Motorcycle Engineering

[Nick 50]

After many dreary years of waking up dreading going to work in the Civil Service I decided to make a change.

So one day I woke up and started looking about going back into education to become an Engineer. The next day I enrolled on a college Access course which I have just finished.
In September I will be starting a Mechanical Engineering degree.

Are there any engineers on the forum who work within the Motorcycle Industry who could share thoughts on their job role?

Triumph have a graduate programme for Design & Project Engineers (Powertrain & Chassis) which looks very interesting and would be something I would enjoy (plus they have a Bike Purchase Scheme).

[bacon]

An mechy engineer buddy of mine has just graduated and done exactly that, gone straight into a job with triumph, he hasn't got a licence yet but with help from me and my buddy hes going to have it soon and get himself a new bike on that scheme
When I next chat to him I'll find out what he's up to with his job and what its like.

I made the mistake of doing civil engineering and kind of wish I'd specialised in mechanical instead, oh well!

Either way I hope your maths is up to scratch as engineering is a tough degree, good luck mate

[cromwell]

Literally just about to start doing this, the access course bit anyway. Study engineering when I left school but due to family issues etc. had to drop out and get a job so getting back into it now.
What uni are you heading to ?

[The Tot]

Two of my uni mates did a year out in industry with Triumph. They're very much production driven but if you live and breath bikes, then they it's the ideal place for you. I didn't like their application form where it said "applicants must be british or EU citizens!"... ironically, my mate was a yank.

Mechanical engineering will give you a VERY good grounding of all engineering principles. I ended up doing materials engineering because I have a more forensic eye and get a buzz doing failure investigations, material selection and general metallurgy.

I ended up doing a few papers about chassis materials and construction methodologies for a few of my modules.

But with mech eng, it does help if your maths is sharp, which, unfortunately for me was my downfall - I totally hate pure maths.
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The Tot 2019 Z1000SX - 2007 R1
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[carlosthejack...]

The son-in-law's an engineer, fixes heavy factory machinery and the like. He hasn't got the first idea about bikes, cars or engines. Same as me, twist that and it goes. Press that and it stops. Granted he's more electrical than mechanical, but he still hits machines with hammers. I would've thought he'd be ok with engines, but no.

I'd love to know more, but alas, my current employer has me bang to rights!
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[ace-card]

I've just finished my first year of Motorsport Engineering at UWE, Bristol......It's heavy on the maths.....crops up everywhere! But I love it! Starting to think about my placement year now. The motorsport degree is basically the same as mechanical, but with a lean (no pun intended ) towards vehicles.
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[The Tot]

Might I also add, if you show proactiveness and elect to be a member of the Formula Student team, it helps loads... actually, maybe not.. some of them are right berks who don't really talk much sense and shouldn't really be trusted near the spanner. However, they do interesting stuff with bike engines.

Since I did (automotive) materials engineering, we had a project where we were tasked with redesigning components for our '09 car - split rim CF wheels and engine components, all for the purpose of reducing weight.

Different teams/unis approach the problem in different ways and therein lies the challenge. Very interesting and involving and one thing to put on your CV.
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The Tot 2019 Z1000SX - 2007 R1
Never argue with autism

[Frost]

[Nick 50]

Thanks all for the replies.

bacon

That would be great thanks. I bet he is really enjoying it though if he is even just remotely interested in bikes.

I sat down and had good look and researched which engineering discipline to do. Mechanical seemed to open the most doors from the angle I was looking and the degree looked as it would be the one I would enjoy the most.

cromwell

Good choice getting back into it, you wont regret it. Which Access course you doing?
I was lucky that I had a college that ran an Access to Engineering course pretty close to me.

I will going to Newcastle University. I also applied to Durham but got rejected apparently my GCSE (which I took 16 years ago) weren't good enough even though I was getting top marks on my Access course.

If you need any help on the Access course just give me a shout. I have file upon file of course notes and got my assignments back too, so have tonnes of stuff that will help.

The Tot

I had quite liked the look of materials until I did my Access course. There was a specific Materials module and some of the assignments we did for Materials were huge (my biggest was 80 pages). I enjoyed the researching of the topic just hated the "English" part of having to write assignments on it.

Yep agree with your comment about Mechanical. One of my cousins is an engineer in a Nuclear plant and he advised not to go to specified (like Offshore, Motorsport etc etc) in case the industry falls apart in this country and I would be left with a highly specialised degree with a shortage of jobs.

carlosthejack...

I'm not surprised he doesn't know how to "fix" something as very few true engineering roles are to fix things especially on the Electrical side. Electrical engineering degree lean much more towards theory of how electricity works, how to calculate voltages, amps etc in a circuit and then the electronic side is leaning towards developing microchips and the like.
An Engineer is far closer to a Scientist than to a Mechanic.

ace-card

Where you looking at for your year out? On our open day at Newcastle Uni one of the students there had just come back from a year at McClaren, he wouldn't shut up about how great it was .

I'm not going for a year out (i'm 33 now so getting on). I'm hoping to jump on to the 4 year Meng and then go in to industry from there which would mean i'll be 37 when I come out (so pushing on in age for a graduate).

