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pa_broon74
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Joined: 28 Mar 2006
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PostPosted: 16:23 - 19 Jul 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
Big_Ham wrote:
My opinions on alarms have been well documented on this forum.

In summary.

Buy a big chain and an angry dog.


An angry dog isn't much use if you live in a flat with no garden.

Not that I'm averse to the idea of it savaging the neighbours cat... Or children...

Wink
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ThoughtContro...
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PostPosted: 17:53 - 19 Jul 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
pa_broon74 wrote:
I've fitted three cyclone type alarms, two to my own bikes and one to a ped. Each time, I didn't bother with the remote start or the immobiliser.


I've got 2 bikes, both with C11s fitted, and neither use immobiliser/remote start option.

The weird oddball thing with the Cyclone C11 is that if you've got the fob in your pocket and somehow the remote start gets pressed twice this enables the ignition. I can start my CBR125 in this state. My SV doesn't start, the engine turns over tho and all the lights on the dash are ON. Maybe the fuel pump isn't active or something. Could be worrying if you dont use a lock at all.

Even more daft is if you've already got the bike started and for some reason the remote start gets pressed twice you'll now find you can't switch the bike off with the key! If you're unaware that it's just the alarm fob and it's snowing and you're cold, wet, covered in snow and just want to get the bike back indoors and have a brew this can be the cause of some stress.
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loply
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Joined: 24 Mar 2004
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PostPosted: 19:19 - 19 Jul 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
panrider_uk wrote:

Why does not riding it often affect whether or not it works?

Obviously the battery going flat would be an issue but that's not the fault of the alarm.

Mark


The alarm drains the battery.

On a Pan Euro with a car sized battery and a low-compression, easy-start engine, it's not going to make a difference.

But on a high compression twin cylinder sports bike with a barely-big-enough lightweight battery, a few weeks of an alarm draining current is enough to stop it starting.
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SnowTigeress
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Joined: 23 May 2010
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PostPosted: 20:52 - 19 Jul 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
Villers wrote:
As far as security at my work goes we have a 12 foot fence, gates operated under
armed guard, full cctv coverage, a dedicated armed police force, guard dogs, an alarmed
petimmeyer and a no fly zone overhead!

You're a School Teacher, aren't you?!
wouldn't it be easier and cheaper just to put up with them bunking off for a smoke! Wink
Villers wrote:

My current bike has no alarm or immobiliser and I wont be fitting one for several reasons:
They are expensive to do right
They eat your battery
They misbehave
They can leave you stranded, or worse cut the bike out while riding
An alarm/immobiliser would have saved me 30 quid but cost hundreds to install
On top of that in todays society they dont really do much but piss people off. hysical security
is the way forward in my opinion!

I'd second that. Tef does too. ish.
herulach wrote:
You've got your priorities wrong, take the toolkit out as I'd put money on you
never using it, replace it with a disc lock for when you're out and about.
I have one of the cyclone ones, but wired up solely as an alarm.

