Starting Probs...someone help please. All sorted :)

[dannyw35]

Hi,

After riding my 2003 R6 for the last few weeks...one night after leaving it outside for a few hours I had trouble starting the bike...

The engine ticks over but the bike doesn't fire up...I tried holding the ignition for a little longer but nothing still.

I thought it maybe battery related so I charged it up and gave it another try over the weekend...again nothing...

On my last attempt exhaust was spluttering and then it started...great i thought...

Bike was running for a few mins and idled up to 50degrees...pulled on the throttle and the bike just died...weird...

Refused to start again...charged the battery overnight and checked it again today...the battery was just around 12.2/4 volts...when trying the starter again it dips to around 10 volts...

Is this normal??

Any help or advice would be much appreciated.

Thanks
____________________
CBT - 13/01/08 -> Theory 18/01/08 -> Honda Accord Type R sold 02/02/08 -> DAS 19/02/08
-> CBR 600FS 20/02/08

[Scotsman37]

Have you checked that your spark plugs are all ok and or made sure nobody had messed around with the fuel mixture screw for carbs causing the engine revs to remain extremely low?

Have you made sure that your fuel flow from tank has not been turned off?

[Howling TerrorOutOfOffice]

You may lucky. It could just be your battery. 12.4 volts is a poorly charged battery.
Try the multimeter whilst the bike is idling and run to 4k. Should be putting in at least 13 volts.
Check battery levels.

This chart is also handy to keep.

https://www.totalmotorcycle.com/maintenance/photos/BatteryChart.gif

Weak power to the ecu can play silly buggers with modern bikes.

[lihp]

Bike is fuel injected so not carbs dude.

Have you tried bump starting it?

[dannyw35]

@ scotsman

The bike is fuel injected and doesn't have a fuel tap...guessing the mix etc is not something easily messed with...

@ howling terror

Thanks for the chart...very handy

Yep i thought 12.4 was low myself...that's after a good 16-18 hours on a bike charger...

Unfortunately I cannot get the bike started so cannot check voltage at idle...

I also thought 10v was too low on start up...but I've been struggling to find anything online to confirm this...

I might just have to get a new battery as it's probably the cheapest trial and error type fix of them all...
____________________
CBT - 13/01/08 -> Theory 18/01/08 -> Honda Accord Type R sold 02/02/08 -> DAS 19/02/08
-> CBR 600FS 20/02/08

[Scotsman37]

Oops, but have you checked your spark plugs as yet?

[dannyw35]

Nope not got round to checking the plugs yet. May have to wait for next weekend.

Same for bump starting. Weather was pants this weekend!


Will have to investigate properly next weekend.
____________________
CBT - 13/01/08 -> Theory 18/01/08 -> Honda Accord Type R sold 02/02/08 -> DAS 19/02/08
-> CBR 600FS 20/02/08

[Scotsman37]

[0l0dom0l0]

A couple of things for you to try.

Before you take the plugs out and replace them (which I would recommend). They collect moisture over time and once they have been warmed up a couple of times, like to try and 'dry out'. Unfortunately this is normally happens on the electrode which causes a loss of spark.

A friend of mine had a Daytona 600 with a fooked battery. It would turn over and try to start but would go flat after maybe 15 seconds of cranking. I'm assuming yours isn't that bad? The problem with it was that there wasn't a high enough voltage for the fuel injection to work so it wasn't getting any fuel. Yamaha's especially the R6, R1's etc need a very strong voltage across the FI for them to start. Even if the bike cranks okay they still don't fire. Also your spluttering is classic symptoms of this. It tries to start when the voltage is the highest but the battery doesn't last long enough for it to run properly.

If you battery is holding about 12.4 and going down to 10v when cranking, then I don't think it will ever start. The only solution that normally works is a bump start, as the engine turning over at higher revs, causes the alternator to produce a voltage and current charging the battery, bringing it up to the 13v its should be at.

Try bumping it first, then replace the battery, or you could jump it off a car/bike. If that works then its pretty much 100% the battery.

Hope that helps.

[Robby]

If it was running well then suddenly stopped then I wouldn't expect spark plugs to be a problem. They do last for absolutely ages, you could probably get 50k out of a set on a modern 4 stroke.

Get a new battery and see. Don't keep trying to make it run on a knackered battery, and don't pull the whole bike apart trying to find other problems.

Modern gel batteries die like this. One day fine, next day dead, with little or no warning. If it was the original battery, then 7-8 years is about the most you can expect from one.

[dannyw35]

@ 0l0dom0l0

Thanks for the info - my bike symptons sound an awfully like your friends daytona...although my battery doesn't die after 15 secs!

I was thinking that the big drop in voltage when cranking her over was never a good sign...

@ Robby

I was hoping that it wasn't the plugs...like you said it running fine and then all of a sudden it went pear shaped...

Thanks to all for your advice so far...

I've gone and bought a new battery...just need to charge it up and hope it all works when fitted...will let you know how it all goes.


____________________
CBT - 13/01/08 -> Theory 18/01/08 -> Honda Accord Type R sold 02/02/08 -> DAS 19/02/08
-> CBR 600FS 20/02/08

[ClockworkJesu...]

Sounds like an ignition problem.
try attacking your spark-plug terminals with a wire-brush, always a good start. Always worked for me - although I realize a 125cc carbed 4stroke might be a little different!

Always used to stick the plug in a socket, and attack the end with a hot-air paint stripper gun for a minute or two, just to get the end hot so he thinks he's running a hot engine. Helps with auto-ignition!

Also, make sure your battery terminals are nice and tight. That can always be a problem...


Thats all I can say. Could always be incorrect, but hey!

[Robby]

Of course, once you have sorted the problem then it sounds like it ready for a service, if you don't know how long it was since the plugs were changed. They still need checking from time to time, and once you've stripped down that far you might as well change them. They may also try to corrode into the head over time.

Be very careful not to overtighten them. The combination of a fine thread, a crush washer, and a soft alloy head means they need very little torque to make a good seal, and not much more torque to strip the thread. A stripped thread becomes a difficult and time consuming job to fix. Avoid the temptation to coat the threads with copper grease if re-using the same plugs, a rub with a pencil is a far better idea. Graphite makes a good lubricant on fine threads that are rarely operated and subjected to high temperatures.

[0l0dom0l0]

Any luck?
____________________
CBT Passed: 30/08/2009, Theory Passed: 31/08/2010, Mod 1 Passed: 6/9/2010, Mod 2 Passed: 13/09/2010. Restriction ended 13/09/2012.

Bikes: 2007 Derbi GPR 50, 1998 Yamaha Fazer 600 (written off), 2002 Yamaha Fazer 600, 1994 CBR 600F, 2003 Triumph Daytona 600, Kawasaki ZX6R J1.....Current: 2006 Yamaha FZ6, 1998 Suzuki TL1000R and a Honda VFR 400 NC30.

[dannyw35]

[dannyw35]

Just a quick update.

Fitted the new battery today. Fired up on the first attempt

Happy days.

Thanks to all for your help and advice. Just need to get it in for a service.
____________________
CBT - 13/01/08 -> Theory 18/01/08 -> Honda Accord Type R sold 02/02/08 -> DAS 19/02/08
-> CBR 600FS 20/02/08