.

The buyer phoned me today saying that the car has been in a garage the last 2 weeks and the car is unfit for the road.

The reasons being

the worn tyre,
the ECU aparently needed to be changed for the central locking to work
manifold aparently cracked (i knew nothing of and would have thought i would noticed that
petrol started pissing out of a pipe after driving it around for a week
a extensive oil leek from rocker cover (there was evidence that this would have been true at one point as there was a burn mark on the manifold cover when we got the car but it never got worse and looked to be an old stain - no leaks where found or noticed in the time we had it)

I never did any work on this car as as far as i knew it just wasnt needed. Most i ever lifted the bonnet for was to top up the washer water.

He said he wants to be reasonable about this and said he was going to scrap the car and he wanted half the money back on it. Seeing as i dont have any money being unemployed with my wifes earnings not covering rent/bills/food etc let alone a car we thought was fit for use i can not do this.

When he came for the car he looked under the bonnet quickly and he had it running the whole time he was there (20ish mins) although he never test drove it (i did ask him if he wanted to but he declined).

He had a reciept for the car which he asked for which had milage, date and amount of with 'sold as seen on it'. We both signed it. Does that mean anything? Although he has the only copy.

He has now said he will be seeking legal action. Where would we both stand? As far as i knew the car was safe and in a good working condition and as described yet he thinks at best it was spares/repair even though we had been using it up till the day he took drove it away.

We have bought cars before that had things go wrong with them, one of which boiled over and over heated 20 miles from there house on a 100 trip home. Anoying but these things happen.

Any advice?
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|| Past: 1991 Kawasaki ZXR 250 ~ 2003 Honda CBR 600 F Sport ~ 2004 Kawasaki ZX6R B1H 636 ~ 1999 Yamaha R1 ~ 1999 Kawasaki ZX6R J ~ 2004 Kawasaki ZX6R B1H 636 ~ 1998 Honda VTR1000F Firestorm ~ K1 GSXR 600 Track bike ~ K6 GSXR 1000 ~ 2006 Speed Triple 1050 || Current: 2005 R1 https://www.adrucore.co.uk

[Kickstart]

Hi

Not certain, but think with a private sale he doesn't have a leg to stand on. Think the only way he would have any leverage would be if he asked you about a specific problem and you had denied it.

All the best

Keith
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Traxpics, track day and racing photographs - Bimota Forum - Bike performance / thrust graphs for choosing gearing

[Steve H]

Unless you’ve misdescribed or misrepresented the vehicle in any way, shape or form then the purchaser’s shafted.

Roadworthyness is a matter that the Police might look at but 99 times out of 100 as it’s purely a private sale they won’t get too excited as it's a civil matter.

If the purchaser wants to take legal action then that’s their prerogative I’m afraid - nothing you can do about it. Whether their claim is valid is a different matter.

Caveat Emptor.
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Mellow Yellow
The BCF Top TEN - 2010, 2009, 2008, The Original.

[Feasty]

1) In future when you sell a vehicle ALWAYS do 2 receipts identical and get both of you to sign both of them, 1 copy for seller, 1 copy for buyer...

2) He doesn't have a leg to stand on and is just testing you with the legal blah-d-blah... What the hell does he expect from a car bought for £500 and not even test driving it!!?

- the worn tyre, *you told him about*
- the ECU aparently needed to be changed for the central locking to work *you told him about*
- manifold aparently cracked (i knew nothing of and would have thought i would noticed that) *could have cracked after purchase*
- petrol started pissing out of a pipe after driving it around for a week *happened after purchase*
- a extensive oil leek from rocker cover (there was evidence that this would have been true at one point as there was a burn mark on the manifold cover when we got the car but it never got worse and looked to be an old stain - no leaks where found or noticed in the time we had it) *happened after purchase*

Sold as seen means exactly that...
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Previous: Aprilia Habana Retro 50cc (beauty), Yamaha SR125 (fell apart), Honda XR125 (nippy little commuter), Honda SLR650 (Geewhizz), Yamaha Diversion 900S (Smoooooth) written off courtesy of a stupid escaped horse.
(7 year gap), BMW F650 (Relaxing ride). Aprilia Caponord ETV1000 (Big and bold). Yamaha FZS600 (got me in trouble too quick!).
Current: Yamaha TDM 900 (Comfy, light but big, power when needed).