The Tot

Yep the formula student looked great at Newcastle. They really sold it on the open day until they said they were going down the electric motor route . But yep it would be something great to have on the CV.
I just have to make sure I stick in and impress enough to get on the team as it's highly competitive to get on the team.

I've already made inroads about an Engineering Society which I hope will show my pro-activeness (i'm usually quite sharp that way anyway) and help towards getting on the team.


The Maths

Yep, I was quite naive about just how much Maths was involved before doing the Access course.
Our course leader taught maths for the course. He is an Accredited Engineer who has a masters in Mathematics from Oxford.
Even the external verifier said he was teaching maths at a higher level than level 3. At times we hated him for doing it so intensively but we all knew he was doing it for our benefit so we would do better at Uni.

I pretty much enjoyed all the Maths apart from Differential Equations. We had 4 lessons and some the questions he expected us to answer was above all our heads .

I have a couple of books on order to get some practice in over the summer.
I had ordered a calculus one a few months back and when it came I realised I had ordered a book full of answers. I needed to of order the book with the questions in!! DOH! So that is on its way from the US.

[ZRX61]

Concentrate heavily on the fluids angle & you'l never be piss poor.... if you go into motorcycles you'l be potless..
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[c-m]

Edit - already answered
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[Nick 50]

[The Tot]

You say that your cousin suggested not to go "specific" - I graduated with an Automotive Engineering degree (luckily it was classed as a BEng rather than BSc) purely because we had a LOT of mechanics thrown in which the standard materials engineers didn't have. Their optional modules were wishy-washy, like business and accountacy etc, whereas we delved deeper into the more engineering aspects, applied to the automotive modules.

Ironically, it was this "speciality" that got me my job with EDF Energy. The Interviewer, who is now my professional institution mentor, did a long stint working at general motors as a failure investigator/materials performance. Because I'd already spent a year out working at Torness Nuclear Power Station, I was expecting him to ask me materials related questions to do with the reactor and turbines... instead he asked me, deliberately, about what sort of stresses and degradation mechanisms you might expect on your bike's engine and chassis components! That stirred up the hornet's nest slightly and I definitely was NOT expecting it! Needless to say, he was looking for the the applicability of basic engineering principles into a specialised subject.

Applied degrees/modules can act as a double edge sword, however, trying to explain to potential employers that you are fundementally a materials engineer requires some convincing because of my degree title. I just summed it up as... I'm a metallurgist but I chose to do automotive modules instead of accountancy and languages!

That's just a bit of insight for you. Evidentally, if you choose to become chartered, which in the case of EDF Energy, all graduates are encouraged to develop into chartered engineers, IMechE require an MEng level qualification... I have to jump through hoops i.e. further learning to at least an MSc level before I can progress.

But you've made the right move and you'll be satisfied with what you pick up at the end of the degree... more than anything else, you'll soon realise that there's more to engineering than being geeky. All the lads at my work have a Jeckell and Hyde complex!
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The Tot 2019 Z1000SX - 2007 R1
Never argue with autism

[cromwell]

It's just called Engineering and Science, I've applied to a few as I'm moving up to London next week and about four or five places do it so I spread my options out to see which college I felt more comfortable with, still not one hundred percent decided which I want to go to.

As for the Maths thing, I think that's a bit ridiculous that they are still taking the grade you got 17 years ago when we really didn't pay attention in school to your results from a course you've left a job to study and given your all in.

I'll drop you a PM later on when the course gets up and running if I need any help mate, thanks for the offer, really appreciate it.
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[Frost]

Calculus is very very important. As is linear algebra. Vibrations is probably the most important module to do (at Bristol it came in 3 2 summester long parts ) understand vibrations, and everything else falls into place, well i think so anyway.

https://www.khanacademy.org/

Use and abuse that site.

[ace-card]

[HD]

Will be looking into doing this myself when I get a bit older.

Taking A level Maths, Engineering, Physics and an AS in Geography.

I've been told by a few people that working in something your interested in (eg. bikes) can change it from a hobby into a chore and make you hate them! Is this true?

Also, how many of you are paying for these courses yourself? I am thinking of joining the RAF as an Engineer Officer as its a good, secure job, good lifestyle, interesting, they sponsor you to do your degree and pay you £19,000 IIRC while doing it!

If I did it myself, what sort of pay would I be looking at and where else could I go?

I will be doing my research into the different courses and stuff but I'm not interested in Civil, can't stand electrics so mechanical seems the best bet.

Sorry for the thread hijack
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[Tristan.]

[Frost]

Imperial had a TT Zero 'team' on the go, but frankly their efforts were laughable They went for a BIG bike needing a shit load of power, resulting in more weight, needing a bigger bike etc. which is a shame cause i'd have been well up for it!

[olionel]

right.. if you wana work in automotive/motorsport, at uni try your best to get in to the Formula Student team (if the uni has one) if not put a team together try find some money, it's good for recruitment, showing off (as a uni) and developing the students.
I was involved all my 4 years, it is good stuff... building a car from scratch and racing it. Quite a few of the team members end up working for automotive companies. Although a direct access to F1 seems to be Oxford Brooks Motorsport Engineering degree (ofcourse make it to the formula student team).

EDIT: just realised FS has been mentioned...shouldve read the whole thread first.. deerrrr
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[ace-card]