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Reassurance on junctions

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TheSmiler
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PostPosted: 19:40 - 16 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reassurance on junctions Reply with quote

I'm doing my first run in rush hour tomorrow, so just wanted to post a few questions/checks to see if I'm doing this correctly.

My main problem has always been traffic lights/junctions (going for lessons when they have space in January) fully booked at the moment.

Btw Ignoring indicators because it is the clutch/brake/acceleration I'm checking.

So when approaching a junction say in third (been traveling at 30 and prefer third) this is what I do slow down drop into second, then into first, hold the clutch in slight acceleration. Whilst holding the back brake with my right foot.

This is continued till the front of the queue then when it is my turn to move release the clutch slightly to friction point and then move on opening up even more.

Now just checking if this is correct, main query is because I am feeling like the bike wants to go forward quite fast so just checking. I know this is kinda newb stuff but I aint ridden her in about 4 weeks now that much.
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Last edited by TheSmiler on 21:44 - 16 Oct 2011; edited 1 time in total
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Wafer_Thin_Ham
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PostPosted: 19:44 - 16 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

I find first is usually best to use to pull away. Wink

You'll be fine, just take it stedy to begin with and don't filter if you don't feel comfortable enough.
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weasley
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PostPosted: 12:20 - 17 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

I never (or extremely rarely) drop to 1st when still moving. 2nd is perfectly good for pulling away from a slow rolling start, using a bit of clutch slip if necessary to get the revs up. At least this way you don;t immediately have to then change up to second in the middle of the manoeuvre (or scream it in first until you feel safe to change up).

If you use appropriate observation and approach speed you can often avoid the need to stop or slow down too much.
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Teflon-Mike
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PostPosted: 19:09 - 17 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Your problem is you dont like revs, and you are a bit heavy handed on the clutch (and front brake for that matter!)

You dont give the bike enough revs. It ticks over at 12,000 rpm, revs to over 12,000 rpm and you try doing everything in the range 1,200 to 3,000!

Thing doesn't start actually making useful power until 6,000 rpm.. fact that you 'manage' is tesiment to the fact that the bike has such useful low and mid range, for such a little bike!

SO, first of all, get over that throttle aversion, start using the engine, or you might as well have pedals!

Next; you need to get a bit more 'delicate' on the clutch and brakes' start using the revs, it will come naturally.

Other wise your 'tickling' technique isn't far off... just like I had you doing in ASDA car-park really.

YES it does feel like it wants to 'creep' or launch on you; and that does not help your rev aversion.... but that's becouse you are going fdrom the engine reving 'off' load to taking load; as its 'off' load, its trying to rev, as you load it, feels like its going to bog, so you have to open the throttle, but as you open throttle it FEELs like it wants to race and accelerate hard.....

Its JUST the throttle/clutch balence, and as you do it more and more, it will start tro come easier and feel more natural.

Take it your launch technique is improving, and you aren't stalling as much?

Remember this thread: Low speed cornering (junctions etc)

That's your next one, doing the 'launch' through a turn. And its a matter of using some lean, and balencing the bike against acceleration, as well as balencing clutch & throttle, but you KNOW from car-park work how low that bike will lean, at silly slow speeds, as well as how tractible it is on the throttle.

Its all patting your head and rubbing your tummy..... and it will 'come'..... just needs practice and familiarity, and a little confidence.

You pretty much 'have it', your just a little heavy handed and a tad 'clumsy', and probably making generic newbie mistake of 'over-thinking'!

Just get on and DO IT..... 'go with the flow'....and don't sweat the small stuff!
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The Artist
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PostPosted: 19:11 - 17 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the best thing is to just find your own technique. Just go with the flow, don't ride the clutch and learn to use engine braking.
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TheSmiler
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PostPosted: 19:45 - 17 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you everyone for the posts, well survived today obviously was having a few problems this morning with the choke on the bike. But managed to find a technique that starts it every time correctly in one go. Which is great.

Only had one two stalls on the way to university one which was at the entrance to a roundabout came down to a stop holding clutch in, whilst holding the front brake and back brake.. Yeah one problem here didn't have enough accelerator to keep it going. This was the same with number two stall as well however this was on another junction.

The Artist wrote:
I think the best thing is to just find your own technique. Just go with the flow, don't ride the clutch and learn to use engine braking.


Think I have found my own technique as such basically come to a stop as normal but hold the clutch in with left hand and with the right hold brake whilst rocking the accelerator. Worked on the way back not one stall what so ever, and that was after 5 traffic lights and three roundabouts.

This could of also been helped because I started singing the song "singing in the rain" then it started to rain but also I pretending I was doing a vlog think it took my mind of what I was actually doing on the bike. Was also fun because I was taking the mic out of the retarded drivers/motorcyclists around.