I have a Cyclone waiting to go on the pup. i HAD one on the cruiser thing, but it was the one
that talked.
Had the opposite effect on the local scroats to intended, instead of keeping them away, they
actually used to try and set it off to hear it talk at them.
Hey, these kids have such deprived upbringings, McDonalds Happy-Meal toys still keep them
occupied for those long periods between having to sign on, and I think that my alarm was the ONLY
thing that would actually talk to them without swearing!
Twonk-Ex didn't wire it up properly either, anyway. He only wired the alarm, not the imobiliser
functions.
But wouldn't have made much odds, when the bludy twokkers DID eventually get it, they just
wheeled it up the road!
Disc-lock didn't 'click' on properly that night!
And the dog.... well he might as well have take the keys out to them! Useless bludy eunoch!
Even 'Hard' Security isn't 100% reliable.
Think you have to chuck as much security at it as you can, and an alarm is an extra bit you can
use, but it is not worth doing unless you do it right.
The cyclone on the cruiser thing was not right and it wasn't a neat fit and it did give trouble
cos it couldn't be mounted flat and the bike only had a side stand.
On the pup, we've checked it over and Tef has found a neat little hole for it under the tank, and
that has a center stand so it will stay flat. and he'll be wiring it in, and using all the
imobiliser functions.
Why the cyclone? Its cheap e-bay tat!
almost every bike I've had has been nicked, living in Braunstone, Leicester.... there is a way
out... I'm SURE theres a way out!
so when i met Tef well he lives in nuneaton so i sort of get out of braunstone a few days a week,yipppppppppeeeeeeeeee
but then the cruiser got nicked outside of his house thing the likkle scroats were stalking me
so doing the 'Pup' and spending some seriouse money and a lot of time and effort to make myself a
REALLY nice bike, I REALLY want to hang on to this one!
So Tef got me on the insurance sites, doing quote comparisons changing the alarms and imobilisers
in thier list to see what they reccomended and or gave most discount on.
Botom line was it made bugger all difference. Even putting a tracker on the thing didn't sway the
premium much!
So there was little reason for going for one of the Thatcham approved ones, or anything
particularly fancy or expensive.
tef said keep it simple, and do it tidy. So I went for the Cyclone that has all the imobiliser
features, and trust tef to wire it in.
he sed he had 'ideas';
One involved a small sealed 12v battery out of a kids street scooter, some diodes and a relay he
wanted from maplin, and bolting a lunch-box under the luggage rack!
The other involved a load of in-line fuse holders.
He sed that where the instructions said to cut a wire he'd put an inline fuse holder with a bit
of plastic tube in, instead of a fuse. That way if the imobiliser ever gives jip, it can be
de-bugged or by-passed simply by putting fuses in the fuse holders.
The 12v sealed battery, was to provide an isolated supply for the alarm so it couldn't flatten
the bike battery. the relay and diodes to make a charging circuit so that it would charge up when
the bike was running.
these little modifications sound helpful.
also asked the police wether i could wire it to the mains they said yeah but off the records............wonders as long as theres a sign would that be possible?
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ThoughtContro...
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Joined: 14 Aug 2008
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PostPosted: 21:19 - 19 Jul 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
BAD snowtigeress wrote:

So Tef got me on the insurance sites, doing quote comparisons changing the alarms and imobilisers
in thier list to see what they reccomended and or gave most discount on.
Botom line was it made bugger all difference. Even putting a tracker on the thing didn't sway the
premium much!
So there was little reason for going for one of the Thatcham approved ones, or anything
particularly fancy or expensive.


Be careful of insurance quotes. Don't just go off the numbers. If you live in a really crap area, ring up the brokers and ask em what endorsements apply to the theft cover. You maybe surprised that the reason your TPFT isn't that much more than TPO is that it's TPFT without the theft, courtesy of some endorsements stating something along the lines of "Excluding cover theft cover when kept at or near the policyholders address UNLESS FITTED WITH AN APPROVED ALARM IMMOBILISER SYSTEM" ie, a professionally fitted Thatcham job.

These endorsements may appear on there even tho you told em you had a cheapo alarm or no alarm at all. It's probably SOP for some areas, must be garaged, must have approved alarm immobiliser, must have mechanical immobiliser. Basically "we dont really cover theft in your area, go live somewhere else"

Policy wording is everything.
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SnowTigeress
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Joined: 23 May 2010
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PostPosted: 23:24 - 19 Jul 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
im trying very hard to live somewhere else but dont think Tef could cope with me every day every night
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Stevie GooGs
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Joined: 28 Oct 2005
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PostPosted: 23:47 - 19 Jul 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
I had a datatool system 3 on my ZX10r it used to drive me nuts, constantly going off if it was raining, windy and getting fuel. Im glad my new bike does not have one fitted tbh.
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pa_broon74
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Joined: 28 Mar 2006
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PostPosted: 14:55 - 20 Jul 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
ThoughtControl wrote:
pa_broon74 wrote:
I've fitted three cyclone type alarms, two to my own bikes and one to a ped. Each time, I didn't bother with the remote start or the immobiliser.


I've got 2 bikes, both with C11s fitted, and neither use immobiliser/remote start option.

The weird oddball thing with the Cyclone C11 is that if you've got the fob in your pocket and somehow the remote start gets pressed twice this enables the ignition. I can start my CBR125 in this state. My SV doesn't start, the engine turns over tho and all the lights on the dash are ON. Maybe the fuel pump isn't active or something. Could be worrying if you dont use a lock at all.

