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| MonkeyKnuckle |
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MonkeyKnuckle
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 Posted: 16:09 - 16 Jul 2010  Post subject: Emergency Bikers - Wednesdays 8pm - Five |
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| defblade |
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defblade
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Posted: 16:47 - 16 Jul 2010  Post subject: |
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That looks good, thanks 
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| mistergixer |
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mistergixer
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Posted: 17:51 - 16 Jul 2010  Post subject: |
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The 'profiles' on the Essex bike cops page is dreadful - who is Van Rossi or Karl Foggarty, and WTF is course fishing?
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| MonkeyKnuckle |
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MonkeyKnuckle
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| Posted: 21:36 - 16 Jul 2010 Post subject: |
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Charlie Boorman is the narrator, uh oh. 
The Police bikers are 47, 47, 48 and 49. Paramedics are 37, 48, and 57.
Are all of the bikers this sort of age? Shows how long it takes to get into the job I guess. I heard ages ago that there's a massive waiting list for it.
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| Mister James |
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Mister James
I want to believe!
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| MonkeyKnuckle |
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MonkeyKnuckle
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| Posted: 22:58 - 16 Jul 2010 Post subject: |
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Thanks for the info Mister James. 
I've never seen an unmarked bike up close. Do they have Police written on them anywhere? And the normal lights etc?
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| jonboy1081 |
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jonboy1081
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| Mister James |
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Mister James
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| 27cows |
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27cows
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| Deaks |
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Deaks
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| G |
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G
The Voice of Reason
Joined: 02 Feb 2002
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| Mister James |
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Mister James
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| Ol |
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Ol
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| Posted: 18:04 - 17 Jul 2010 Post subject: |
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| Raoul Moat, G, 27cows etc wrote: | arrogant pricks who think having completed a couple of courses makes them king of the road and invincible. |
Like most people on BCF, i share in the general dislike of police and there arrogant approach to everything, However i must confess the only times I've ever been pulled over (never on the bike - notably) were times when i was driving like a grade "A" prat, and was pulled justifiably.
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| G |
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G
The Voice of Reason
Joined: 02 Feb 2002
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| Posted: 18:37 - 17 Jul 2010 Post subject: |
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| Mister James wrote: | Much as most bikers - including you G - think their experience/training/mispent youth qualifies them to blah on about stuff. Your interminable lectures to people about the foolishness of nice-looking bikes spring to mind. |
If the police people in question purely came onto an internet forum and offered their opinions and asked questions to try and help others understand their viewpoint, I think there would be a lot less people moaning.
Despite people often noting the arrogant nature of some of my posts; those that take the time to read them, I hope would note that I do generally try and make it clear I am offering my opinion - my post above being a perfect example where I say 'this is my experience' rather than 'this is fact'.
I have never seen this from a police person in an official capacity.
| Quote: | Yes, there is a difference when someone is gifted powers to support their supposed arrogance, but it's simply a part of being human. |
I'm not sure if you're suggesting that because being an arrogant (prick) is part of what you presumably consider being human, it's ok?
The police more than most professions, I believe, should be able to control their emotions and have a good separation between fact and opinion. If they can not manage this, I would suggest they should not be in the police force.
| Quote: | Most members of the public think they are always right - the police are recruited from the public, and thus it's hardly a surprise that they follow a similar pattern. Allegedly. |
Is that most members of the public, or most members of the public you meet?
The police also have training which should provide them expertise in the appropriate areas. When members of the public research and find that the police arrogance was not based on fact, it's not surprisingly they form a poor view of them.
Though with what I've heard of pass-marks versus people let in to the police force in regards to training, I'm not surprised!
Last edited by G on 19:06 - 17 Jul 2010; edited 1 time in total |
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| willis1337 |
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willis1337
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| Mister James |
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Mister James
I want to believe!
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| Posted: 20:15 - 17 Jul 2010 Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
Despite people often noting the arrogant nature of some of my posts; those that take the time to read them, I hope would note that I do generally try and make it clear I am offering my opinion - my post above being a perfect example where I say 'this is my experience' rather than 'this is fact'.
I have never seen this from a police person in an official capacity.
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When the chips are down, officers enforcing a law have to make a decision, rather than offer opinions. I've no doubt they make mistakes at times. I've no doubt that their decision is not to your liking even more often than that.
For the record, having met you in person and read your posts for some years, you're a pleasant, generous and genuinely helpful person.
People tend to see anyone who refuses to agree with something they firmly believe as arrogant (or stupid, or both!).
| Quote: |
I'm not sure if you're suggesting that because being an arrogant (prick) is part of what you presumably consider being human, it's ok?
The police more than most professions, I believe, should be able to control their emotions and have a good separation between fact and opinion. If they can not manage this, I would suggest they should not be in the police force.
