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Nick__C
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PostPosted: 00:12 - 17 Oct 2011    Post subject: 'Occupy' Reply with quote
These Occupy movements then..

What say you?

Bit of direct action is always ( alright, generally) good imo.. except when it's misguided which these protests seem to be..

Legitimate protest with legitimate aims or the "over educated, under employed" jumping on the bandwagon making a fuss over nothing?[/i]
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fatpies
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PostPosted: 00:17 - 17 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote
Are they armed?

If not then its merely noise, if they had much larger numbers torches and pitchforks even. And or the government started shooting them. Then I may sit up and pay attention, otherwise meh.
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Nick__C
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PostPosted: 00:27 - 17 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote
They are armed with signs and banners? Laughing
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Mushroom
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PostPosted: 08:30 - 17 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote
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There is some confusion about what exactly protesters like your self are calling for, how would you describe the movement and your demands?

I guess its really hard to put it all into one sentence you know, I have my own reasons, I was actually a victim of domestic violence I had a man that abused me for several years and when I went to the cops or the courts they basically ignored me or demeaned me and I had cases dismissed and things like that.

That"s one of my personal reasons, and then seeing how the cops acted the other day and how violent they were towards the women its no surprise they weren't there to protect me because there targeting women as well, I guess I would say that our message is that people come before profit.


A lot of them seem confused - have little understanding of the finance world But just know something is wrong, if they had understanding it would sound like this

" We are the 99%, 50% of us pay no tax while the 1% pay 40% of taxes "

There funding is traced back to george soros, anti-consumer,capitalism groups, socialist and "anarchists"

Rock on.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oSo-MEiMbac
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GhostRider
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PostPosted: 08:43 - 17 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote
Yeah, I like the sentiment and all, but how long have they been in Wall Street now? What's changed? Fuck all. What will change? Fuck all. THe only difference they will make is the extra 2 min journey the bankers have to make walked around them all to get into their office. When they start setting bankers alight with petrol and flame, then they might make some difference. Peaceful protest will never summon progress.

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fatpies
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PostPosted: 08:51 - 17 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote
GhostRider wrote:
Yeah, I like the sentiment and all, but how long have they been in Wall Street now? What's changed?


When they start setting bankers alight with petrol and flame, then they might make some difference. Peaceful protest will never summon progress.

GhostRider


Heh which is why the looting and recent riots were more of a real protest than this. Though really it depends on ho the authorities react and if there is any escalation. If it gets to the point of clubbing and shooting such people for refusing to leave a great number of people may get angry and grab the pitchforks themselves.

And no I haven't grabbed my pitch fork either.
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Wafer_Thin_Ham
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PostPosted: 08:52 - 17 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote
They don't have a better system, they're just bitching about the current one. And why don't they have jobs to go to? Wink
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fatpies
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PostPosted: 08:56 - 17 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote
Big_Ham wrote:
They don't have a better system, they're just bitching about the current one. And why don't they have jobs to go to? Wink


There is a better system though! Look at Asia the key is to remove the rentiers and to remove the government support for the rentiers.

In removing the rentiers and or their government support the farmer in my oft used example does not have to pay as much to the landlord and the government doesn't have to take as much in tribute which actually increases the amount of rent he has to pay.


Secondly, outsourcing, insourcing of migrants and automation.
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Wafer_Thin_Ham
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PostPosted: 09:13 - 17 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote
fatpies wrote:

There is a better system though! Look at Asia the key is to remove the rentiers and to remove the government support for the rentiers.

In removing the rentiers and or their government support the farmer in my oft used example does not have to pay as much to the landlord and the government doesn't have to take as much in tribute which actually increases the amount of rent he has to pay.


Secondly, outsourcing, insourcing of migrants and automation.


Then why are they not using this example to add weight to their arguement?

All I've seen thus far is that they're Anti Capitalist......
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fatpies
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PostPosted: 09:28 - 17 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote
Big_Ham wrote:


Then why are they not using this example to add weight to their arguement?

All I've seen thus far is that they're Anti Capitalist......


You forget one thing, the UK is a command economy and it only pretends to be capitalist.

https://www.channel4.com/programmes/britains-trillion-pound-horror-story

If you've got 90 minutes have a look at this. The UK government accounts for over 50% of the UK economy, which is pretty much a command economy. Things like socialising losses of private companies doesn't happen in capitalist societies, nor is paying the mortgages of those who indebted themselves too heavily (SMI) or price controls by paying farmers NOT to grow stuff.
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doggone
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PostPosted: 09:51 - 17 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=13S5uqPLJUk

The tendency towards preaching and chanting like a new religion is hilarious.
It seems to have little focus and no clear goal so how can anyone take note of what they want let alone help them achieve it.
It's like -
''What are you protesting about?''
"What have you got?"

And how come everyone else has to be at work....
Hopefully it will snow soon.
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Nick__C
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PostPosted: 10:12 - 17 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote
Thumbs Up

I think as a movement it's a good thing.. Far too many people will just sit on their arses and leave it to someone else..
Unfortunately their targetting the financial sector and not the legislature.. Which would make much more sense..

There was a Telegraph article which cited the hmrc showing that top 10% paying about 52% of tax.. MUST PAY MORE! GREEDY ELITES NOT PULLING THEIR WEIGHT!!!

