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Wheels for a ZX6R J1

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Red Devil
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PostPosted: 22:33 - 31 May 2012    Post subject: Wheels for a ZX6R J1 Reply with quote

Anyone know what wheels will fit on this model? Would a set from the G model fit for example? Looking to get a spare pair for some race slicks and want to keep an eye out on the bay for a bargain!
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MaybeGuy
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PostPosted: 22:55 - 31 May 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

F and G will fit J, and AFAIK, A1P also fit.
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Philly46
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PostPosted: 22:59 - 31 May 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yup, you'll be fine as long as you use your original wheel spacers.
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Red Devil
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PostPosted: 23:01 - 31 May 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Exactly what I was looking for mate, thanks. Karma Thumbs Up

Would there be any benefit to fitting a newer models wheels? Were the discs or anything else better or exactly the same?
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G
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PostPosted: 23:24 - 31 May 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

mattsprattuk wrote:
F and G will fit J, and AFAIK, A1P also fit.

No idea about fit - but F took a 160 width tyre, so probably best to avoid this. Think the G and J are both 5.5".
This page may be of use: https://www.kawiforums.com/zzr600-zx-6r-old-school/158694-master-parts-swap-list-ver2-0-98-zx6r.html - lots of good detail.
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T0MMY
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PostPosted: 23:25 - 31 May 2012    Post subject: Re: Wheels for a ZX6R J1 Reply with quote

Red Devil wrote:
Looking to get a spare pair for some race slicks and want to keep an eye out on the bay for a bargain!


It sounds like you're getting quite keen on the idea of trackdays and if you're thinking about doing quite a few I wouldn't bother to be honest unless you do mega miles on the road inbetween.

I do at least one trackday a month and use 2nd hand Racetecs (£60-£70). I end up changing them every 3 or 4 months anyway as they've gone through too many heat cycles to use on track and they're never illegal in the middle by then from the road miles I do.

What I'm saying is I doubt you'd need road tyres at all as you'll be getting "new" scrubs on there often enough that the road miles won't have time to wear the middle if you see what I mean. If you got them for wets though that would be worthwhile or if you have your heart set on non-road legal slicks.

Obviously that is not relevant if you're not planning on doing a lot of trackdays but if you are you will end up with a shed full of knackered track tyres that are still perfectly usable on the road like I have Laughing
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Philly46
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PostPosted: 23:38 - 31 May 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

G wrote:
mattsprattuk wrote:
F and G will fit J, and AFAIK, A1P also fit.

No idea about fit - but F took a 160 width tyre


Ooops, didn't pay enough attention there. For G J and A you can disregard the F.
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Red Devil
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PostPosted: 12:49 - 01 Jun 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tommy:

I do about 1000 miles a month to work and back on the bike and a bit more going out for ride outs so not really ‘major’ miles but I went through the Pilot Powers I had on the FZ far too quickly for my liking though.

Where do you pick up your Racetecs from, Ebay? Is that what you would recommend for the track and to use on the road in between? I have a decent bit left on the Pilot Powers on the ZX and they will do for a couple of track days or Rockingham then the rest of the month, might swap to the Racetecs after if you recommend them?

To be honest I’ve thought it about it a bit more and thought about your advice and there’s more important things I need to upgrade on the bike first, I want to get a steering damper asap and put braided brake lines on it to get those 6 pots working nicely!

I’ve been looking around for a quick shifter for it but can’t find anything! Do you know if it is possible on this model or if I could adapt a different model quick shift to fit this one?
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T0MMY
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PostPosted: 13:14 - 01 Jun 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Red Devil wrote:
Tommy:

I do about 1000 miles a month to work and back on the bike and a bit more going out for ride outs so not really ‘major’ miles but I went through the Pilot Powers I had on the FZ far too quickly for my liking though.

Where do you pick up your Racetecs from, Ebay? Is that what you would recommend for the track and to use on the road in between? I have a decent bit left on the Pilot Powers on the ZX and they will do for a couple of track days or Rockingham then the rest of the month, might swap to the Racetecs after if you recommend them?

To be honest I’ve thought it about it a bit more and thought about your advice and there’s more important things I need to upgrade on the bike first, I want to get a steering damper asap and put braided brake lines on it to get those 6 pots working nicely!

I’ve been looking around for a quick shifter for it but can’t find anything! Do you know if it is possible on this model or if I could adapt a different model quick shift to fit this one?


I suppose the thing to do is see how you get on with scrubs and if you get through them too quick think about getting another set of wheels. I've used Racetecs and Power Ones and they're excellent on track and on the road. I used them all through winter and although they're probably not as grippy on very cold wet roads as normal road tyres they're perfectly usable imo. I've now got a set of Supercorsas to go on and they're meant to be as good or maybe even better too. I've never used full slicks but I think these kind of road legal track tyres are good enough; most of the guys in the fast group use them with only a few full slicks on show.