[defblade]

There's been a lot of similar threads on Pistoheads recently - seems to be the latest scam

Always seem to decline a test drive, then ring a week or two later demanding refunds/contributions for faults; often seems to be all phrased very nicely. Try to play on people's good nature and sense of fair play. You won't ever get to see the car, either, if you offer to fix or wish to inspect the claims.

Tell them to Foxtrot Oscar and that you will be recording any further contact in support of a harassment claim.

Seems harsh but they are taking the ****
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Honda Varadero 125cc => Suzuki Bandit 650 33bhp => 77bhp =>
BMW K1200R Sport 163bhp => Aprilia Shiver GT 750 95bhp

[Annabella]

Got to agree - it seems to me to be compeltely taking the pee.

The cost of legal advice etc would surely be far more than £250 - for goodness sake my solicitor seemed to charge about that for 10 minutes

Just ignore any other communication from them. They're lucky you still have the same phone number/contact details.
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Avast! Pirates ahoy!
I did Cadwell!
www.bikepics.com/members/bella

[Ste]

None of those problems are anything to do with you. If the faults do exist and the person is not just making them up, you've no idea what they've done with the car in the time that it's been in their possession.

But luckily, sold as seen means exactly that.

[D O G]

Agree with everyone here.

Not your problem at all and no way for him to get any money from you legally. Do not entertain him.

I test drove my current car up and down a 300m stretch of road, before I bought it, but not long enough to hear the knackered wheelbearings. I heard them after 500m of driving off having bought it. My problem, I just kept on going. Anyone who tries on what this guy is doing is a total nobber. Tell him that.

[Phoenix]

Tell him to sod off, it's a £500 car and the risk of buying privately is that you're not buying from a dealer so don't have the same comeback unless you can prove something major was deliberately concealed, in cases like that no reciepts with "sold as seen" will make any difference and is apparently often seen as an attempt to exempt you from any comeback. However as you did not conceal anything major and nor can he prove it, plus he's had it for nearly a month he can go jump. He can take all the legal action he wants, but for a £500 car you can bet he won't, all talk no show.

[MarkJ]

Threatening legal action over a £500 car

If all these faults have occurred after he bought the car then he is very unlucky, however that's a risk of buying privately which he will have known of and he's lost out. It's hard lines, if he didn't want the possible risk of being out of pocket by the "sold as seen" clause he should have paid more and bought from a dealer.

[Misc]

I made a very similar thread last year. Sold a car to these horrible people & they started to send texts saying how it's leaking oil, broken down & how they need a few hundred to cover the breakdown service cost.

Take the above advice & ignore them, we did after a while they'll get the message.

[Redoko]

Looks like he's trying to pull a fast one on you.

He's also BSin about legal action.



No worries mate.
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"Let's face it, this is not the worst thing you've caught me doing."
Sudika Sportsman SK50QT > Gilera DNA50 > Honda CBR125 RW7 > Kawasaki Zephyr750 > Suzuki GSXR600 > Honda Hornet CB600F '51

[iooi]

So the car has spent the last 2 weeks in a garage being tested for the faults.....
He's going to scrap it and only wants £250 back......

Yea right.

He will have spent more than that on even a back street garage looking at the problems.....

Tell him he is/will Cee Uou Next Tuesday

He drove it away knowing the problems. Tough....
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Just because my bike was A DIVVY, does not mean i am......

[iCraig]

Tell him to piss off!

I bought a £1000 car from a dealer and had problems with it, I called consumer direct and asked what my rights were and was told in my own words 'fuck all'!

