Does anyone know what the new test rules are from 2013?

[brows91]

I'm a learner rider and I'm going to do my test this year if I get the money. But as a back up plan, I was going to wait until next spring, which is just before my current CBT runs out and I'll be 21 so no restriction will be needed.

But if the new post test rules are implemented before then, I'm not sure what would happen after I pass.

Any help would be appreciated
Cheers
Callum

[steven_191]

Whatever the current rules are when you pass is generally what you would go by. Hence why people who have a bike licence from the days when there was no test didn't need to take the test again. As far as I know anyway

[Rogerborg]

tl;dr version - pass a test, any test, this year.

Long version:

We're still waiting for publication of the UK's implementation of 2006/126/EC - now pushing a full year late - but we know what it should say.

From January 19th 2013, the new licenses, ages and categories will be:

Sit A1 at 17, on an 125cc <=11kW bike, gives access to 125cc <=11kW bikes. Same as the current A1, which almost nobody sits.

Sit A2 two years after passing A1 or possibly at 19[1], on a bike of at least 400cc[2] generating between 25 and 35kW[3], gives access to bikes of any capacity up to 35kW.

Sit A two years after passing A2, or at 24, on a bike of at least 600cc[2] generating at least 40kW, gives access to any bike.

There will be no automatic upgrades between categories. In your case, if you leave it until next year then even at 21 you will only be able to sit the new A2 test, and even that's doubtful[1].

2006/126/EC states that nothing in it should remove entitlement from existing license holders. In your case, if you sit a "standard" bike test under the current 91/429/EEC. scheme and get an "A <= 25kW" license, there's no rational reason to believe that it won't automatically upgrade to full A after 2 years.


Notes:

[1] The DfT have indicated that they will give "direct access" to A2 at 19. However, 2006/126/EC does not list that as an allowed route to A2, it only allows for direct access to A at 24, or access to A2 2 years after passing A1. Since almost nobody currently has A1 that would mean that the earliest that anyone can sit A2 will be 2015.

[2] The DfT have indicated that they may apply a common sense approach to the minimum capacity limits and allow a few ccs under, e.g. 396 or 596cc, just as they've now arbitrarily allowed some leeway in the 50kph Mod 1 speed tests.

[3] Technically an A2 test bike just needs to be at least 25kW. Whether it also needs to be under the A2 license limit of 35kW is not yet clear. This matters to training schools because if there's no upper limit then they can and probably will ditch their remaining 500cc bikes in favour of 600cc+ 40kW+ machines suitable for both A2 and A. If they have to retain lower powered machines just for A2, that adds more costs to schools that will already be struggling for business.
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[brows91]

Thanks alot for that, looks like I should get saving to do my test this year!

I was going to post another topic but might as well include it on here:

I have been riding for over 3 years since I was 17 and riding a geared 125 for over a year now, I'm pretty confident with checks and maneuvers, do you think I'd be alright to do my test without training or would you reccomend to do a little training?

[Daytona Paul]

The attached .pdf has just been released.

Hopefully the '*training option' under the A2 and A categories will be allowed.
____________________
www.angliaroadtraining.com
CBT FROM ONLY £85
Back to Biking Refresher Day £99! Book with a friend and get 20% Discount!

[UnspeedySam]

The training option thing does sound like an interesting get out clause. I would guess that it would take the form of a CBT style day course.

It does still mean that you can't get a bike with any real power until you're 21 though. Which is a massive pain...
____________________
Riding: BMW R1150RT `02 bought mildly crashed
Fixing: Also the BMW as I get less broken bits
Gone: ZZR600 '00, TRX850 '97, RXS100 '93, JS125-6B '07, BMW R1100RS '93, Kawasaki ZX-6R-J2 '01, Honda Bros NT400 NC25 '88

[Rogerborg]

Cheers, very interesting. Got a source for that? I take it that's an "early" (in the sense of only being a year late) heads up to ATBs?

Well, ruh roh, there is indeed no "direct access" to A2 listed. I guess someone at the DfT has actually read the Directive since their 2010 consultation.

If that's really going to be the case though, then it's a massive ball-punt to riders, training schools and dealers, since the moment it comes in, the only available licenses will be A1 (125cc) and full A at 24. No new rider in the 17-23 age bracket will be able to sit A2 (and thus get a license for anything bigger than a 125) until 2015, and that's if any of them bother to pass A1 in 2013.

