Peoples thoughts on AR125.

[Carl_steveo]

Spotted one of these in a local bike shop. Quite like the look of it and unlike my current bike it actually works. Haven't found out all the craic about it yet. Don't know miles or the condition really so generically what are BCF's thoughts on them.

Good or bad. Compared to the NSR am I going to cry or are they similar. Pro's and cons. Should I buy it or throw more money at the NSR to fix it. (NSR doesn't need much more done to it but I'm lazy and desperate to get back on the road)

Cheers in advance.

Carl.
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Current: Honda Nsr 125
Live: Sunderland
Luke "cant be arsed to read your post, but suck my balls anyway."

[G]

It may just about match up to the original NS125F, but I don't think it even does that.
I wouldn't spent much money at all on one. I'd just sort the NSR.

[TUG]

I'd have one.
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Haz ER-5, innit!

[r0b]

A friend of mine has one which he low-sided mid-corner right in front of me going pretty slow pace. The suspension is terrible, really bad, and the bike has a small wheelbase for a 125 and takes skinny 18inch tyres that belong in the 70s

Personally I'd steer well clear, . I think an NSR is far, far, superior - my bros Aprilia AF1 125 will leave the Kwak for dead, I think you will definitely cry if you get it. fun to ride, plenty of character, but ultimately slow and antiquated compared to an nsr.

Just read this through and it seems very harsh, so as a positive they do have a nice smell/sound being a 2t rotary valve and kinda spindly retro look that could be cool. Maybe a good bike for small people since the bike is small and light. still fun and faster than a 4-stroke 125 on the straights
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'92 Honda NX650 Dominator RD02
'98 Kawasaki ZX9R C1
'00 Yamaha TT600R Belgarda

[Teflon-Mike]

I'm biased... I bought one, brand new back in 1990... I loved every moment of it, even though it was nicked three times....
At the time, it cost £1500. £500 less than a TZR, half the price of a Mito, but twice the price of an MZ! Oh, & A KH125 was £999!
Value for money, it was very good. It was a little more stylish than an MZ or KH, and quicker and better handling, and restricted it was no slower than a TZR or Mito, which it could hold in the twisties, despite its slightly old fasioned 18" skinny tyres and spindly forks.
https://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w269/teflons-torque/00_genral/BIKE_024.jpg
Mine aquired a Power-Bronze twin beam full fearing after it got nicked & trashed, which made it look a BIT like an old Gixer.... certainly fooled a few big-bike riders, who were shoked when I parked it up, and they spotted the 125 lable on the side, and wanted to know what I'd done to the motor.....
Truth was, nothing. run in to the book, and religiousely maintained.... OK, it got a couple of gear-box oil changes and a new spark plug every 1000miles!
It proved remarkable reliable..... unfortunately few were!
More especially those that suffered poor attempts at tuning.
They had no power valve to mess with, and were restricted quite comprehensively in the exhaust, not by a grindable washer, but in the end can via a laberynth of baffling, you couldn't remove without some significant metal fab.
Then in the barel with restrictive porting.
Then in the Reed & Disc valve
And the carburettor & CDI ignition.
De-restricting one is no small task!
The Sounth African version was the most powerful, think they claimed about 26 or 28bhp from it. Its certainly not far off an RS or mito, & in theory, you COULD get that sort of power out of one.
BUT, to get it!?!?
Not easy, and most that tried ended up with wrecked engines when trimmed disc valves ate the reeds and stuff.
Whether you'd find one that hadn't been too buggered about now, I dont know.
In its day, which was about 1985, it was a great bike. Its main rival was the RD125LC MK1, against which it fared pretty well, and was supposed to have a tad more speed, though not quite the style.
Now?
Well the 18" tyre sizes are still cheap and easily obtained. Not so sure about the 16" rubber used on later RD & early TZR fronts.
And as a learner mount, it can provide a lot of grins for not a lot of money... I mean, if restricted and properly learner-legal, its still about as fast as anthing else..... and the handling is quite good.....
BUT against it..... twenty odd years of learner neglect, abuse and attempts at tuning, and a destinct lack of much in the way of spares support.... apart from perhaps that nice common tyres sizing! (Same as YBR or CG I believe)
To reccomend it, it would have to be cheap, and it would have to work..... and work well!
BUT, have noted a few go for quite significant money on e-bay.... as in the £6-£700 mark.... if tested.
Your call....

