Think i may be hooked on this biking malarkey

[jonker]

Hi everyone.
Got the CBT course as a present for my birthday,never been on a bike in my long life.Got to go back for a couple of hours this Sunday as the instructor feels i,ve got to nail a couple of things.Fair enough i was a bit hesitant on the u turns and repeatedly left my indicator on for starters.I really really really enjoyed the road ride even though we got caught in a blizzard and it suddenly went pitch black.I was leading and the chap said we should head back home asap.We never got to do the hill start,emergency stop or u turn on the road as conditions were horrible.What a buzz it was last sunday.There were 4 of us out,myself,another guy who,d been biking for a long time,the instructor and an examiner from the DSA.To say i was nervous would be an understatement but i had a whale of a time and am thinking of getting myself a bike when/if i get through this thing.I have so many questions for you guys but for now i will just say its good to get on the ladder,cheers lads.

[Okeydokey]

Welcome to forum, know exactly what you are talking about! I really enjoyed the CBT as a senior citizen I forgot what it was like to scare myself now and again, great in-it!
____________________
Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit. Wisdom is not putting it in a fruitsalad!
YB100 v. Ford Sierra (1982 I came 2nd place) Honda H100S (Currently 0 - 0) CX500 Cafe project (me 1 - wife 0.... maybe!)

[bencav]

[jonker]

When i think back to it maybe i should have moaned about a couple of things but i was,nt sure if they were the norm or not plus i was so enjoying it i did,nt bother.
1:The bike i was given would,nt start off the key so it was kick start every time.
2:The neutral light was intermittent,worked when it wanted to.

I feel these two things combined put me at a disadvantage,especially first time on a bike.I stalled the bike on the road run and was,nt sure if i was in neutal when i was kick starting it.I pulled the clutch in and kick started it but i was a wee bit flustered.I did pull the bike to the kerb so as not to slow down any traffic behind me.Feel i will be better prepared next time and wiser.
Rant over.

[Rogerborg]

It just gets better from here.

That's disappointing about the bike, but training fleets will have a dog or two in the kennel. Enjoy your Sunday ride, you'll find it a lot easier now it's had some time to sink in.
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[swampy]

[Teflon-Mike]

[jonker]

Thanks for the input lads.I should have said the bike would,nt start off the electric button thingy,apologies,i know nada about bikes.I suppose it was a bit character building.

I was thinking about the best way to go forward here.I dont want to spend a lot of money on a 125 but i would like to gain experience on one for maybe a year or at least 6 months before my test.
Bigger bikes seem to be cheaper on fleabay and the like.Dont really want to pay over the odds from a dealer then lose a bunch on the sell on value.Any advice lads?
What should i expect to pay?Would like to get one soon as i,ve got the bug bad and dont mind the cold and wet as it will make me appreciate the summertime

[jonker]

Meant to say,
Teflon Mike,loved your reply.
I will suss out quotes and shit later,i,m also new to the messageboard thing.Heres a thumbs up for now

[Okeydokey]

Rogers about to say, 'license first, bike second' at a guess.

I would say spend 6-12 months on an old Gumtree Jap bike, less than 20 miles from where you live, dont pay more than £500 for it, no fairing plastic bits... takes ages to sweep the road after you dropped the fker!

I bought all my jacket and boot stuff second hand, I remember the advert for the HG jacket being sold by someones wife... it read something like:
'As the only responsible adult in this house I have decided to sell this motorbike jacket, I saw him take out of the cupboard about three months ago shaking his head... I wondered whether that was because he had never worn it, or had a yearning to get his bike out some time this year!'.

The irony has stayed with me, loads of gear collectors that don't get to realise the experience!

For me its a hobby that grows on you, but you need control the cost as it grows
____________________
Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit. Wisdom is not putting it in a fruitsalad!
YB100 v. Ford Sierra (1982 I came 2nd place) Honda H100S (Currently 0 - 0) CX500 Cafe project (me 1 - wife 0.... maybe!)

[Teflon-Mike]

No one wants to spend a lot of money on a 125... consequently there is an awful lot of shit out there that can wear an L-Plate, becouse people wont pay for a decent bike, and wont spend time or money on one if they happen to have it, or even are clued up enough to know how; they are learner bikes, so many dont know much at all.

If you want a 125 you have to pay to get a decent one.

And if you want a 'good start' they are worth it.

Most important bike you will buy. Yeah, big bikes are where you want to be, and we can deliberate till the cows come home whether a CBR600 ir better than a YZF600, and which has the better suspension or brakes.... bottom line is that on a bike like that YOU the average punter that buys one for the road will NEVER apreciate the small differences between them, let alone be able to exploit any small advantage they might have, YET these things are 'important' and get a lot of debate and consideration...

the 125 you learn on, the ONE bike where having decent wheels under your arse, so that while you are learning, any wobbling going on is down to YOU and you alone, not some unknown problem with the bikes suspension or steering or suspension; and putting it right isn't pissing in the dark, wondering if its a loose bolt, a worn tyre, a clapped out damper, or you doing something daft....