I get scrubs from Ebay or from forum members who race. In the sizes you need (180 rear) they're very common.

Not sure about quick shifters, never really seen the need but I did do a DIY fast action throttle which is very useful...practically essential actually. I don't know that you need a steering damper that much either, my G2 doesn't have one and it's not that frisky at all.

Braided lines are probably a good idea...mine came with them on so I don't know what it was like without them but I'm very hard on the brakes and with good pads and decent fluid they're excellent with almost no fade until the pads get thin or the fluid gets old. Might be worth seeing how you go with good pads and fresh fluid before you change to braided lines though as they might be fine without.

I would spend the money you were going to put into the steering damper on the suspension if it's a bit worn. The forks on the G2 are too soft for track (not sure if the J's will be any different). I wind the compression and rebound up to full and they're still too soft really but mine are pretty tired, as is my rear shock.
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G
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PostPosted: 15:10 - 01 Jun 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Also try motoforum for track tyres.

Being England, I'd consider spending my money on a set of wets on wheels if I had transport for them.

Have you done trackdays yet?
I wouldn't be spending too much on tarty bits quite yet personally.
(Though, if you do want a damper, I've got an Ohlins that should fit for sale Smile.)
Often the best outlet for money spent is more track time.

You can fit a quick shifter, but really don't see it being worth it - if you were trying to win races and were near the sharp end already, maybe. Drag racing, definitely. For trackdays? You'll probably get even faster by spending it on tracktime.
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Red Devil
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PostPosted: 15:18 - 01 Jun 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah I think I’m just going to stick to the road race tyres for now I think then, if the guys in the fast group (including you) use them I won’t need any more than that! Might look at supercorsas for my next set, can you let me know how you find yours on the zx?

Is the fast action throttle just shortening the rotation needed for full throttle yeah? How did you do yours? Does that not make it harder to get a smooth roll on or do you get used to it quickly? (I ask lots of questions sorry Laughing)

Yeah I think the braided lines will be the first thing I do…might get it done while it’s off the road and still uninsured for the first day at Rockingham, I haven’t had a chance to use them properly let but the brake feels very spongy so I think it will be worth the money.

For the suspension I was thinking about being cheeky and asking my ex’s Dad to come along to another assessed ride with the advanced motorbikers, the IAM I think it was, (probably the most boring and uneventful hour of my life, at one point I was extremely tempted to do the ‘instructor’ on the back wheel and fuck off just to see the look on his face) because there’s a guy there who will set up your suspension for £15 if you’re a member. Or I might just rock up and blag it Laughing
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Red Devil
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PostPosted: 15:28 - 01 Jun 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

G wrote:
Also try motoforum for track tyres.

Being England, I'd consider spending my money on a set of wets on wheels if I had transport for them.

Have you done trackdays yet?
I wouldn't be spending too much on tarty bits quite yet personally.
(Though, if you do want a damper, I've got an Ohlins that should fit for sale Smile.)
Often the best outlet for money spent is more track time.

You can fit a quick shifter, but really don't see it being worth it - if you were trying to win races and were near the sharp end already, maybe. Drag racing, definitely. For trackdays? You'll probably get even faster by spending it on tracktime.


I think I’ll leave it for next year for the spare wheels unless I see a set I can get for cheap with discs included which I’ll grab but yeah I’ll take yours & Tommy’s advice and run a pair of wets on them and just get some high end road tires for the dry.

I have done track days, just started with my first couple and I’m completely hooked! Got Rockingham soon to be booked for the 17th June, Donnington 5th July, Oulton Park 24th July & then going to line some up for the rest of the year a bit closer to the time!

That’s fair enough comment about the quick shifter, I’m more than happy to spend the money on another track day instead and especially if you think that would be more beneficial for me! Just always wanted to try a quick shifter on one of my bikes and never have…and I like to wheelie…a lot. Very Happy

Can you PM me a price for the steering damper out of interest?
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G
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PostPosted: 15:30 - 01 Jun 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quick action throttle shortens the rotation - shouldn't be any issues with jerkiness on a carbed bike unless you're really cack-handed.
In the past I've bodged them by gluing on cable ties to build up where the cable lies.

Getting suspension setup for road use won't be right for track use.
You can easily set preload up yourself. The rest will depend on how it feels for you on track - and how much suspension travel you're using etc.

Oh and despite being happy in the fast group, the IAM instructor I had assigned to me was definitely faster on the road than me - and he weighed at least twice what I did as well as riding a pan rather than a sports bike.
Does vary by region and the group rides weren't so good however.
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Red Devil
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PostPosted: 15:35 - 01 Jun 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

G wrote:
Also try motoforum for track tyres.