Even more daft is if you've already got the bike started and for some reason the remote start gets pressed twice you'll now find you can't switch the bike off with the key! If you're unaware that it's just the alarm fob and it's snowing and you're cold, wet, covered in snow and just want to get the bike back indoors and have a brew this can be the cause of some stress.


Did you wire the immobiliser/remote start up? I just never bothered. With my TDM I gave it power and wired in the indicators so they'd flash and that was it, (obviously plugged the alarm sounder cable in and fecked in the LED flashing thing.)

I did the same for my BMW but left out the indicator flashers because they went wonky (technical term.) All I can do is set, unset or reset the alarm and make it go off (which I occasionally do by mistake.)

My TDM was laid up for three months with the alarm activated before the battery started to dull down, I think if i'd disconnected the LED it would've lasted even longer.

I think I might do the thing suggested above with the bucket of crap filled with cement etc. imbed a D lock in it or a heavy duty bit of something adequately shaped. Might do it with a half barrel though, top it off with ummm, some shrubs? Keep the neighbours onside.

Wink
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panrider_uk
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Joined: 23 Sep 2007
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PostPosted: 15:58 - 20 Jul 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
loply wrote:
panrider_uk wrote:

Why does not riding it often affect whether or not it works?

Obviously the battery going flat would be an issue but that's not the fault of the alarm.

Mark


The alarm drains the battery.

On a Pan Euro with a car sized battery and a low-compression, easy-start engine, it's not going to make a difference.

But on a high compression twin cylinder sports bike with a barely-big-enough lightweight battery, a few weeks of an alarm draining current is enough to stop it starting.


As said - hardly the fault of the alarm. Things that run on electrickery tend to use up a battery.

The Datatool I use does eventually drain the Pan's battery (which, by the way, is a normal size one). I don't expect it to run on thin air so I use an Optimate when the bike's not going to be used for a while.

Mark
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ThoughtContro...
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Joined: 14 Aug 2008
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PostPosted: 17:19 - 20 Jul 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
pa_broon74 wrote:
ThoughtControl wrote:


I've got 2 bikes, both with C11s fitted, and neither use immobiliser/remote start option.

The weird oddball thing with the Cyclone C11 is that if you've got the fob in your pocket and somehow the remote start gets pressed twice this enables the ignition. I can start my CBR125 in this state. My SV doesn't start, the engine turns over tho and all the lights on the dash are ON. Maybe the fuel pump isn't active or something. Could be worrying if you dont use a lock at all.

Even more daft is if you've already got the bike started and for some reason the remote start gets pressed twice you'll now find you can't switch the bike off with the key! If you're unaware that it's just the alarm fob and it's snowing and you're cold, wet, covered in snow and just want to get the bike back indoors and have a brew this can be the cause of some stress.


Did you wire the immobiliser/remote start up? I just never bothered. With my TDM I gave it power and wired in the indicators so they'd flash and that was it, (obviously plugged the alarm sounder cable in and fecked in the LED flashing thing.)



Nope, just wired up the alarm itself, the indicators and the brown wire to the ignition (if you don't it wont go off if you switch the ignition on).

The grey and pink wires that go to the immobiliser I've never bothered with on either bike. On the CBR I left em neatly folded up just in case I ever decided to use the immobiliser with a snowtigress type fuse bypass. I never bothered tho and it's been there for 18 months or so.

I just regarded it as a "feature" of the remote start function.
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pa_broon74
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Joined: 28 Mar 2006
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PostPosted: 18:39 - 20 Jul 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
I think the ones I used might be different, I take it yours was activated when the bike was off (ignition key removed etc?)

Mine always had a fob to dis/arm it with.

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LordShaftesbu...
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PostPosted: 16:53 - 08 Sep 2010    Post subject: Reply with quote
I have had those alarms installed on 3 different, brand new bikes. Every time it was a battle with the dealer to get him to install it (3 different dealers). They don't want to install it because they want you to buy an insanely overpriced ripoff from them.

Not once have I had any problems with them. I think they're absolutely great - and cost about what they should, unlike most other alarms.

Take the alarm that the Triumph dealer tried to sell me. £270 - for a small printed circuitboard and some wires, and that doesn't even include fitting costs. Probably cost about £10 to make, if that. It's such a ripoff it makes me angry, and I don't normally get annoyed when it comes to things like that.
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