Get a GOOD 125, and only thing that can make it wobble is YOU.

Makes learning that much easier; makes it an awful lot nicer, makes it a heck of a lot more FUN.

When you have a licence and you have some idea what you are doing... THEN you can actually get away with a slightly more 'tired' bike, that doesn't behave itself so well, becouse you KNOW any wobbling going on at that point is down to the bike, not you!

If you want a good start and you want a 125... well they are, from the start compromised little bikes; compromised by low displacement, low powered engines; compromised by low weight and price constraints; you really dont want more or specifically more unnecessary compromises in a machine that is already hugely compromised.

So, get as good as you can afford.

And YES, buy prices are expensive. SO you have to find more money when you buy.

But buy prices are expensive. SO you'll get more money BACK when you sell....

Best Value For Money 'Training Tool' around at the moment is the Yamaha YBR125.

New they are nudging three grand; which is about 2/3 the price of some more 'posey' 125's like the Yamaha YZF R125 race replica, or the Cruiser style Dragstar, and still a fair bit cheaper than the dirt-bike style XT125.

It is, also three times the price of a generic Chinesebranded 'Bike in a Box'.... but difference is it will still be worth something after you have attached a number-plate and it WILL do 65mph!

Brand new, is the 'best' you can get as far as reliability and known oragin, and working as good as it should, with peace of mind that you have a warranty.

BUTY you pay heavily in depreciation, and a year in, a £2800 YBR is probably worth barely £2K... two years in it will be around £1700, and at three years, around £1500.

First MOT is due at three years, and three or four year old models, priced between £1000 and £1500, are about the vest valkue you can get in the learner legal market.

They have lost all that horrible depciation, and are a half the price they were new. They also have that first MOT to give some confidence that they haven't been thrashed to death in MOT exemption period, and at ABOUT halfd their anticipated service life, probably less than half anticipated life miles will tend to have enough life in them to still be pretty tought and solid and dependable, and not be too wobbly.

Means that buy-sell risk is low. Risk is they wont need much if any thing by way of expensive maintenence or repairs; they will work well for a year or so, and can be sold, for little loss on buy price, cost of ownership, very small, tending to negligible.

So, a £1500 YBR bought, ridden and sold within a year for £1300 costs just £200.

A £900 Chinese Bike in a Box, sold a year on, is lucky to fetch £500, so would have cost £400 and not been as nice to ride or own in the mean time.

A twenty year old CG125 that costs £400, could demand £400's worth of work to get it out of the delapidation of maintenence overdraft old learner-legal commuters so frequently drop into.... might sell for £400, so only cost £400 but still just as expensive as a Bike in a Box, and twice as expensive as a YBR.... abd big risk it wont fix, or if its not fixed, you will get a years intermittent use out of it for your money and have a pile of scrap left at the end of it.

There are few bargains about in the Learner Legal market; but there can be, if you are prepared to pay for them 'up-front'...

That YBR, bought for £1300 selling for £1100 costs you £200, and still leaves you enough cash to go get a very useful 'big-bike', if thats what you want.

So where should you go now?

Well, experience is good, but bad experience isn't!

Straight out of CBT, you can go get a 125 and ride around for two years, learning by your mistakes... which can hurt.... and if twenty five years trials riding has tought me ONE thing, its teenagers bounce better! Older you get, more falling off seems to HURT!

Also not likely to teach you much about how to pass a test, though might boost your confidence a bit.

alternative is to skip 125's and do DAS, which for most means an intensive course of between three and five days, riding around with an instructor telling you what to do through an ear-piece,m giving you lots of false confidence, and taking a lot of money off you to do little more than fullfill legal requirement to supervise you riding a 'big-bike' before qualified... and I dont say that glibly, until recently I WAS an instructor.... Intensive DAS courses are a lot of money to satisfy impatience!

Once you have done your DAS course, where you will have been tought little about surviving the world of big bikes, but given a lot ot test-tricks to get you through tests, and what you might have learned about survival riding, you probably wont remember, fast in, fast out, in the cramming going on, and with little real experience to give any of it meaning or relevence......

You will come out with a full licence able to jump straight onto any bike you like, and ride it unsupervised....

And a few moments after you do so.... you will be wondering, "What do I DO!..... Theres no voice in my ear to tell me what to DO!... what did the bloike say about box junctions! I cant remember!"

This is not good, and you will be like a CBT fresh newbie on a 125, left to learn by your own mistakes...... only instead of it being a 10 or 14bhp 125, with a 60-70mph top speed..... it COULD be a 1000cc hyper bike that can out accelerate an F1 car, and reach 180mph before you can actually THINK! "Oh Shit!"

NOT! that 125's are, by dint of restricted performance MUCH better.