Being England, I'd consider spending my money on a set of wets on wheels if I had transport for them.

Have you done trackdays yet?
I wouldn't be spending too much on tarty bits quite yet personally.
(Though, if you do want a damper, I've got an Ohlins that should fit for sale Smile.)
Often the best outlet for money spent is more track time.

You can fit a quick shifter, but really don't see it being worth it - if you were trying to win races and were near the sharp end already, maybe. Drag racing, definitely. For trackdays? You'll probably get even faster by spending it on tracktime.


I think I’ll leave it for next year for the spare wheels unless I see a set I can get for cheap with discs included which I’ll grab but yeah I’ll take yours & Tommy’s advice and run a pair of wets on them and just get some high end road tires for the dry.

I have done track days, just started with my first couple and I’m completely hooked! Got Rockingham soon to be booked for the 17th June, Donnington 5th July, Oulton Park 24th July & then going to line some up for the rest of the year a bit closer to the time!

That’s fair enough comment about the quick shifter, I’m more than happy to spend the money on another track day instead and especially if you think that would be more beneficial for me! Just always wanted to try a quick shifter on one of my bikes and never have…and I like to wheelie…a lot. Very Happy

Can you PM me a price for the steering damper out of interest?
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Red Devil
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PostPosted: 15:45 - 01 Jun 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

G wrote:
Quick action throttle shortens the rotation - shouldn't be any issues with jerkiness on a carbed bike unless you're really cack-handed.
In the past I've bodged them by gluing on cable ties to build up where the cable lies.

Getting suspension setup for road use won't be right for track use.
You can easily set preload up yourself. The rest will depend on how it feels for you on track - and how much suspension travel you're using etc.

Oh and despite being happy in the fast group, the IAM instructor I had assigned to me was definitely faster on the road than me - and he weighed at least twice what I did as well as riding a pan rather than a sports bike.
Does vary by region and the group rides weren't so good however.


I’m sure I’ll be fine, I’m fairly smooth anyway and it’s one of the things I concentrate on so shouldn’t be a problem. There’s a really good guy I go to where I live (Newbury) who runs his own garage and is an ex racer so I’m sure he will be able to knock me up something for it!

Yeah I appreciate that road suspension set ups would be no good for the track and would get him to do it for the track if I did get it done. I would do it myself but I just don’t fully understand what to adjust and the difference each adjustment will make which is why I would rather get someone to do it until I’m confident I can do it myself or have someone to help me.

Some of them are quick but the guy I had was a right boring bastard, when we were reviewing the ride after he started going on about getting the transitions from NSLs to 30s & 40s nice and sharp so you hit the speed limit as you enter I was thinking in my head ‘this really isn’t for me’. I normally exit 30s & 40s into NSLs on the back wheel Laughing I appreciate the road craft, positioning and the ‘safety bubble’ and take all of that on board and follow it in every day to day riding because I believe you need those skills to be quick and safe at the same time on the road but they do go a bit extreme with it.
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T0MMY
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PostPosted: 15:50 - 01 Jun 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Red Devil wrote:

Is the fast action throttle just shortening the rotation needed for full throttle yeah? How did you do yours? Does that not make it harder to get a smooth roll on or do you get used to it quickly? (I ask lots of questions sorry Laughing)

Yeah I think the braided lines will be the first thing I do…might get it done while it’s off the road and still uninsured for the first day at Rockingham, I haven’t had a chance to use them properly let but the brake feels very spongy so I think it will be worth the money.

For the suspension I was thinking about being cheeky and asking my ex’s Dad to come along to another assessed ride with the advanced motorbikers, the IAM I think it was, (probably the most boring and uneventful hour of my life, at one point I was extremely tempted to do the ‘instructor’ on the back wheel and fuck off just to see the look on his face) because there’s a guy there who will set up your suspension for £15 if you’re a member. Or I might just rock up and blag it Laughing


I tried gluing cable ties but they kept coming off and I wanted it geared quite high (if that's the right word). In the end I got some plastic pipe that fit over and cut and sanded it to my spec. It's massively upgeared from the old throttle but I still got used to it almost instantly so don't worry about that.

Before you change the brake lines I'd just change the brake fluid and make sure the systems well bled. You might not need to spend the money.

Suspension wise, if it's all old standard kit I would just set the sag then fiddle with damping yourself over a few trackdays. I came to the conclusion that maximum compression and rebound at the front worked best and a nearly max on the rear.