The DfT's 2010 consultation response had previously nixed the idea of access through training - the actual intent of 2006/126/EC! - in favour of full tests at each category for the rather bizarre reason of "cost". For some reason, they seemed to think that a test route costs less - apparently they think that fully insured big bikes just materialise at the test centre. It'll be interesting to see if and how they're going to backpedal on that.

And hello, it does say a 35kW upper limit on A2 test bikes. Great, so schools will have to run fleets of both A (40kW+) and A2 (25-35kW) bikes.

Although since it looks like nobody will be able to sit A2 until 2015 they can at least postpone the pain until then. If there are any of them left in business by then.
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[UnspeedySam]

There is a DAS to A2: "Or must hold a valid CBT and theory test certificate and take practical test."

Also, it stands to reason that a fleet of 600s will be bought and then have the FI remapped on the fly for the different tests. At least that is how I would do it.
____________________
Riding: BMW R1150RT `02 bought mildly crashed
Fixing: Also the BMW as I get less broken bits
Gone: ZZR600 '00, TRX850 '97, RXS100 '93, JS125-6B '07, BMW R1100RS '93, Kawasaki ZX-6R-J2 '01, Honda Bros NT400 NC25 '88

[Daytona Paul]

Rogerborg, it has been sent out to ATB's as a newsletter, cant find a link to it on any of their websites yet. Will probably appear during the next week or 2.
____________________
www.angliaroadtraining.com
CBT FROM ONLY £85
Back to Biking Refresher Day £99! Book with a friend and get 20% Discount!

[Daytona Paul]

[UnspeedySam]

[Daytona Paul]

beechbone, if we will be able to restrict a 600 for A2 what is to say that we have deristricted it for DAS?

I like the cost savings that only having to purchase 1 bike will give, but can't see the DSA taking our word for it that the FI mapping has or has not been changed correctly
____________________
www.angliaroadtraining.com
CBT FROM ONLY £85
Back to Biking Refresher Day £99! Book with a friend and get 20% Discount!

[UnspeedySam]

[Daytona Paul]

[Rogerborg]

[Beelzebob]

It's just occurred to me (apologies if it's been covered before)... are they going to extend the duration of theory test passes (currently 2 years) to cover the potential 8 years plus (16-24+) that it could take to pass all the relevant tests to get to a full licence?

The cynic in me says they'll make you do a new one every two years. 'Just in case anything's changed'.
____________________
'09 YBR 125 -> '92 XJ600 S Diversion -> '99 Hornet 600

"Stronger than your average female lifeguard"

[Rogerborg]

I don't see how they could, since it's the same type of vehicle. This is the DfT under Mike Penning, not some gold plating socialista zombie.
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[Teflon-Mike]

[snikks]

[Beelzebob]

Thanks guys yes it seems so obvious now... you'd only need it for the first full test.

Should engage brain before operating fingers, I suppose
____________________
'09 YBR 125 -> '92 XJ600 S Diversion -> '99 Hornet 600

"Stronger than your average female lifeguard"

[JonWal]

Hi guys i'm 28 years young. The missus has bought me Theory and put me in for my CBT with a local training school.

As long as I pass my full A test DAS before 2014 when they expire, will they both be valid to pass the new directive tests of 2013?

It's getting very confusing and I don't want to have to sit both again as it's unlikely I'll get money available this year now..

[Rogerborg]

You'll (almost certainly) be fine. Direct access to a full A license post 2013 will be the same as now: CBT to validate your provisional entitlement; theory test; practical test(s) (we're probably going back to a single test at the end of 2012).

The only difference is that the age for DAS is going up to 24, and the test bike requirements are going up a bit as well, but neither will be a problem for you.

The full "A" license category itself will remain the same either way: any bike, any power.
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[bikertomm]

Shit just got real


https://www.motorcycletraininguk.com/eu_third_directive.html


The part that scares me is 'changes to be introduced Janurary 2012'

Guessing thats wrong..?

Boo.
____________________
07' Honda Hornet now full powaah! My guide on performing an oil change!

[Teflon-Mike]

[bikertomm]

Oh my, cheers for clearing that up Mike.

I think it's fairly clear the quicker you can get the tests out the way the better.
____________________
07' Honda Hornet now full powaah! My guide on performing an oil change!