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| Dazbo666 |
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Dazbo666
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Joined: 06 Jun 2004
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 Posted: 06:45 - 08 Jun 2010  Post subject: Replacement allen bolts |
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Well, it looks like I'll soon need to replce the swiss cheese allen bolts on the Bandit... 
I got myself a 14T (one tooth down) front sprocket the other day, but I've been having problems getting the sprocket cover off.
I've used penetrating spray, and also tried loosening them while the engine was warm after a ride, but I think I've already rounded at least one of the heads.
Just wondering if there's any suggestions on suppliers of decent quality replacements. I'll be checking out fleabay, and maybe have a look at the ProBolt website or similar, but does anyone have any other alternatives?
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1st bike (Sept'06 - May'10) : 1991 GPZ500S / Current bike (since Nov 2009) : 2003 Suzuki Bandit 600N
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| 27cows |
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27cows
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Posted: 07:25 - 08 Jun 2010  Post subject: |
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This place is pretty good, if you want stainless - and you can buy fasteners in any quantity, instead of having to get big packs: https://www.stagonset.co.uk/fasteners?output_frontpage=yes
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| Raffles |
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Raffles
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| Posted: 07:57 - 08 Jun 2010 Post subject: |
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What a fantastic range of fasteners. I've just added this site to my favourites list.
Well done Mr Cows 
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| salty21 |
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salty21
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| Posted: 09:54 - 08 Jun 2010 Post subject: |
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im in need of some new disc bolts for the cbr, the normal ones from honda are are over £2 each, if i ordered the same size from this site will they be ok for disc bolts or do you have to have some kind of high strength bolts for discs?
sorry for the hijack 
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04 NSR 125(sold)  ---- 03 CBR 600rr(sold)  ----90 pan euro ST1100 ' ' ----02 CG 125
94 CB400 Super Four ---- 2000 VTR SP1 (sold) ---- 08 ninja p8f(sold, meh) ----05 CBR600rr |
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| chris-red |
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chris-red
Have you considered a TDM?
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| salty21 |
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salty21
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| Posted: 10:10 - 08 Jun 2010 Post subject: |
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lol 
ok, i shall buy some of these high strength jobbies then
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04 NSR 125(sold) ---- 03 CBR 600rr(sold) ----90 pan euro ST1100 '' ----02 CG 125
94 CB400 Super Four ---- 2000 VTR SP1 (sold) ---- 08 ninja p8f(sold, meh) ----05 CBR600rr |
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| Dazbo666 |
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Dazbo666
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| Posted: 10:30 - 08 Jun 2010 Post subject: |
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Fantastic range of goodies!!!
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1st bike (Sept'06 - May'10) : 1991 GPZ500S / Current bike (since Nov 2009) : 2003 Suzuki Bandit 600N
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| Raffles |
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Raffles
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| Teflon-Mike |
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Teflon-Mike
tl;dr
Joined: 01 Jun 2010
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Posted: 13:57 - 08 Jun 2010  Post subject: |
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I use my local hardware store!
Its an old fasioned one, they'll sell you nuts and bolts by weight!
I do NOT use stainless.... I do NOT use 'kits'.
Stanless look nice & shiny, but they are a high nickel steel, thats what makes them stainless, and it also makes them bloody hard and also brittle.
Learned that one the hard way a long time ago working on my dirt bikes.... after about the forth rebuild on my comper, I went & bought a 'Mr-Faster' tub of assorted stainless nuts and bolts....
They looked good, until the next rebuild, when we had a right royal pita getting some of them out! The worst ones were... yup... engine casing cap-heads!
They STILL sieze in thier holes, and they STILL round out... BUT they are rather a lot harder than the toffee steel originals.
Try drilling them and the drill goes ANYBLOODY where but down the shaft of the fastener... So you end up with chewed cases, and a stubborn fastener that still wont come out! Not nice when those cases just HAPPEN to be magnesium!
Anyway, ONE particular fastener; I remember it well, even though it was nie on twenty year-ago! An M8 shock absorber bolt, in a blind hole in a boss on the frame.... happily for once NOT magnesium, but mild steel, defied us for the best part of a month!.
We had the Snap-On Man & the Britool Bloke do thier rounds, and the Britool bloke sold us a diamond drill.....
Worked wonders getting a hole down the bolt.... but of course we then had a snapped off easy-out in it!