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I would suggest that while controlling your emotions is a laudable aim, it's not always possible - THAT is human nature, and cops are no more immune to that than anyone here, and deal with a lot more shit than most.
Fact and opinion are often closer than many people seem to think, especially as most people's 'facts' are tinged by their interpretation of an event or incident.
I've witnessed traffic stops (a tiny, tiny part of my job btw) where the officer dealing has been scrupulously polite and respectful, but still copped an earful of abuse from an arrogant 'law abiding' MoP, or even a written complaint. I've no doubt most of those people drove away fuming with a genuine conviction that they were in the right, and that we were arrogant know-nothings - despite glaring evidence to the contrary. Naturally, my viewpoint is just as likely to be biased - I seldom see any recognition of such bias on BCF.
[quote]
| Quote: | Most members of the public think they are always right - the police are recruited from the public, and thus it's hardly a surprise that they follow a similar pattern. Allegedly. |
Is that most members of the public, or most members of the public you meet?
[/quote[
I think it's fair to say that most people - regardless of background - generally think their opinion is the correct one.
You are right to suggest that people who have broken the law (often intentionally) tend to reflect this even more.
| Quote: |
The police also have training which should provide them expertise in the appropriate areas. When members of the public research and find that the police arrogance was not based on fact, it's not surprisingly they form a poor view of them.
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The training should - but often doesn't. Officers are also expected to deal with any situation they encounter, not just those they specialise in.
With millions of encounters with the public occurring all the time, it's hardly a surprise that some officers make mistakes, is it? It's not even that surprising if some are rude/arrogant/obnoxious either. It might not be right - but I posit that it's understandable.
I also question whether many of the encounters we hear about on here actually happened as described - either because of intentional deceit, or because the 'victim' has remembered a slightly different version of events.
| Quote: |
Though with what I've heard of pass-marks versus people let in to the police force in regards to training, I'm not surprised! |
Passmarks were dropped because the public complained about old school coppers, so the the race-relations industry used it as a mechanism to get more 'suitable' people in. Quite frankly, the public (or elements within it) forced the change on the police, and are now reaping the rewards.
| Quote: | Like most people on BCF, i share in the general dislike of police and there arrogant approach to everything,
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Another gross generalisation. We're arrogant when approaching ANYTHING are we?
I must remember that next time I swagger into someone's house to arrogantly tell them that their loved one has died, or when I arrogantly try and keep some blood inside the next stabbed kid I come across, or when I arrogantly try and find a missing person, or arrogantly break down the door to an old dear's house because she's fallen down and can't get up, or when I run through another smoke-filled house (arrogantly, mind!) to check there's noone asleep because the water fairies have their hands full fighting the massive fire next door, etc etc.
We don't spend all our time arrogantly harassing drivers and bikers - we have the occasional 'real crime' to deal with too.
Anyway, a touch of arrogance probably helps keeps us safe - traffic policing is a tiny fraction of our job, most of the rest of it is much more unpleasant, dangerous and even more thankless.
A bit of self-confidence can help boost your own morale - as well as making evil-doers think twice about doing anything stupid.
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| Bendy |
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Bendy
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| Towton 1461 |
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Towton 1461
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| loply |
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loply
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Posted: 16:04 - 20 Jul 2010  Post subject: |
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Unfortunately it's also my experience that a lot of police officers seem hopped up on adrenalin, wanting to 'project an image', and generally trying to be the unmoving boss.
Too many of them act like jobsworths, and it seems to me they're recruiting people who are far too young and inexperienced at times.
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| MarJay |
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MarJay
But it's British!
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| SamJL |
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SamJL
Nearly there...
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| Posted: 16:18 - 20 Jul 2010 Post subject: |
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I was speaking to a couple of police bikers at BSB at Oulton Park, and they both came across as being very nice, genuine people. They even told me they definitely weren't the quickest people on the road by a mile, and there has been lots of occasions where a quicker biker has got away from them on a country lane. They also warned us to take it easy coming out of Oulton Park as there would be police on black unmarked Fireblade's, which there was. We had a good laugh with them, and they seemed like normal down to earth people.
Totally changed my perspective of police bikers in general to be honest!
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| G |
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G
The Voice of Reason
Joined: 02 Feb 2002
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| Posted: 16:51 - 20 Jul 2010 Post subject: |
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| Mister James wrote: | When the chips are down, officers enforcing a law have to make a decision, rather than offer opinions. |
Yet they so often do offer opinions as well as communicating their decisions in a rather arrogant manner.
| Quote: | People tend to see anyone who refuses to agree with something they firmly believe as arrogant (or stupid, or both!). |
Often the case.
Also when people contradict themselves, or give the distinct impression that everything they say must be true just because they are in the police, not because of what they have learned in the police.