Craig

[Ste]

If you buy from a dealer then you do have rights. The buyer of a £1,000,000 car has the same rights as the buyer of a £1,000 car. Obviously the quality of the vehicles and what could be expected from each vehicle is going to be different, but the buyers still have the same rights as each other.

[No More Names ......]

Ffs ... tell him no way hosa ... thread closed ....

....................................................................
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Flip Wrote: You're a bloke, you don't need kids. You need a vehicle, someone to shag, a dog and a shed. AKA Cuntdudes life and ambition ... A ++

DOD Wrote: It was very interesting - the desolation of some of the areas of that city is quite remarkable. Shows what terrible town planning can do.

[LimehouseCBF]

Similar thing happened to a friend. She called the police as the new owner of the car she sold parked his car outside her house and put the keys through the letter box. The police said it goes back to a gentleman's agreement. Basically that person has until sundown to return the car if not its tough shit. Dunno if that helps, but she won her case and to go through small claims court it would cost him more than the cars worth.

"A gentlemen's agreement is an informal agreement between two or more parties. It may be written, oral, or simply understood as part of an unspoken agreement by convention or through mutually beneficial etiquette.

The essence of a gentlemen's agreement is that it relies upon the honor of the parties for its fulfillment, rather than being in any way enforceable (by the government). It is, therefore, distinct from a legal agreement or contract, which can be enforced if necessary.

The phrase's first recorded use was in 1888 in the Report of the Railway Accounting Officers published by the Association of American Railroads Accounting Division (page 337).
"
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And on the 7th day the lord said..lets get pissed

[Flip]

Sold as seen. Tell him to piss off.

[G]

Not sure what you get for scrap these days, but if you slightly believed they were being genuine, I'd be tempted to offer £250 minus the amount you'd get to scrap it, but only if you can have the car back providing it appears to be in the same condition as when you sold it.

If they genuinely were going to scrap it, it shouldn't be any difference to them - but of course if they're scamming you, they lose out.

[Fortuna]

[Groove]

Thanks for clearing that up guys.

I did think that was the case and stood my ground on the phone.


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|| Past: 1991 Kawasaki ZXR 250 ~ 2003 Honda CBR 600 F Sport ~ 2004 Kawasaki ZX6R B1H 636 ~ 1999 Yamaha R1 ~ 1999 Kawasaki ZX6R J ~ 2004 Kawasaki ZX6R B1H 636 ~ 1998 Honda VTR1000F Firestorm ~ K1 GSXR 600 Track bike ~ K6 GSXR 1000 ~ 2006 Speed Triple 1050 || Current: 2005 R1 https://www.adrucore.co.uk

[waffles]

Did he get pissy about it?
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Past rides Yamaha XT125X, Triumph TT600, Honda XR250
Current rides Suzuki GSXR 600, Honda MSX125

[steveh]

Sold as seen, be nice as you dont want your windows putting in!
Explain your story and state your not giving any money back.


hell go away soon enough.

steve
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Current : 06 Zx10r, 07 Wr450f SM, 74 850 norton commando, 63 bsa b40, 1962 Triton 650, 67 Triumph Tr6r, 1955 Triton 750, 1978 TY250E.

[J0Al1]

Legal action for £250 - he will never go ahead.

[James]

500 quid car? Ffs people like that should be boiled alive. What does £500 get you these days? Not a lot. Assume the car cost 10 grand or whatever new (that is a total estimate and a cheap one at that but the principle is the same) so he has paid 5% of the new price. Therefore he should expect it to be 95% fucked for the price he paid. Simple as. Tell him to stick it up his arse your not interested in anything he has to say. Tell him to consult Jack Straw personally for his legal advice for all the good it will do him.

Private sale and the legal term is Caveat Emperor which is latin for 'let the buyer beware'.

Tell him to get it half running and drive it into a canal and if he want warranties next time to spend thousands at a dealers forecourt. The bell end.

Go and enjoy the money take the missus out or something
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Like shit off a stick