Which the diamond drill didn't like very-much.... But what the heck.... came from Britool, had a 'life-time' guarantee... so we gave it him back, and asked for another.... wore that out on the EZ-Out.... asked for another........
Until we had a hole again!
THEN we asked the Britool bloke if he had something better than an easy-out.... his eye-brows raised slightly, as he 'clicked' why we had worn out three or four diamond drill bits!
He peered down the hole.... looked at the ensembled by-standers, all eager for a tool demo.... and declined to offer suggestion!
So we collared the Snap-On-Man! who was more gullible!
He 'loaned' us a Snap-On screw extractor.... so we gave it a go.... it toffeee twisted, so we gave it him back!
He said the hole wasn't big enough, we had to use the drill that came with the kit.
So we did. Wore it out...... extractor STILL toffee twisted.
He said we weren't hammering it in hard enough, so we gave it another go......
and after MUCH cursing.... it came out.
Along with a very mangled Snap-On Screw-Extractor.... which, much impressed, we bought.... then imedietly handed him back for a replacement, untwisted, under the warranty!
Before the new, screw extractor arrived though.... the tub of Mr-Faster stainless screws was found, and hurled at me!
And forth-with, EVERY stainless fastner we had in the lin-bins, along with any OTHER faster we weren't sure about!
And I have avoided stainless ever since! I'm afraid of them being chucked at me!
Mild steel, and LOTS of coppa-slip, has been the way to go!
One trick, on Cap-Head casing screws particularly, though, reason they round is often NOT that the screws are soft, but that the hex socket or allen key put into them isn't pushed in far enough and or, square.
And the reason they dont go in is often becouse of crud in the cap.
Good practice before tackling cap-heads is just to give them a 'poke-out' with something pointy like an old nail.
The, if you can, use a hex-socket rather than an allen key, and lightly tap it home before putting the wratchet on it. Also worth investing in a decent 'rail' of hex sockets, for the job. Cheap ones are often 'loose' and cheap steel, almost deliberately designed to chew up the caps!
And when replacing the screws, a smear of coppa-slip in the head is useful too. Filling the hole, it prevents rust, and makes getting the hex socket in easier when you come to undo it.
Geting rounded Cap-Heads out? Before resorting to tactical power-tools:-
First port of call is an Impact Driver. Tapping the head often helps them grip as well as putting that bit of shock on to get them twisting.
After that, if well rounded, the 'old' cheapo hex wrenches I had before I learned better have been cut & ground!
For metric caps, closest size up imperial; use tool sharpener to put a very slight taper on the end of each flat, then hammer the bludger into the rounded cap, and use a spanner to turn it as close to the cap as possible.
IF you have access around the head of the cap-head though, an 'eccentric-cam' stud extractor, the sort you use to take studs out of old exhaust manifolds, often works a treat. Mole-Grips, usually dont!
And I HAVE occassionally had some success very carefully using a small engineers chissel, hammering in a slot, or getting a ridge to carefully tap-round on with the chissel... though you have to be pretty desperate for that one, and can lead to well skinned knuckles. |
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| Odie |
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Odie
World Chat Champion
Joined: 24 Jul 2004
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| Posted: 14:50 - 08 Jun 2010 Post subject: |
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| Teflon-Mike wrote: | I use my local hardware store!
Its an old fasioned one, they'll sell you nuts and bolts by weight!
I do NOT use stainless.... I do NOT use 'kits'.
Stanless look nice & shiny, but they are a high nickel steel, thats what makes them stainless, and it also makes them bloody hard and also brittle.
Learned that one the hard way a long time ago working on my dirt bikes.... after about the forth rebuild on my comper, I went & bought a 'Mr-Faster' tub of assorted stainless nuts and bolts....
They looked good, until the next rebuild, when we had a right royal pita getting some of them out! The worst ones were... yup... engine casing cap-heads!
They STILL sieze in thier holes, and they STILL round out... BUT they are rather a lot harder than the toffee steel originals.
Try drilling them and the drill goes ANYBLOODY where but down the shaft of the fastener... So you end up with chewed cases, and a stubborn fastener that still wont come out! Not nice when those cases just HAPPEN to be magnesium!
Anyway, ONE particular fastener; I remember it well, even though it was nie on twenty year-ago! An M8 shock absorber bolt, in a blind hole in a boss on the frame.... happily for once NOT magnesium, but mild steel, defied us for the best part of a month!.