When I got a safety lecture about crossing a white line, then the police person admitted that in fact I had been perfectly safe and had made a good judgement 'safety' wise I did consider his initial attitude to be arrogant.
| Quote: |
I would suggest that while controlling your emotions is a laudable aim, it's not always possible - THAT is human nature, and cops are no more immune to that than anyone here, and deal with a lot more shit than most. |
Well, they seriously SHOULD be more immue to 'emotions', otherwise I think most would agree they are in the wrong job.
I was amused to see on some clips program where the cop gave a fellow officer a kick while he was down - it was intended for the suspect. Sad that it was made a joke of, rather than him being disciplined for needlessly trying to kick a suspect because they had angered them.
Police training SHOULD deal with these issues and weed out those that can't control themselves; they shouldn't be given the power police are.
| Quote: | Naturally, my viewpoint is just as likely to be biased - I seldom see any recognition of such bias on BCF.
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Perhaps you should open your eyes more and practice good observation  - I've seen plenty of people compliment police, even Siggi created a thread to do so I believe in one case!
| Quote: |
I think it's fair to say that most people - regardless of background - generally think their opinion is the correct one. |
However with calm reasoning, people can actually often be swayed, telling people 'it is because it is' rarely helps.
| Quote: | The training should - but often doesn't. Officers are also expected to deal with any situation they encounter, not just those they specialise in. |
And in those circumstances, the police should request clarification from someone that does. There are numerous videos on youtube showing police that know a lot less than their 'victim' making up laws and 'bullying' members of the public with powers they don't have.
| Quote: | With millions of encounters with the public occurring all the time, it's hardly a surprise that some officers make mistakes, is it? It's not even that surprising if some are rude/arrogant/obnoxious either. It might not be right - but I posit that it's understandable. |
Considering our current system, I most definitely expect it. I also expect there to be a reasonable hatred of the police from that; just as some police seem to have a dislike of 'bikers' generally.
Again, doesn't mean that's the way it SHOULD happen or that conscientious police (yea, right ) would let it happen.
| Quote: | I also question whether many of the encounters we hear about on here actually happened as described - either because of intentional deceit, or because the 'victim' has remembered a slightly different version of events. |
And from your above 'police are normal people' comments, it would seem that sadly the same is likely true of the Police too.
| Quote: |
Passmarks were dropped because the public complained about old school coppers, so the the race-relations industry used it as a mechanism to get more 'suitable' people in. Quite frankly, the public (or elements within it) forced the change on the police, and are now reaping the rewards.
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Even more worrying, because I was talking about very few actually reaching the current pass marks, but still being let through.
| Quote: | Anyway, a touch of arrogance probably helps keeps us safe
...
A bit of self-confidence can help boost your own morale - as well as making evil-doers think twice about doing anything stupid. |
Also, it will perpetuate justified hatred and fear of the police. |
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| MonkeyKnuckle |
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MonkeyKnuckle
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| WaitingToHapp... |
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WaitingToHapp...
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| Posted: 14:19 - 21 Jul 2010 Post subject: |
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| Quote: | We had a good laugh with them, and they seemed like normal down to earth people.
Totally changed my perspective of police bikers in general to be honest! |
I agree. On the road for the very first time, whilst doing my DAS a few weeks ago, there was this marked BMW sat at the side of the road with the lights going. My first thought was "What, nicked already? I've only been on a bike for 15 sodding minutes!"
Turns out it was a old pupil of my instructor (10-odd years ago), who just wanted a chat. He ended up joining us for a while, as we were in the middle of his patrol area. Had to go off a couple of times on call, but we saw him again a couple of times during the day. Perfectly nice, decent bloke, enthusiast, and a good laugh too.
In fact, he even admitted that they hardly ever ticket bikers, if they're dressed decently (not shorts, flip-flops, etc), if the bikes in decent enough condition (not a total shed) and they weren't being a complete and utter cock.
Same as anyone, I guess. If you get pulled by one who's not in a bad mood, who likes bikes, and who's not trying to take over the world, one ticket at a time, then you'll be ok. But it still helps to treat them like humans, and not be rude...
He joined us for lunch the next day too, as well - on his 'Blade. He really wasn't hanging about on that... f'ing quick, that thing!
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| moonym20 |
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moonym20
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| Posted: 14:38 - 21 Jul 2010 Post subject: |
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I've met a few officers in my time, for some reason Traffic are the only ones I remember well.
From that, the two chaps in the T5 who chatted to me when i had an off a few years ago great... but the rest... i can honestly say, have been a shower of bastards for one reason or another....
The only other really nice copper was a WPC who pulled me in a panda car saying i'd been seen doing well over a ton a few miles back, then she clocked i was only on a 125 
I get the distinct impression its one rule for them and another for us mortals....
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Old Thread Alert!
The last post was made 16 years, 58 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful? |
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