Irony klaxon for tweeting for Blackberries and Iphones though Laughing
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fatpies
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PostPosted: 10:36 - 17 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote
Nick__C wrote:
Thumbs Up

I think as a movement it's a good thing.. Far too many people will just sit on their arses and leave it to someone else..
Unfortunately their targetting the financial sector and not the legislature.. Which would make much more sense..

There was a Telegraph article which cited the hmrc showing that top 10% paying about 52% of tax.. MUST PAY MORE! GREEDY ELITES NOT PULLING THEIR WEIGHT!!!

Irony klaxon for tweeting for Blackberries and Iphones though Laughing


This entirely depends on how they made their money though. Although there are a number of rags to riches stories (without the lottery). Quite often its family money/connections etc or just raping the ordinary man and woman on the street.

As said think about uberlandlords, the government gives them a minimum rent guarentee by way of housing benefit. It is the LL who benefits not the tenant. Countless examples of this all over.
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yuri2085
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PostPosted: 10:54 - 17 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote
I was thinking that repeated chanting was completely retarded, and it probably does cause some weird social effect, but it seems a good way to communicate if as a commenter says, loudspeakers and such are banned.
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Nick__C
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PostPosted: 10:59 - 17 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote
yuri2085 wrote:
I was thinking that repeated chanting was completely retarded, and it probably does cause some weird social effect, but it seems a good way to communicate if as a commenter says, loudspeakers and such are banned.


Yeah I thought it made them come across as very creepy and cultish.. but comments on a youtube video said loudspeakers had been banned so seems reasonable to get the speakers point out..
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Mushroom
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PostPosted: 11:55 - 17 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote
A lot of this has been put together behind the scenes by those who want the financial transaction tax - to raise the heat against the financial system with smaller protests then have the big one. 50 million people called to protest on Oct. 29 to demand a 1 percent tax on financial transactions.

Its INSANITY.
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Nick__C
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PostPosted: 14:10 - 17 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote
Has that demand been broadcast? First time I've heard a reason other than 'tax the rich'..
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Mushroom
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PostPosted: 16:09 - 17 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote
Na they haven't yet, all protests will converge into one, foaming at the mouth about high frequency trading and money they cant get there hands on.

There are legitimate issues that need to be addressed why is it always that only the extremes ever rise to do so? And by there very nature of being extreme just miss the point entirely because they don't have a clue what there talking about,wanting to war the system to ashes and replace it with a utopia..

Quote:
Kale: This campaign has become increasingly stronger. First, the demonstrations only started in Lower Manhattan in New York, but now, sports has expanded to many American cities, and even spread to Canada and Mexico. In many parts of Europe, there have been various demonstrations. I expect that day in 1029, there will be a global march, people will participate in 11 in France the heads of the G20 summit to convey their aspirations. By then, I hope they can put forward a clear requirement that all financial transactions tax. We hope that the G20 summit to do something to reduce the frequency of financial transactions, financial transactions will be tax levy to be used in place of some more practical, rather than on the global “Big Casino” on.


https://www.finance-ol.com/2011/10/occupation-of-wall-street-campaign-sponsors-29th-global-demonstrations-will-occur/
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GhostRider
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PostPosted: 16:15 - 17 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote
You can't expect every single person protesting to be a financial expert and know the finer details of why they are protesting, it's enough that they realise that they are being fucked over.

Having watched something like "Inside Job" is enough incentive to fill glass bottles with unleaded, because there is no way the exact same thing does not take place on this side of the pond either.

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Mushroom
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PostPosted: 16:44 - 17 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote
Quote:
You can't expect every single person protesting to be a financial expert and know the finer details of why they are protesting, it's enough that they realise that they are being fucked over.


I don't expect them to be experts but remained puzzled why the most serious issues of our time yield public responses such as signing a petition to ban water in aid of the environment or hiking your own tax bill to the extreme in response to being on the hook for bail outs which result in unfair taxes..

It not the individual who feels a strong cause I am putting down here as such, its more that the group response never seems to hit the nail on the head what ever the issue and nine times out of ten there being directed by people who wish to take a hammer to there heads for there own means...perhaps learning the finer details may be the way forward for humanity?
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James
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PostPosted: 13:16 - 18 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote
What should happen to elite bankers, monetary policy makers and certain MP's if their sins were morally judged
https://www.capitalpunishmentuk.org/fsquad5.jpg

Sadly it won't happen but at least the protesters are raising the awareness of the sleepy shafted population which has to be a good thing, every revolution has to start somewhere.
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doggone
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PostPosted: 13:31 - 18 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote
The idea of getting rid of 'The Elite' sounds a bit like Cambodia though?
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Mushroom
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PostPosted: 14:46 - 18 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote
Banks havent fucked you that hard, politics has.
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Redoko
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PostPosted: 14:52 - 18 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote
Mad_Mushroom wrote:
Banks havent fucked you that hard, politics has.


Both.

The instability of a banking system built that couldn't last and the lack of Political regulation of the banking system. Especially now more than every as the banks know that when they're big enough they cannot fall.
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fire
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PostPosted: 18:16 - 18 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote
I always thought, the best form of protest would be to stock pile food, then stop going to work or purchasing anything. Your not getting in the way, your not hurting anyone, but through collective effort, you bring down the system.
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