Advanced Riding

[MarkJ]

I've had near misses before but the one I had this morning took the biscuit. I was pulled out on and, whilst I avoided it, I think I probably could have made a better go at avoiding it.

I'm assuming with all the people on here that a fair few have done the advanced stuff. To my knowledge there are only three: IAM, RoSPA and BikeSafe. BikeSafe being only a few days sort of thing with the other two having the test at the end.

Could people who have done these (and any other I haven't mentioned) give me their opinion on them, whether they think they have helped, whether they would do a different course etc.

I've been riding 4 years, done approx 8k a year, and approx 5 trackdays a year for the last 3 years.
Been driving a car 6 years and do around 15-20k a year.

[G]

‘Advanced riding’ techniques probably would have helped you here – as they try and teach you to identify just such situations and act on them.

A good start is to pick up a copy of ‘Motorcycle Roadcraft’ - having read through this I found bikesafe to be a bit of a waste of time – it’s a single day ‘assessment’.

My local IAM group I’ve been to a bit, though not got around to finishing it. They offer a free first day which is a bit of training and mostly assessment. Then £85 for a year to include the test fees – think you should offer to pay for petrol for the people you’re out with, but generally they’re happy with a cup of tea of whatever.

It is worth it I reckon, though I don’t like all they teach and most of it can be got from Motorcycle Roadcraft, having other people give their opinions on your riding from a third person perspective is always useful.

[JAMSXR]

https://www.altiusdirectory.com/Society/2009/03/near-miss-day.html
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[chris-red]

Someone can correct me here, but advance riding is more about being seen so you don't get pulled out on, I don't think you can teach avoidence as if you ever actually to avoid something qucikly it is far more instinct than anything else you don't have time to think about it.

I avoided a fuck off bit of metal on the A13 at about 80mph the other day that I was sure I would hit, how? fuck knows, body reacted and I dodged it and live to tell the tale.
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[G]

dvanced riding is more about observing your environment and reacting to it before you have to make emergency avoiding actions – which, yes, are much harder to ‘train’.
While some of it is ‘being noticed’, this side is more to do with observing then acting appropriately to how well people have noticed you. So if there’s a driver waiting to pull out, have you made eye contact etc?
If it’s otherwise safe to do so, it’s probably worth moving towards the centre of the road, but if they continue to not show any signs of seeing you it’s probably also appropriate to slow down, consider beeping your horn etc.

A lot is about positioning yourself so that you both have the best visibility of the road and the biggest ‘safety’ bubble so that you can react to anything that does happen.

So consider yourself corrected – they don’t even expect reflective stuff at my local IAM group .

Things falling off a truck are of course harder to ‘predict’ / avoid, but no doubt some would have seen an open truck and decided to leave a bigger gap etc.

[crazyjoyce]

IAM is quite a social thing, you train up and pass your test, pay your yearly membership and have the advanced pass for life. most of the groups i know about are frequented by the older man, with younger blokes in the minority. having said that, one of the senior examiners for my local group is 70, rides a blade and a cb1000 faster than just about anyone on the road, and an sp1 in the fast group on track

Rospa on the other hand, IMO, is more professional, three grades, bronze, silver and gold, with bronze being the equivalent of an IAM pass, but you have to keep your hand in, and are re tested every 3 years. Gold, is seen as being quite an achievement in the advanced riding world.

Road craft is their bible, its all about applying 'the system' position, gear, speed, acceleration to all the circumstances you run into. most of its common sense when you think about it, but you might not actually do it on the road.

my dad and his buddies are all Rospa gold and more, so riding with them helps my riding alot, and i plan on doing ROSPA over the summer, mainly to help with my insurance (im 19, and intend on buying something silly once i've finished uni, so everything helps insurance wise!)

if you think its for slipper wearing, pipe smoking BMW riders you're wrong, yeah there are a few, but there are far more sports bikes than anything else, infact, i was out with a 60plus year old with a street fightered zx10, downgeared with a hooligan pipe, and he was a senior observer

go with an open mind, they're offering a skills for life package for £139, and most groups will do a taster type thing for free

[alone]

[G]

My local IAM group has got a reasonable percentage of younger riders - but they do seem to be a 'better' group, some aren't nearly as good for various reasons I'm told.
They also like to give the illusion at least of trying to make you *think* about your riding rather than just follow a set of rules - the reality doesn't quite match up, but then it often doesn't with most things in life!

And I'm not the one riding an old-man Triumph, (err, checks outside,) well not normally anyway :p.

[NickD]

[alone]

[G]

Gwan then.... I'll bring it back looking much better (covered in mud) despite it being totally inappropriate - the trumpet probably wouldn't be much worse on the lanes, but I suspect Bendy wouldn't be too happy .

Incidentally, have new tyres and fork seals on the GSXR, MOT on Thursday and it should be in a decent state for a play .

The TVAM do still have their main meet in Wokingham as far as I know, doubt there'll be any closer ones.

[Mr Hammers]

Am I alone in feeling that these courses would actually just totally suck the fun out of riding?

I'm nowhere near perfect, and I'll take chances I know I shouldn't sometimes, but to ride with a constant narrative in my head and trying to be 100% precise with positioning, gear changes, etc, all of the time doesn't sound like much fun really.

I'm referring to the roadcraft type courses, btw, not a trackday/racing course which I think would be valuable - and a lot more fun.
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[MarJay]

[G]

[bacon]

I attended a bikesafe course in february this year with the police, its meant to be a stepping stone to the IAM training, like an insight into how they ride etc

its all about road positioning, doing as much as possible to be seen and being in the best position to avoid any hazards that could inevitably unfold

they are very good riders and can give you plenty of tips etc, my main issue was road positioning on corners which meant my view wasn't great which in turn caused me to instinctively slow down when if I just positioned myself better i wouldn't

I also found some roads while out with them I did not know about

its pretty cheap, so if you fancy it you may as well, road craft is where all their riding comes from as well i believe

[Bendy]

[G]

[MarJay]

[crazyjoyce]

[alone]

[G]

[iooi]

[Smooth]

I've signed up for IAM in May/June. It can't be a bad thing to do.

I'd like to think that I had fairly good observation to begin with, but being observed will give me a reference point.

I suspect that the group are fairly 'mature' (although I'm no longer that young at 32), but I'll see how it goes.
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[Mr Hammers]

[Smooth]