Often dismissed as 'Toy' or 'Kiddie Bikes', they are still credible motorcyles. You may have noted from the sig-line below I have a little fleet of them; and they are ALL fast enough to exceed national speed limit. and they are ALL quick enough to out accelerate MOST traffic. They will even stay with moderately fast cars, driven with spirit point to point, if I try hard enough.

Even a 125 has enough performance to get you into a LOT of trouble....

BUT, they do have merit. They will get you into trouble slower, and they will TEND to give you more warning, and they will TEND to demand more effort from you to be so foolish!

Bike bikes you CAN take liberties with; they have more weight, which can make them more daunting, but that mass also gives them momentum, which means it damps clumsiness and flatters poor riding, a lightweight will show up much more clearly. More power and more flexible engines will also demand less work from the rider, so again, let you get away with more, and be more lazy.

So 125s DO have merit as a training tool, they will treated with respect help you develop balence and control more acutely.

BUT, getting on and getting out, learning by mistakes is not great.

Intensive DAS courses get you a licence, but thats pretty much al they do, and can leave you on something very scary to learn by errors.

If you go 125, and its my reccomended route;' book weekly lessons on your own bike, to back up CBT, and Learn by other peoples mistakes and accumulated wisdom!

It hurts less! and doesn't take many skuffed exhausts or broken brake levers before its cost less too!

A two hour lesson; gives you enough time to learn something, without it being a blurr of information.

You then have all the time you want to go practice what you have learned, on your own time; get it sussed, and go back. AND with some road riding between lessons, more experience to give what you are tought meaning and relevence that also helps it 'stick'.

Better still though; that experience can direct questions to ask your instructor, to milk thier knowledge for all its worth, and get stuff you would NEVER get on an Intensive DAS, simpoly becouse no one would think to tell you, and you dont know enough to ask!

For a complete beginner, seven or eight two hour, weekly lessons ought to be all you need to get to test standard AND have some good arsenol of learning to survive behind it.

You now have choice becouse just becouse you TRAIN on a 125 doesn't mean you have to TEST on a 125, and you could test under DAS rules, to get ful lunrestricted A group licence.

No worries if you want, you can save pennies (at the moment; new laws come into force in a year) and test on your own 125, which will give you a full A group licence but with 2-year probationary 33bhp power limit.

This is 'enough' to be useful and if you didn'ty envissage stepping up to hyper bike at the earliest, gives plenty of options, and most 500 commuter twins, good for over 100mph and no small risk to licence, if restricted (standard they are around 45bhp and good for possibly 120mph)

This is the good way around; BUT if you are ardent on a DAS course, forwarned about the lost voices syndrome; and the DAS pass death rate amongst older riders on bigger bikes, and want to substitute for post test training, thats another way around it.

From where you are; cant make your choices for you; or make them any easier, just give you the right ideas... just when training some-one I can teach them to ride, I can teach them survival techniques, how they apply them after, really up to them..

Your call!
____________________
My Webby'Tef's-tQ, loads of stuff about my bikes, my Land-Rovers, and the stuff I do with them!
Current Bikes:'Honda VF1000F' ;'CB750F2N' ;'CB125TD ( 6 3 of em!)'; 'Montesa Cota 248'. Learner FAQ's:= 'U want to Ride a Motorbike! Where Do U start?'

[FerretFing]

Welcome to the forum

[Rogerborg]

[Knot600RR]

[JoeDougieDoug...]

Welcome to the club!

On my CBT I was absolutely shitting it about the road ride I came off the bike on the off-road course and my confidence fell dramatically.... Nevermind eh.

Ride safe boy-o!
____________________
CBT Passed - 22 / 10 / 11 >> Theory Passed - 16 / 02 / 2012 >> Mod 1 Passed - 07 / 03 / 2012 >> Mod 2 Passed - 18 / 05 / 2012.

[leonski]

Hooked!!!!, motorbike's are starting to take over my life and to make matters worse BCF is slowing starting to dominate my life as well, well mainly at work.
I passed my CBT in June and I hoping to do my full licence in the summer when money should be back in my pocket.
I may only have a 125 but it's my 125 and I love it.
____________________
there is nothing like the smell of 2stroke in the morning
current beasts..lol de-restricted ludix classic 50 fastest ped ive ever ridden
yamaha ybr 125 working progress .......

[Mehty]

As Tef said, A decent YBR125 is the way to go!
I picked one up in September after doing my CBT. An '07, 18k YBR125 set me back £750. Petrol + insurance is cheap, Oil is cheap, Cheap parts for when you bail (as i'v found out twice now ) easy and fun to ride. They have a tiny little bit of OMPPHHH when you want them to (not as much as a two stroke, but it'l beat most cars off the mark )
____________________
2007 YBR 125 (sold), 2011 ER6-N (sold), LHD 1999 GSX750F (sold), ??????

[Teflon-Mike]