Oh... forgot!
Multi-link mono-shock rear suspension, without grease nipples. Odd or wiered handling often down to it not being greased & premature wear. Mine I stripped and greased every six months or so. I also had the rear pre-load cranked right up.
some people fitted jack-up kits.... these didn't seem to suit the bike, especially if they had knackered bushes to begin with!
Forks I serviced at the same time as the rear suspension. Those skinny forks really worked the fork oil, and replacing it really made a big difference.
I also ran, I think it was about 7mm of pre-load on the fork springs, one grade higher fork oil (think I ran 10wt instead of 5wt) and a bit more of it. Cant remember how much, I think it was 10cc or 10mm more... long time ago!
And a good-ridge front brake hose.
By the standards of the day it DID handle, and was amazingly 'chuckable' in the twisties.
Ultimately it was those spindly forks that let it down, though, & I did have a few moments watching them point a completely different direction to the way I was going...... flicking through Gosford St roundabout at about 60, dragging the pegs alternately as I went!
(Yes I KNOW I was doing 60....... I had a bludy coppa tell me so when he pulled me for it!)

Other thing I forgot to mention, gagly 6'2", I found it a lot more comfortable, less cramped and with more room to move about in the saddle than a TZR, RDor NS (even though the old RD & NS had a duel-seats, they were a bit more sculpted, I think)
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My Webby'Tef's-tQ, loads of stuff about my bikes, my Land-Rovers, and the stuff I do with them!
Current Bikes:'Honda VF1000F' ;'CB750F2N' ;'CB125TD ( 6 3 of em!)'; 'Montesa Cota 248'. Learner FAQ's:= 'U want to Ride a Motorbike! Where Do U start?'

[Hobes]

[Wafer_Thin_Ham]

Get the NSR sorted. AR125's are pony.
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My Flickr

[MarJay]

[lllN30lll]

just had to go to the very very very first page of my photobucket account to find this

I butchered mine to death years ago, quality bike though, never let me down.

https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v707/lllN30lll/581H0064.jpg
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Turbo R1
CRF450R

[stevo as b4]

I really would love one for a project tbh! I havn't seen a complete cheap non runner for sale fairly locally in years, but i'd definately buy a cheap one as i think they are cool!

To the OP, i don't think 20year old 125 sports machines are the answer to your problem. for the sake of a few £££ at most get your NSR fixed, as any decent condition NSR125 of any version, Allcast or the Foxeye, will always be a far better and more superior bike to a knackered old 20yr old 125 sporty bike.

The handling and braking on an AR compared to modern 125's would be scary at best! The best thing about them is that they are alot faster than they look, and being small, lightweight (107kg) and having a small frontal area, and skinny little tyres mean that they really make 12bhp go further than most modern 125's do!

78mph and an 18.2sec 1/4mile from 12bhp isn't bad IMO. It can only be bettered by the equally spindly and tiny RG125 Gamma, which topped a real 80mph on just 12bhp!

[Rob W]

[hmmmnz]

they are essentially water cooled kh125's with better brakes and a few other nubbins,
ive never owned a ar125 but ive got 2 kh's
and a water cooled version can only be good
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the humans are dead
I kick arse for the lord
Wiring Diagrams BIDNIP it bitches

[evoboy]

Id have one.

Theres no real comparison in terms of overall performance between the AR and an NSR. Theres a good few years development advances between the 2.
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Suzuki GT250 x7------- Fazer 600------CB250RS------Aprilia Rally 70----- Bandit 600

APT Motorcycles

[Kickstart]

Hi

I would be tempted for a play, but think for everyday use I would want to be certain of what spares are still available from Kawasaki.

Might be worth checking the exact model of AR125, as Kawasaki did import the full power ones as well as the restricted ones (full power ones were fairly common in Northern Ireland where they had the 250 learner law for far longer, but where 250cc insurance would cost you an arm and a leg).