I spoke to a suspension guy at Snetterton who wouldn't take my money for a setup as he reckoned that was the best I could do given how soggy it was and that even with new standard forks on these bikes he just went for maximum damping in both directions at the front and then only played with the rear. Not sure if he knew what he was talking about but it feels best like this (though still underdamped).
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Red Devil
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PostPosted: 16:30 - 01 Jun 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are there official quick action throttle bodies you can buy? Or is it just best to knock one up? (I would google it but I’m at work, I have to copy and paste your posts in to an email then write out my reply in case anyone important walks past Laughing)

Is it not an upgrade that is worth doing anyway? I might do the bleed the brakes next week on my time off and see how they feel. I was going to put some braided lines on my FZ because I wasn’t impressed by the brakes at all but never got round to it due to the Renthal bars I would of needed custom length lines, the brakes let me down on Monday night when I was being an attention whore at H café and held a wheelie too long up to the roundabout past everyone, couldn’t get it stopped in time and had to go up and over the roundabout to avoid a possible crash by attempting to chuck it into the roundabout… Laughing

I really need someone to explain to me in person at the track about the damping & sag and help me adjust it so I can feel the difference in the next session (I’m a very hands on learner) and I should be alright after that, might just get a basic track set up done by someone who knows what they are doing then fiddle with it very slightly making note of the original settings, I guess there will be youtube videos on adjusting it?
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Philly46
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PostPosted: 16:55 - 01 Jun 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Red Devil wrote:
Are there official quick action throttle bodies you can buy? Or is it just best to knock one up?


Try Performance Parts Ltd, say you spoke to them at a BSB meet and quoted you £99 for a ZX6R kit. That's what I was told when enquired at Oulton Park.

01788 869100
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Red Devil
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PostPosted: 17:00 - 01 Jun 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Philly46 wrote:
quoted you £99 for a ZX6R kit.


Bodge job it is then…Laughing that’s another track day that sort of money!
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Philly46
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PostPosted: 17:10 - 01 Jun 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's for an Active QAT, contains 3 throttle tubes, throttle cables and the housing. Proper job and good value at that price.
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T0MMY
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PostPosted: 17:25 - 01 Jun 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's not hard to knock up a quick action throttle yourself, I'll post up a pic of mine over the weekend.

Braided lines probably are worth it, the only reason I said to hold off is that I never tried this bike without them so for all I know they're not needed. I think with all these things, do a few trackdays first and see where the weak points are on the bike before upgrading anything.

If I were you I would read up on suspension as much as you can then do the basic setup (just sag really) and go from there. If I see you at Rockingham this month I can give you a hand but I'm far from an expert on this stuff. If your bike is similarly soggy to mine though you can just copy my settings as a starting point. Definitely lots of damping needed on the front though on these bikes.
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Philly46
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PostPosted: 19:32 - 01 Jun 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

T0MMY wrote:
Braided lines probably are worth it, the only reason I said to hold off is that I never tried this bike without them so for all I know they're not needed. I think with all these things, do a few trackdays first and see where the weak points are on the bike before upgrading anything.


Brakes are the weakest part of this era of ZX6R. Keeping the calipers clean and serviced will help a lot. I eventually tired and dumped the whole OEM setup for this...

https://a4.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/538997_10151506111275217_801710216_23680727_994757481_n.jpg

https://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/473361_10151509125725217_801710216_23697466_251218641_o.jpg
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T0MMY
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PostPosted: 12:54 - 02 Jun 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Philly46 wrote:

Brakes are the weakest part of this era of ZX6R. Keeping the calipers clean and serviced will help a lot. I eventually tired and dumped the whole OEM setup for this...


I honestly haven't found that with mine. The only changes are the fluid, the braided lines and good pads and they're good enough to lift the back wheel easily (or lock the front wheel once at Setterton leaving two skidmarks Shocked ). I haven't had any problems with fade either other than when the pads have got wafer thin.

Did you find them too weak or was it that they were fading?
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T0MMY
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PostPosted: 13:26 - 02 Jun 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

@Red Devil

Here's a pic of my throttle mod...

https://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d9/T0mmy200sx/IMG_20120511_191535.jpg

Just got a piece of pvc pipe of the right internal diameter, cut it down to fit, glued it on then did a bit of sanding. That pic is a work in progress, I sanded it down more than that as the cable was going through too steep a turn so it was catching. I think this is a lot better than the cable tie method as I struggled to get it to stay attached and if you want it this much quicker action you'd need at least 3 cable ties on top of each other.

It's a bit fiddly to get it right but not hard to do at all and really useful on track as your wrist will be absolutely knackered without it. Basically free as well as I happen to have shedloads of old bits of pipe hanging round at work. If you have trouble finding some suitable pipe I can bring some along to a trackday at some point.
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Shaane
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PostPosted: 18:09 - 02 Jun 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dude if you waiting until next year Ill have a set of wets on wheels for sale early Feb or late Jan cause I'm buying new trackbike. Its your call, They will have discs sprockets and tyres the full lot ready to just go on. Thumbs Up
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