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8year state of terrorist emergecy unwarranted?

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D O G
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PostPosted: 11:00 - 25 Mar 2010    Post subject: 8year state of terrorist emergecy unwarranted? Reply with quote
The Govt's joint Comittee on Human Rights - a cross party body - has reported today that the ongoing state of emergency which was put in place after 9/11 is unrealistic, and has been used by the govt to put in place laws which erode civil liberty without being effective agains any terrorist threat.

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In our view it devalues the idea of a 'public emergency' to declare it in 2001, and then to continue to assert it more than eight years later.


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The question is, are the counter-terror measures we have in place justifiable, on an ongoing basis, in light of the most up-to-date information we have.


So people have been saying this for years, now MP's and Peers say it too, anyone willing to place any money on any govt reducing the hysteria and legislation?
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Itchy
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PostPosted: 11:12 - 25 Mar 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
Well I be darned the tin foil hatters were correct..

But no of course they won't change it, as in the other post the economies of the western world are in a bad way actually TSHTFF STILL hasn't occured yet. And ahem civil contingencies bills may well be needed to how shall I say it 'keep order'
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and
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PostPosted: 11:55 - 25 Mar 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
...

Last edited by and on 20:10 - 23 May 2010; edited 1 time in total
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yuri2085
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PostPosted: 19:33 - 25 Mar 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
Yer but ulthar, we have the ability to learn from history.
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Hetzer
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PostPosted: 19:35 - 25 Mar 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
yuri2085 wrote:
Yer but ulthar, we have the ability to learn from history.


Yeah, but weren't we supposed to have done that after the nazis and WW2? Yet here we are now with the govt's of supposedly free democracies enacting nazi legislation hand over fist.
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smegballs
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PostPosted: 19:39 - 25 Mar 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
Hetzer wrote:
yuri2085 wrote:
Yer but ulthar, we have the ability to learn from history.


Yeah, but weren't we supposed to have done that after the nazis and WW2? Yet here we are now with the govt's of supposedly free democracies enacting nazi legislation hand over fist.


Come now Hetzer, next thing I know you'll be telling us the root of all evil are Jews terrorists and that all these new liberty-raping laws are needed for our personal saftey......

Laughing
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Hetzer
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PostPosted: 19:47 - 25 Mar 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
All I need for my personal safety is my pistola in my immediate personal possession.

Unless any assailant is prepared to both let me dial 999 and wait for an hour for the police to turn up before assailing me. Rolling Eyes
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smegballs
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PostPosted: 19:54 - 25 Mar 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
Hetzer wrote:
All I need for my personal safety is my pistola in my immediate personal possession.

Unless any assailant is prepared to both let me dial 999 and wait for an hour for the police to turn up before assailing me. Rolling Eyes


Oh hi mate, now I dont want to be a spoilsport but could you possibly give me say 60 mins before battering me and stealing my possesions?

Oh you don't mind? Nice one. Cup of tea while you're waiting?
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yuri2085
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PostPosted: 20:48 - 25 Mar 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
Hetzer wrote:
yuri2085 wrote:
Yer but ulthar, we have the ability to learn from history.


Yeah, but weren't we supposed to have done that after the nazis and WW2? Yet here we are now with the govt's of supposedly free democracies enacting nazi legislation hand over fist.


Yup that was the point I was hinting at.
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Raffles
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PostPosted: 20:50 - 25 Mar 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
Hetzer wrote:
All I need for my personal safety is my pistola in my immediate personal possession.

Unless any assailant is prepared to both let me dial 999 and wait for an hour for the police to turn up before assailing me. Rolling Eyes


An hour? You're lucky. You'd have to use a calendar to measure The Plods' response times in my neck of the woods Laughing
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and
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PostPosted: 21:46 - 25 Mar 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
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Last edited by and on 20:11 - 23 May 2010; edited 1 time in total
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yuri2085
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PostPosted: 12:34 - 26 Mar 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
ulthar wrote:
yuri2085 wrote:
Yer but ulthar, we have the ability to learn from history.


