New Biker!

[Jamie1]

Hello! I'm 19 and looking to get my license. I've read a lot of the threads but still have a few questions just to be sure. What license would be best to go for/what size bike would I be limited to? Would the fact that i've ridden off road bikes for most of my life help any when it comes to the tests? Thanks in advance .

[TheSmiler]

[Jamie1]

Could I ride any size bike with the Standard License as long as it was restricted or is it limited to a 125cc? Thanks .

[TheSmiler]

[J.M.]

At 19 you go for your standard license.

On your provisional you can only ride a bike up to 125cc.
This bike can have no more than 14.6bhp.

After passing your standard test you can ride a bike up to 33bhp, there is a power to weight ratio too but I don't know what that ratio is.
Your 33bhp bike can be any size that you like, but it has to be restricted to conform with the power to weight ratio.

After 2 years from passing your test your restriction automatically expires. People often send their license off to get the restriction removed though.
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2004 R1 & 2018 XSR900

[Jamie1]

Thanks for the replies guys, one last question though, how would I go about restricting a larger bike? Does it cost much? Cheers!

[J.M.]

I've not got much knowledge about restricting bikes - so someone may have to come along and correct this post information wise.

I believe the two most common types of restrictions are carb restrictions and digital restrictions. On a Fuel Injected bike I think there is something you can digitally change to restrict it. With a carb restriction you're basically putting washers in there to limit the flow.

Carb restriction kits are generally expensive if you get an official one, but people often make and sell them cheaper because, well, they're basically just holes cut in to a bit of metal!

FI prices I've got no idea.

One of your best best would probably be to find a big bike that you want to get and then Google that bike for the restriction.
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2004 R1 & 2018 XSR900

[haroman666]

Restriction, bought from FI i believe to be around the £200 mark. Could be more or less by £50 depending on bike I spose.
OR, you could do the sensible thing and find a second hand jobby on Ebay etc etc for no more than £60. And then go get a dyno printout for no more than £40-£50 and lovely jubbly, bobs your uncle, you've saved money.
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The mistresses: 2000 Honda CBR600f, 2000 Honda VTR1000

[Rogerborg]

[Teflon-Mike]

A2, is the niggle; testing will be on a bike over 400cc, and meeting the 45bhp power limit, 'DAS' style, in you HAVE to test on a bike you cant legally ride on the road unless under radio supervision of a qualified & approved instructor....(Means its going to be expensive to test for A2, and few schools look like they will be offering courses, for it.)

But also remains whether under 24's will be able to 'DO' A2 tests, without first doing A1, or if there is going to be any qualifying period on A1 before you can do A2.

A2 will however, qualify a rider to do the tests again on a 'full power' bike, again DAS style, after two years to upgrade to a full A, ahead of the 24 age break for DAS. But the 45bhp restriction will be indefinite, unlike current 33bhp restriction that lapses after two years. Do A2, its A2 for ever, or until you re-test for full A.

HOW all this shit will effect used bike prices, remains to be seen, as well. Likely that bikes currently popular with 33bhp restrict licence holders will not be so desirable in a year or two years time; hence the wait & see advice on what you could do after tests.

'Big-Bike' prices at the moment are pretty good, though, and you can get a LOT more bike for your money in the over 125 market than in the 125 world, where they are horendousely over valued for what they are, and on the whole, owned by newbies that dont know much about how to ride or look after a bike, tend to get sorely used.

So, pay the money to get a 'decent' 125 to test on, you are looking at spending around £1500 for a good bike, but you will get a fair chunk of that back when you are done with it, and that will buy you a hell of a lot of 'big-bikes'.

As for dirt riding.......

Your machine control ought to be fairly good.... but silly story for you: I came up from School-Boy Trials... so a CBT or Mod 1 cone course ought to have been a walk in the park, for me, shouldn't it?

I actually did the fore-runner, the 'Part 1 Test' back in 1988... and FAILED......

The Examiner stood at the corner of the playground, and after I had completed the course, put down her clip-board, clapped, and turned to the rest of the candidates and announced:

"You have just witnessed a fine demonstration of motorcycle control, one that defies both the laws of Physics and the conventions of the ministry who UNFORTUNATLEY, do not believe it POSSIBLE for you to be in 'Full Control', if you dont have your fucking ARSE on the saddle..... Or BOTH WHEELS ON THE FLOOR!"

And made me go back and do it all again.

Riding is riding; but road riding, 85% is 'Observation', 15% Road possitioning, 7.5% Road Convention, & 2.5% actually keeping the bike upright!

Road 'Tests'; 40% Observation, 40% Road Convention, 15% Road Possitioning, 5% Not falling of while you are at it!

Note how the proportions change from what's needed for test, and whats needed to stay aline on the road!

So, your dirt-biking is not a 'great' advantage; and 'some' stuff, can be a dissadvantage... lots of stuff you'll do on the dirt as second nature, can be quite helpful on the road.... like finding a patch of diesel, or gravel mid-corner.... other points of technique, may not be 'best' for road riding, and more advanced 'stuff' you might be doing on dirt, may contradict 'conventional wisdom' of advanced road-riding... and TBH, if you progress beyond just test standard, to advanced riding, where it is more about technique, this is where dirt skills are probably more relevent; though an awful lot of Advance Road Riding is about observatyion & road possitioning still.

So for test-level, it's best to just presume you know NOTHING; whether from dirt riding or car driving (If you have any); and use what experience you may have, to enquire and compare and find the differences, rather than guessing that 'its just the same' and skipping over....