Will also add that I did this all without any sleep, couldn't get asleep and still don't feel tired Crying or Very sad

Teflon-Mike wrote:
Your problem is you dont like revs, and you are a bit heavy handed on the clutch (and front brake for that matter!)

You dont give the bike enough revs. It ticks over at 12,000 rpm, revs to over 12,000 rpm and you try doing everything in the range 1,200 to 3,000!

Thing doesn't start actually making useful power until 6,000 rpm.. fact that you 'manage' is tesiment to the fact that the bike has such useful low and mid range, for such a little bike!

SO, first of all, get over that throttle aversion, start using the engine, or you might as well have pedals!

Next; you need to get a bit more 'delicate' on the clutch and brakes' start using the revs, it will come naturally.

Other wise your 'tickling' technique isn't far off... just like I had you doing in ASDA car-park really.

YES it does feel like it wants to 'creep' or launch on you; and that does not help your rev aversion.... but that's becouse you are going fdrom the engine reving 'off' load to taking load; as its 'off' load, its trying to rev, as you load it, feels like its going to bog, so you have to open the throttle, but as you open throttle it FEELs like it wants to race and accelerate hard.....

Its JUST the throttle/clutch balence, and as you do it more and more, it will start tro come easier and feel more natural.

Take it your launch technique is improving, and you aren't stalling as much?

Remember this thread: Low speed cornering (junctions etc)

That's your next one, doing the 'launch' through a turn. And its a matter of using some lean, and balencing the bike against acceleration, as well as balencing clutch & throttle, but you KNOW from car-park work how low that bike will lean, at silly slow speeds, as well as how tractible it is on the throttle.

Its all patting your head and rubbing your tummy..... and it will 'come'..... just needs practice and familiarity, and a little confidence.

You pretty much 'have it', your just a little heavy handed and a tad 'clumsy', and probably making generic newbie mistake of 'over-thinking'!

Just get on and DO IT..... 'go with the flow'....and don't sweat the small stuff!


Hi mike, I have got better at using the revs, I'm up to 8k easily but after that the sounds is painful (most prob because I'm still new), so flip up bear in mind that I only go up to third max for around 35mph. Well try to keep to 30 mph but seem to keep going over it on the speedo when I check ever so often.

I am only stalling when I actually stop at a junction well in heavy traffic anyway, when there is less traffic on the road my stopping is great, as well as no stalling (see above your quote). There is something about traffic that is helping me to stall and can't put my finger on it. The only problem I seem to have when reaching university though is waiting for the barrier and showing my card I only did it once but stalled straight away. Not sure how to control the bike at the stop whilst trying get the barrier up.
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Last edited by TheSmiler on 20:17 - 17 Oct 2011; edited 1 time in total
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mistergixer
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PostPosted: 20:12 - 17 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

Teflon-Mike wrote:
It ticks over at 12,000 rpm,


Shocked
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Teflon-Mike
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PostPosted: 21:11 - 17 Oct 2011    Post subject: Reply with quote

mistergixer wrote:
Teflon-Mike wrote:
It ticks over at 12,000 rpm,
Shocked


Hmmm...

TheSmiler wrote:
Hi mike, I have got better at using the revs, I'm up to 8k easily but after that the sounds is painful (most prob because I'm still new), so flip up bear in mind that I only go up to third max for around 35mph. Well try to keep to 30 mph but seem to keep going over it on the speedo when I check ever so often.


That's good. On the gearing it has though you could do 30 in 1st Shocked

But, yes, third is a better gear to use round town at that kind of speed, though in stop start sort of traffic, you might find that using 2nd, which will get you to around 40 is you blood line it, gives you a bit better 'response'.

Speedo also over reads. do 30 in a 30 zone and you'll have a tail-back of steering wheel chomping idiots behind you, becouse you will actually only be doing a real 25 or so.....

NOT that that is at all an excuse, because THIER speedo's will probably be over reading by just as much any way..... but amazing how many people get frustrated going 'just under' posted speed when they reckon that they can 'get away' with going 'just over'!

Rough guide, it's about 10% + 2 over.
At true 30 it will read about 35
At true 40 it will read about 46
At true 50 it will read about 57
At true 60, it will be nudging 70
At true 70, it will be wavering off the scale!

But, yeah, 'go with the flow' and if you are keeping with teh traffic, that's probably good-enough, rather than fretting about what your speedo says, worry about what the dolts about you are doing!
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Current Bikes:'Honda VF1000F' ;'CB750F2N' ;'CB125TD ( 6 3 of em!)'; 'Montesa Cota 248'. Learner FAQ's:= 'U want to Ride a Motorbike! Where Do U start?'
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