We had the Snap-On Man & the Britool Bloke do thier rounds, and the Britool bloke sold us a diamond drill.....
Worked wonders getting a hole down the bolt.... but of course we then had a snapped off easy-out in it!
Which the diamond drill didn't like very-much.... But what the heck.... came from Britool, had a 'life-time' guarantee... so we gave it him back, and asked for another.... wore that out on the EZ-Out.... asked for another........
Until we had a hole again!
THEN we asked the Britool bloke if he had something better than an easy-out.... his eye-brows raised slightly, as he 'clicked' why we had worn out three or four diamond drill bits!
He peered down the hole.... looked at the ensembled by-standers, all eager for a tool demo.... and declined to offer suggestion!
So we collared the Snap-On-Man! who was more gullible!
He 'loaned' us a Snap-On screw extractor.... so we gave it a go.... it toffeee twisted, so we gave it him back!
He said the hole wasn't big enough, we had to use the drill that came with the kit.
So we did. Wore it out...... extractor STILL toffee twisted.
He said we weren't hammering it in hard enough, so we gave it another go......
and after MUCH cursing.... it came out.
Along with a very mangled Snap-On Screw-Extractor.... which, much impressed, we bought.... then imedietly handed him back for a replacement, untwisted, under the warranty!
Before the new, screw extractor arrived though.... the tub of Mr-Faster stainless screws was found, and hurled at me!
And forth-with, EVERY stainless fastner we had in the lin-bins, along with any OTHER faster we weren't sure about!
And I have avoided stainless ever since! I'm afraid of them being chucked at me!
Mild steel, and LOTS of coppa-slip, has been the way to go!
One trick, on Cap-Head casing screws particularly, though, reason they round is often NOT that the screws are soft, but that the hex socket or allen key put into them isn't pushed in far enough and or, square.
And the reason they dont go in is often becouse of crud in the cap.
Good practice before tackling cap-heads is just to give them a 'poke-out' with something pointy like an old nail.
The, if you can, use a hex-socket rather than an allen key, and lightly tap it home before putting the wratchet on it. Also worth investing in a decent 'rail' of hex sockets, for the job. Cheap ones are often 'loose' and cheap steel, almost deliberately designed to chew up the caps!
And when replacing the screws, a smear of coppa-slip in the head is useful too. Filling the hole, it prevents rust, and makes getting the hex socket in easier when you come to undo it.
Geting rounded Cap-Heads out? Before resorting to tactical power-tools:-
First port of call is an Impact Driver. Tapping the head often helps them grip as well as putting that bit of shock on to get them twisting.
After that, if well rounded, the 'old' cheapo hex wrenches I had before I learned better have been cut & ground!
For metric caps, closest size up imperial; use tool sharpener to put a very slight taper on the end of each flat, then hammer the bludger into the rounded cap, and use a spanner to turn it as close to the cap as possible.
IF you have access around the head of the cap-head though, an 'eccentric-cam' stud extractor, the sort you use to take studs out of old exhaust manifolds, often works a treat. Mole-Grips, usually dont!
And I HAVE occassionally had some success very carefully using a small engineers chissel, hammering in a slot, or getting a ridge to carefully tap-round on with the chissel... though you have to be pretty desperate for that one, and can lead to well skinned knuckles. |
i have sold stainless fasteners for years and i know what your saying is true but not absolutely true, first thing, never buy a MR FASTENER SET / TUB BECAUSE YOU NEVER GET THE SIZES YOU REALLY NEED, ITS A WAY OF THEM GETTING RID OF OLD / STOCK.
second, also use copperslip or another brand of anti seize lubricant, helps just incase you get problems!
also, never use anodized fasteners in high load areas, have seen them used as disc bolts and shock mount bolts with horrible repercusions!same goes for using them on engine cases but they have a bad habit of snapping and then you have to remove them!
Also, anodized bolts fade, the reason is that they were originally used in the aircraft industry and it was a gage used to find out if they should be replaced (faded means they were past it) also, stainless bolts can work harden if you have to remove a broken bit.
odie
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| mooserx |
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mooserx
Nearly there...
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| Posted: 15:41 - 08 Jun 2010 Post subject: |
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chris-red
Have you considered a TDM?
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| 27cows |
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27cows
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| Ichy |
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Ichy
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| Posted: 18:28 - 08 Jun 2010 Post subject: |
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Old Thread Alert!
The last post was made 15 years, 261 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful? |
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