What are you trying to say?

You say that only after time did it become apparent what governments were trying to do, that it was not known to the public.
But I say we can draw parallels with history and make reasonable estimates that a severe erosion of our civil liberties for no real gain to security was a definite possibility.
We should have known.
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Mushroom
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PostPosted: 12:53 - 26 Mar 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
Quote:
We should have known.


You cant know until some high ranking official works it out and tells you..clearly Rolling Eyes Laughing .
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and
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PostPosted: 12:48 - 30 Mar 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
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Last edited by and on 20:07 - 23 May 2010; edited 1 time in total
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mistergixer
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PostPosted: 12:18 - 02 Apr 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
Raffles wrote:
Hetzer wrote:
All I need for my personal safety is my pistola in my immediate personal possession.

Unless any assailant is prepared to both let me dial 999 and wait for an hour for the police to turn up before assailing me. Rolling Eyes


An hour? You're lucky. You'd have to use a calendar to measure The Plods' response times in my neck of the woods Laughing


Yup, took 'em 3 days to turn up when my wife called them when i was being threatened on my doorstep by a lovely chap armed with a club hammer.

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Hetzer
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PostPosted: 12:26 - 02 Apr 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
mistergixer wrote:


Yup, took 'em 3 days to turn up when my wife called them when i was being threatened on my doorstep by a lovely chap armed with a club hammer.

Thumbs Up


If you'd defended yourself with your fists, never mind your own claw-hammer, I can gaurantee you the police would have been at your door within half an hour and you'd have been arrested.

That's how justice is served in the UK.
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Itchy
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PostPosted: 12:36 - 02 Apr 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
mistergixer wrote:


Yup, took 'em 3 days to turn up when my wife called them when i was being threatened on my doorstep by a lovely chap armed with a club hammer.

Thumbs Up



The magic phrase is, "I think he's got a gun."
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Last edited by Itchy on 12:38 - 02 Apr 2010; edited 1 time in total
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Clanger
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PostPosted: 12:36 - 02 Apr 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
I got threatened in my own home (of three years) by a man who had moved in three weeks previous...with a knife...I had witnesses (other housemates). I called the police, they ambled over a couple of days later, and suggested I move out. Rolling Eyes
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Hetzer
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PostPosted: 12:42 - 02 Apr 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
Clanger wrote:
I got threatened in my own home (of three years) by a man who had moved in three weeks previous...with a knife...I had witnesses (other housemates). I called the police, they ambled over a couple of days later, and suggested I move out. Rolling Eyes


And if you'd later had to stab him in self-defence you'd have been done in court, with the prosecution using the argument that you'd acted with unlawful force..."The defendant didn't use reasonable force, which would have been to move out."
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yuri2085
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PostPosted: 12:43 - 02 Apr 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
I think you can excuse me ulthar for thinking 'It only really became apparent some time after the twin tower attacks' means it only really became apparent some tim(meaning not immediately) AFTER the twin tower attacks.

But clearly that is not what you meant.


The parallels are vague but one example is laws introduced under the guise of protection/security by naza germany (a (faked) terrorist attack to create state of emergency).
Some wisdom about deserving no security or freedom if you give up freedom for security by some US president. I imagine that was founded on something too.

Hetzer has already made the Nazi germany point.
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mistergixer
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PostPosted: 12:59 - 02 Apr 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
Hetzer wrote:

If you'd defended yourself with your fists, never mind your own claw-hammer, I can gaurantee you the police would have been at your door within half an hour and you'd have been arrested.

That's how justice is served in the UK.


I'm fully aware of that, which is why i refused to enter into his game of verbal tennis.
However, had the neanderthalic half-wit given me even the slightest inclination that he was going to escalate the situation into a physical confrontation, my right fist was ready and the route it would take to his face was well plotted.
Violence is my last resort, but if i have to resort to it, i take pride in my handiwork and the satisfaction of a job well done.
I'm definitely a 'judged by 12 rather than carried by 6' sort of gentleman.

Wink
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