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Busted - doh.

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Kris
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PostPosted: 09:12 - 08 Jul 2011    Post subject: Busted - doh. Reply with quote

/facepalm

94 in a 70 (Mway)

Decided in my infinite wisdom to undertake and give a 'WTF idiot' stare to a silver Jag XF hogging lane 3 this morning.

After this, and the further two undertakes on dawdling commuters, you can imagine my suprise when that same silver Jag comes tearing up behind with blues and two's on....

Police Police Police Police

Clocked at 94 between two fixed points (he showed me the screen readout) but refused to show me the video. In the end I accepted the 3 points and £60 fixed penatly bribe with good grace.

Ho-hum. That'll teach me for lack of obs.
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c_dug
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PostPosted: 09:16 - 08 Jul 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

At least he didn't try for the undertake, that would have taken the piss. The speeding you can't really argue with.
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T.C
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PostPosted: 09:56 - 08 Jul 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

c_dug wrote:
At least he didn't try for the undertake, that would have taken the piss. The speeding you can't really argue with.


Can't be booked for an offence that does not exist?

That is why he only got booked for the excess speed
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Wafer_Thin_Ham
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PostPosted: 09:58 - 08 Jul 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

T.C wrote:
c_dug wrote:
At least he didn't try for the undertake, that would have taken the piss. The speeding you can't really argue with.


Can't be booked for an offence that does not exist?

That is why he only got booked for the excess speed


Driving without Due Care?

I've been given a bollocking for undertaking and that was only a few months back. I'm aware it doesn't technicaly exist anymore, but thought it fell under driving without due care.
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Kris
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PostPosted: 10:02 - 08 Jul 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Big_Ham wrote:

Driving without Due Care?


That's what I was threatened with if I 'dared to take it to court'.

With three consecutive undertakes, with the first (on plod) being a bit sketchy I wasn't going to risk it...
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Daimo
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PostPosted: 10:08 - 08 Jul 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Who's driving without due care?

the person sitting in lane 3, not moving to the left and not aware whats going on around him?

Or the person sitting in lane 2, fully aware of whats going on, and taking the decision to undertake, still fully observing whats goin on around him.

Utterly rediculas law, another of many that needs to be moved forward. All lane overtaking like America ftw.
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mr jamez
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PostPosted: 10:18 - 08 Jul 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bad darts.

Paddy made a thread about a unmarked XF in Kent...

https://www.bikechatforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=221976&highlight=jaguar
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schooleydoo
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PostPosted: 10:34 - 08 Jul 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

mr jamez wrote:
Bad darts.

Paddy made a thread about a unmarked XF in Kent...

https://www.bikechatforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=221976&highlight=jaguar


Another lack of observation by the OP.

Razz

I think 3 points is probably the best outcome you could hope for tbh. I'm glad he took your look during your undertake as he should have - totally justified. Another officer may have decided to make your life hell to feed his superiority complex.

Lane hogs drive me nuts.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 11:01 - 08 Jul 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

And you just know that copper is going to boot it all the way home after his shift, undertaking and cutting folk up like a proper mental.
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Kris
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PostPosted: 11:05 - 08 Jul 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Another lack of observation by the OP.


True dat. Mr. Green I even posted on that thread having seen it pull a car on a stretch of road near my commute. Laughing

Anyway, for posterity:

Reg: GN10 FZA

https://www.motorward.com/wp-content/images/2010/02/2011-Jaguar-XF-S-2.jpg
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2 wheels please
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PostPosted: 11:15 - 08 Jul 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey could of been worse you could of flipped him off hahaha Very Happy.
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Chriss
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PostPosted: 11:17 - 08 Jul 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kris wrote:
https://www.motorward.com/wp-content/images/2010/02/2011-Jaguar-XF-S-2.jpg


I thought police forces were pleading poverty at the moment and they have officers driving those things?!
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T.C
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PostPosted: 12:09 - 08 Jul 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Big_Ham wrote:


Driving without Due Care?