For Training & Tests; the 'ideal' machine for the job, is regulation 'Learner-Commuter', like a YBR125, or old CG125.About 10bhp, they are not particularly inspiring, even by the standards of 125 Learner-Legals; and they sure aint pretty (at least to my eyes).

BUT, they do the job; do it well, and do it cheap.

125's with pretensions to be sports-bikes, cruisers, or Dirt-Bikes, all sacrifice some functionality for that style, and often quite a lot.

Fairing covered sports-bikes may have great brakes for an e-stop, for example; but tight steering geometry and limited steering lock means they need to be leaned over a long way to get through cones. Dirt Bikes, with soft long travel suspension, and big wobbly block tread tyres, only putting half as much rubber in contact with the ground, may be more nimble through the cones, with thier wide bars and good steering lock; but high CofG means they aren't SO easy to manage, and that suspension and compromised tyres wont make e-stops so 'neat'. While Cruisers? Well lazy steering, low seat and the most perverse barge like geometry you can get; they dont do 'much' well! All 'work' but make life harder, for the small style and occassional bit of added 'go' they may have.

Regulation Learner commuter, if you are used to Dirt-Bikes is a good place to start. From the 'seat' it feels alien, and TINY, sat with knees bent at rest, hands close together on the bars, and nothing infront of the handlebars when you look forwards; having to conciousely look down to see the front wheel... that 'Strangeness' can help give a mental dissociation from Dirt-Biking.

With the 3rd Directive Licence Change Laws looming; it's hard to say what might be the most 'strategic' thing to do. Apart from: Priority is to get a licence.

The Regulation-Learner commuter's have always been the 'best' way to do that; soon as you have the licence, you can get pretty much any bike you like to suit your sense of style and wallet.

This still holds; though there is 'some' merit in the suggestion that more stylish 125's are going to become more desirable, as soon as new laws 'hit', becouse the regulation Learner-Commuter wont have the 'use' it does currently to get a full licence on.

But, sporty 125's tend to be rediculousely expensive to run, for the performance. Bikes like the Aprillia RS125, return less MPG than my 750, and cost an extra 15p/l on the petrol for the high grade two stroke oil they need. They are also in the same insurance group as some 500's, and given that my DT125, costs me 50% more a year to insure than my 750, I HATE to think what the premium on an RS would be! My DT, an antique air cooled one; is lammered on insurance for being a dirt bike, and hence a high theft risk; as are most knobly shod 125's, before it comes to whether they are 'Boy-Racer-Bikes' that gain a loonie loading.

So; while you CAN still get a full licence on a 125, the Learner-Commuters still make sense. They are cheap to insure, and cheap to run; and soon as you are done with it, will sell for sensible money.

IF you dont end up selling until after 3rd Directive, or close enough to for people to not be so eager for the commuters; you might not get back AS much for it as you might; BUT, people will still want 'cheap' bikes, and low running costs, so they'll still sell; and all up; likely to have cost you 'less' than a sportier bike, that you might get back bigger proportion of buy price in resale, but costs you more in fuel and maintenece & insurance between times.

THEN, as said, with full licence; you have 'Choice' of what you could get to ride on 33bhp restrict.

Plenty of dirt bikes, that you wouldn't have to do any gymnastics on infront of an examiner, thsat are naturally 33bhp complient or easily restricted to. Plenty of road bikes similarly already 33bhp complient or easily restricted; common ones being the 500 'twins' like the Suzuki GS500 or Kawasaki GPz500s; which with only two pots, not SO burried under bodywork, dont need so much mechanics to get at the inlet stubs and stick a couple of restriction washers in them.

That's the 'usual' way to restrict to 33bhp; an inlet manifold restrictor plate, that chokes the inlet tract, so the engine cant suck enough charge to make more than power limit.

So, no you dont have to stick to 125's; though things like the Aprillia RS125, are only 'just' 33bhp complient in 'Full-Power' spec (around 28bhp).

Bikes like the GS500 I think make about 45bhp 'stock'; and you can get a pair of unbranded restrictor plates for probably £30 or so, and easily DIY fit them.

People will talk about 'Restriction Kits' that are 'warranted' to restrict a bike to under 33bhp and come with a Restriction Certificate. These can be expensive, more so as often you have to have them dealer fitted to get the Restriction Cert 'Validated'. Kits from some suppliers for some bikes can be £100's.

BUT; no LEGAL reason to have a restriction cert; its entirely up to YOU to ensure your bike meets licence entitlement; how you do that is up to you; and up to plod / insurance co in the event of a claim proving you AREN'T restricted.

Rule of thumb, is £30's worth of washers, and a £30 Dyno print-out to show under 33bhp, OUGHT to be enough to show you have taken 'reasonable' measures to ensure you are legal.

Obviousely; bigger, sportier the bike you choose, more likely the question is to be asked; and more you are likely to have to do/spend to restrict it; why the 500 twins are so popular.

Think that answers most of your Q's; BUT main thing here and now is getting the licence, and getting a 125 to get you on the road to do it. You dont need to be planning MUCH further ahead at this stage.
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My Webby'Tef's-tQ, loads of stuff about my bikes, my Land-Rovers, and the stuff I do with them!
Current Bikes:'Honda VF1000F' ;'CB750F2N' ;'CB125TD ( 6 3 of em!)'; 'Montesa Cota 248'. Learner FAQ's:= 'U want to Ride a Motorbike! Where Do U start?'