All the best

Keith
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Traxpics, track day and racing photographs - Bimota Forum - Bike performance / thrust graphs for choosing gearing

[Carl_steveo]

It's gone now, my mate popped in because he wanted it aswell. Lad has sold it but is expecting a Suzuki RG in at some point so my mate has first refusal.

Thanks for the input though guys will probablys be asking again in the near future.


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Current: Honda Nsr 125
Live: Sunderland
Luke "cant be arsed to read your post, but suck my balls anyway."

[27cows]

Pretty tough. Not bad as a commuter bike. Not at all sporty, though. Handling is pish. I could run rings round one on my elderly RXS (and have done more than once ).
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The RXS100: vehicle of choice for Chuck Norris

[Carl_steveo]

Right my mate has text me, the place has rang him back about the AR. The lad he sold it too couldn't keep up the repayments already it's only been a few days. Anyway he's offered it too my mate for £650 for the bike and a spare engine plus a years test etc etc.

The bike shop also has an RG Gamma coming in aswell so should my mate get the AR or wait for the Gamma. I know what I prefer but what does BCF think.
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Current: Honda Nsr 125
Live: Sunderland
Luke "cant be arsed to read your post, but suck my balls anyway."

[evoboy]

The Gamma was quicker.

But its very, very small in size.
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Suzuki GT250 x7------- Fazer 600------CB250RS------Aprilia Rally 70----- Bandit 600

APT Motorcycles

[stevo as b4]

Whichever is in the best condition. They are both faster when restricted than an NS125F/R or RD125LC. When full power they too can at the least match a decent LC, some say the AR and RG are slightly quicker.

I think the RG handle's a tiny bit better than the AR, but both are years behind the chassis of a TZR let alone an NSR or RS125 etc.

[Kickstart]

Hi

The RG was an 80 fitted with a 125 engine for some markets, hence being tiny.

Only ridden one and that had knackered steering head bearings so didn't handle.

All the best

Keith
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Traxpics, track day and racing photographs - Bimota Forum - Bike performance / thrust graphs for choosing gearing

[27cows]

The Gammas had pretty fragile motors, made all the less reliable after several home rebuilds by teenage enthusiasts. Anything more than about 400 notes is too much money to pay for an RG or AR, unless they're in exceptional nick.

Handling of the RG is vastly superior to the AR, which is pretty much just a commuter bike with a bit of mildly tarty plastic on it to made it look vaguely sporty.
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The RXS100: vehicle of choice for Chuck Norris

[TUG]

[Teflon-Mike]

[27cows]

The AR had similar handling to the RXS I've ridden for so many years. In fact, the RXS is probably better if anything. That makes the AR a commuter bike in my opinion. Just look at its frame - it's got commuter written all over it. It may have been 'sports' in 1982, but it ain't now
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The RXS100: vehicle of choice for Chuck Norris

[stevo as b4]

Thats a fair point IMO! The once sporty AR or RDLC etc etc, now make good commuters with a bit more in the way of features and equipment and spec than purely always commuter bikes like the H100 or RXS100 etc. I would lump the KH100EX and KH125 in as pure commuter bike's too, but not the AR, RG, NS, MBX or any LC.

The KH100EX and some models of KH125 were at the time really sporty for commuter bikes, having nice cast alloy wheels, front discs, sporty paintjobs like the KH250/400's and they were nippy too! The KH100EX made 11.8bhp, and the early pre-82 KH125's were much like the GP125 suzuki or Yamaha RS125 having around 15-16bhp.

I'd not say that the tiny and also very spindly RG125 Gamma has massively better handling than the AR, but it's box section frame and slightly better forks give it the edge over the AR. Either way for 12bhp bikes they were both alot faster as std than the NS125F or RDLC, the AR topping 78mph and the Gamma 80.8mph and the suzuki did a 17.84sec standing 1/4m. That's almost silly fast for a 12bhp bike IMO! The NS125 and LC were nearly 10mph slower and well over a second down on the 1/4mile in MCN's group test figures.

The full power 21bhp AR's managed just over 19bhp at the back wheel, and have actually got a bit of a reputation for being easy to tune further for up to 30bhp r/w with serious engine mods. The rotary valve engine seems to hold on to it's power well after peaking, and tuned examples have topped 100mph. No RXS100 is going to beat that is it?