I've been given a bollocking for undertaking and that was only a few months back. I'm aware it doesn't technicaly exist anymore, but thought it fell under driving without due care.


To convict for an offence of driving without Due Care and Attention, the prosecution have to prove that the standard of riding or driving fell well below that expected of a reasonably competent driver, and the act of the nearside undertake on its own is insufficient.

If the rider is weaving from lane to lane, then that could be sufficient for a section 3 conviction depending on the circumstances, but on its own? No way!!!!!

The absolute offence of nearside overtake was removed from the statute books with the introduction of the 1972 Road Traffic Act, which left only the offence of careless driving, but the argument of reasonably competent driver still had to be addressed.

However, if a vehicle is sat in lane 2 or 3 when the inside lane is clear, then that driver will be commiting the offence of driving without reasonable consideration for other road users which is a sub section of section 3 (careless driving), but unfortunately the Police these days have no interest of doing anything about these w@nkers!!!! Evil or Very Mad

So if anyone gets booked for careless driving for doing a similar thing (providing excess speed is not involved which is a separate matter) then contest it and plead not guilty.

Even in civil accident cases, the courts are now accepting that an undertake is permissable and drivers who have moved from the outside lane into the nearside lane without checking and end up taking out the undertaking motorcyclist have been found liable with no contributory negligence against the rider.
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keggyhander
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PostPosted: 18:14 - 08 Jul 2011    Post subject: Re: Busted - doh. Reply with quote

Kris wrote:
Clocked at 94 between two fixed points (he showed me the screen readout) but refused to show me the video. In the end I accepted the 3 points and £60 fixed penatly bribe with good grace.


So you allowed yourself to be ring-raped when there was no evidence?

Should have refused the ticket.
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neil.
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PostPosted: 19:39 - 08 Jul 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

T.C wrote:
Even in civil accident cases, the courts are now accepting that an undertake is permissable and drivers who have moved from the outside lane into the nearside lane without checking and end up taking out the undertaking motorcyclist have been found liable with no contributory negligence against the rider.


This is exactly what happened to me recently (multi-lane traffic light controlled roundabout, I was on the nearside lane, other driver was in centre lane which was starting to queue, the nearside lane was clear, and I was progressing towards the lights (I didn't change lanes at all, was always in that lane from the start) and she changed lanes into the rear/right side of my bike (dent in the silencer) to either undertake or take an exit (if she was taking that exit, she also would have been disobeying the lane marking arrows). She is disputing my claim saying I was undertaking - reading what you've wrote is getting my hopes up a little. Smile Karma
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Clanger
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PostPosted: 21:04 - 08 Jul 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kris wrote:


Oooh, I do believe I've seen this car over here in Sussex. So it's possibly doing the rounds. Exclamation
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Livefast123
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PostPosted: 21:20 - 08 Jul 2011    Post subject: Re: Busted - doh. Reply with quote

[/quote]So you allowed yourself to be ring-raped when there was no evidence?[/quote]

What do you think the display is? I think that was a reasonable way of dealing with the offence on behalf of the cop at 94 Mph, could have been much worse if you'd have come up against a jobsworth.

Why would you want to put yourself in a position of danger by undertaking a few cars at motorway speed is beyond me. Everyone knows that car drivers are not the best at looking in their mirrors and finding that you are not liable for the accident isn't going to help you when you end up in intensive care or six foot under.
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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 21:50 - 08 Jul 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

I got pulled in my Alfa one night for coming up behind some twat in a deserted motorway sitting in the centre lane. I swerved round him/her and cut back into the inside line. A few hundred yards later, blue lights, siren, pull in.

I have no idea where the bastard came from, maybe one of those viewing points at the side of the motorway. Anyway pulled me and threatened me with careless for cutting up said lane hogger. When I said about him sitting in the middle lane, the cop said it wasn't my job to teach others the highway code in an aggressive manner and why didn't I just go past him in the inside lane Shocked . I was rather suprised at that I must admit.

He let me go with a bollocking, fair enough I suppose but I still feel it shouldn't have been me being pulled.

Oh, and when said lane hogger came past me and I bet he was laughing his cock off.
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T.C
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PostPosted: 22:39 - 08 Jul 2011    Post subject: Re: Busted - doh. Reply with quote

keggyhander wrote:
Kris wrote:
Clocked at 94 between two fixed points (he showed me the screen readout) but refused to show me the video. In the end I accepted the 3 points and £60 fixed penatly bribe with good grace.


So you allowed yourself to be ring-raped when there was no evidence?

Should have refused the ticket.


Well as a qualified legal expert, you should know that there is no legal requirement for the offence of excess speed to be recorded or caught on video.

Provided the traffic cops evidence of opinion is corroborated by a device such as a certified speedo, that is quite sufficent to report and obtain a conviction.

Speed reckless does not even require corroboration, that offence can be reported for purely on a traffic cops expert evidence of opinion that he considered the speed excessive for the conditions and there is no recording at all or corroborative evidence.
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Macie_UK
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PostPosted: 22:53 - 08 Jul 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

T.C wrote:
c_dug wrote:
At least he didn't try for the undertake, that would have taken the piss. The speeding you can't really argue with.


Can't be booked for an offence that does not exist?


Technically no, but I know 2 people that have got prosecuted for this. They turn it into DCA, or in both these cases, careless driving. [1]

At less than 90, on a motorway. That'll be 6 points and £500 please.....

I think it stinks, undertaking should be allowed due to the inept number of lane 2 and 3 dawdlers, but thems the rules boys Crying or Very sad

[1] Not to mention small child, who, when also pulled for a similar misdemeanor and told that filtering was illegal responded with "Oh that's great, so we have here people that enforce the law when they don't fucking understand it".....and promptly had a swift visit to the cells and a thorough bike checking over......
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T.C
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PostPosted: 22:56 - 08 Jul 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Macie_UK wrote:


Technically no, but I know 2 people that have got prosecuted for this. They turn it into DCA, or in both these cases, careless driving.


Then they should have pleaded not guilty, or they did not tell you the full story and their driving did fall below that expected of a reasonably competent driver, which is why they got done for the section 3 offence.
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Jayy
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PostPosted: 22:56 - 08 Jul 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

I got pulled by an un-marked car on the way to see a friend in hospital with TUG off here. I was leading, sitting in a single lane with a gold/beige Volvo estate in front sticking to 30mph, road then splits into two lanes, bus lane on the inside and I stupidly opened it up and went on the inside of the Volvo.... queue blue lights and a bollocking but luckily they were on their way to the same hospital and after explaining we were rushing as a friend had been in an accident, they let me off and said "see you there".

I've actually managed to some how avoid ever getting any points and I've been banned from riding twice in a 10 year period Rolling Eyes
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MinhDinh
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PostPosted: 23:14 - 08 Jul 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Recoil Jay wrote:
I got pulled by an un-marked car on the way to see a friend in hospital with TUG off here. I was leading, sitting in a single lane with a gold/beige Volvo estate in front sticking to 30mph, road then splits into two lanes, bus lane on the inside and I stupidly opened it up and went on the inside of the Volvo.... queue blue lights and a bollocking but luckily they were on their way to the same hospital and after explaining we were rushing as a friend had been in an accident, they let me off and said "see you there".

I've actually managed to some how avoid ever getting any points and I've been banned from riding twice in a 10 year period Rolling Eyes

Yes but being banned twice is worse than getting points :p
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-LG-
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PostPosted: 23:25 - 08 Jul 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Didn't you notice they where Police when you looked in the car? xD.
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Jayy
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PostPosted: 23:31 - 08 Jul 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yep, getting a ban is far worse than points, just think it's strange how I've never amassed any points before and I've been pulled over too many times to count.
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