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Westminster Parking Charge

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TomGT
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PostPosted: 14:58 - 14 Aug 2012    Post subject: Westminster Parking Charge Reply with quote

Decided to venture into London today, rode via the A30 into Westminster than parked in a little bike park in Berkeley Square, didn't know there was a charge or see the sign with instructions to pay before I dissappeared off for a few hours.

Came back to find a little plastic thing stuck to my mirror, with this on it:

14/08/2012
Time of contravention: 10:47
Location: Berkeley Square [E1]
Contravention code: 11g
Contravention description: Parked without payment of the parking charge - motor cycle bay

Just looked it up on their website, they have no images supporting so I'm tempted to appeal. Is it worth doing? What would be my get out? Could always say I tried the automated number but it was sending me in circles etc etc.

I'd really rather not pay £40/£80 if I don't have to Sad
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goto10
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PostPosted: 15:04 - 14 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's your responsibility to check the parking restrictions before leaving your bike so you're unlikely to win it. Check back for images in a day or two (they always take them!) - check on Pepipoo to make sure they've not made a schoolboy error on the ticket (wrong code or somesuch) you can sometimes swerve it on a technicality.
I've been stung twice in the last year by Westminster council, MoFos!
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multijoy
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PostPosted: 15:06 - 14 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's always worth punting it to appeal, as they generally cave before it gets as far as PATAS.

However, WCC have an unofficial policy of canceling the first motorcycle PCN a rider receives, so make an initial representation on the basis that you didn't see the sign. You can always make a formal representation to PATAS on the basis of something or t'other at a later date.
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Joncrete Cungle
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PostPosted: 15:12 - 14 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showforum=30
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TomGT
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PostPosted: 15:25 - 14 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

How visible do you think this is?

I'm gonna appeal anyway, if I appeal with 14 days and they decline I can still pay the reduced rate so worth a punt Wink
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Zen Dog
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PostPosted: 15:42 - 14 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

TomGT wrote:
How visible do you think this is?

I'm gonna appeal anyway, if I appeal with 14 days and they decline I can still pay the reduced rate so worth a punt Wink


I'd call that completely visible to be honest... its a sign with a pic of a motorbike on it, right next to the parking area. What more could they do?

Zen Dog
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Last edited by Zen Dog on 15:43 - 14 Aug 2012; edited 1 time in total
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woo
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PostPosted: 15:42 - 14 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Its not your responsibility to check for parking signs!

Its the legal responsibilty of the council to display legible signs regarding parking and their charges!!

I am currently disputing one of these fines as the council I am disputing with do not clearly have signs that say motorcycles are required to park in the solo motorcycle bays!

Fight it all the way and dont be pussy and pay up without a fight!

SCUM, VERMIN THE LOT OF THEM!!! (Inspired by Siggi aka Hertzer!)
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ajag
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PostPosted: 15:53 - 14 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zen Dog wrote:
TomGT wrote:
How visible do you think this is?

I'm gonna appeal anyway, if I appeal with 14 days and they decline I can still pay the reduced rate so worth a punt Wink


I'd call that completely visible to be honest... its a sign with a pic of a motorbike on it, right next to the parking area. What more could they do?

Zen Dog


I agree, other than putting strobe lights on it and/or a speaker screaming "here is the sign" not sure they could have made it more visible.
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TomGT
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PostPosted: 16:23 - 14 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

feel a bit of a cnut now I realise it would have only cost me £1 for the day Cool
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goto10
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PostPosted: 16:31 - 14 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

TomGT wrote:
How visible do you think this is?

I'm gonna appeal anyway, if I appeal with 14 days and they decline I can still pay the reduced rate so worth a punt Wink


I could be wrong, but IIRC they'll still honour the 14 day reduced fine *after* they've [possibly] dismissed your appeal.
Certainly worth a go if they do indeed let the first one go.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 16:43 - 14 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

TomGT wrote:
feel a bit of a cnut now I realise it would have only cost me £1 for the day Cool

Plus the phone call, and shouting your debit card number out in public, and being a tool of the despotic military industrial complex.
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iooi
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PostPosted: 17:48 - 14 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just whows effictive the "Say No to Westminster parking charges " was.....
When people still don't know you have to pay to park a bike Laughing
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Paivi
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PostPosted: 21:30 - 14 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

woo wrote:
Its not your responsibility to check for parking signs!

Erm, yes it is.

woo wrote:
Its the legal responsibilty of the council to display legible signs regarding parking and their charges!!

I think we already agreed that the sign was plenty visible and legible.
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woo
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PostPosted: 21:52 - 14 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

If a company or council is to charge for a service such as a parking service they legally have to provide clear visual signs of this!

To us its mere common sense to look but the onus is on the company or council to make this this clear!

If it is not made clear then you have grounds for dispute!

The law and common sense do not always go hand in hand!
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Ariel Badger
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PostPosted: 22:01 - 14 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Did you hear the Nightingale?
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entoptika
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PostPosted: 22:13 - 14 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
On 30 September 2008, Westminster City Council committed, in the initial instance, to cancel all PCNs that had been issued to motorcycles while parked in any of the City Councils’ paid for parking motorcycle bays. As a result, an instruction was issued to all Parking Services personnel.


https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/16652/response/43064/attach/html/3/FOI%204212%20Graham.gd.doc.html

also: https://forums.pepipoo.com/lofiversion/index.php/t41675.html
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Paivi
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PostPosted: 22:34 - 14 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ariel Badger wrote:
Did you hear the Nightingale?

Yes, after he saw angels dining at the Ritz.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 10:58 - 15 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

woo wrote:
If a company or council is to charge for a service such as a parking service they legally have to provide clear visual signs of this!

We know! They did! The sign is! Obviously! Clear!
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natefz6
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PostPosted: 13:45 - 15 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

WCC are a bunch of c$nts.

I pay per year for my parking permit and pay the extra to get Text updates for when my permit is due to expire. Out of the three text's that I should have received they did not send two and one arrived at 04:30 the day after the permit expired.

I have had 6 parking tickets from them and gotten off 5 of them, as others say if its your first for a paid M/C parking bay I would have thought they will let you off (they did for me). Its always worth an appeal.
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TomGT
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PostPosted: 00:21 - 26 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

just sent this off to WCC, hopefully I'll keep my £40 in the bank Very Happy

Quote:
Dear Sir or Madam,

on the 14th of August I rode my motorcycle into London for business purposes. On finding a dedicated motorcycle parking area in Berkeley Square, I decided to park there as this seemed the safest place to leave my vehicle. I parked here at around 7am, and on returning to my vehicle at around 11am I was surprised to find a parking ticket attached to my vehicle.

I was taken aback by this as motorcycles are not eligible to pay parking charges anywhere in the UK, I chatted to another nearby motorcyclist who pointed out the parking charges and the sign with a phone number. I thought that if I telephoned the number then and there I would be able to retroactively pay the charge and avoid the penalty. As I do not own a mobile telephone, I walked to the nearest red phone box, which had been disconnect. On discussion with BT it appears that the telephone unit inside was due to be upgraded at the time. I believe that it is unreasonable to expect people to pay a parking fee by telephone as opposed to a conventional meter or ticket machine.

Furthermore I wish to quote a piece of information obtained via a freedom of information request from Westminster City Council:

"Furthermore, we will continue with the following policies:

·We will continue to install security devices at dedicated motorcycle bays where appropriate and practicable.
·We will continue to cancel the first PCN issued to each motorcyclist for non-payment of the charge upon challenge."

I hope that we can positively resolve this matter,

T G

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U_W v2.0
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PostPosted: 00:44 - 26 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

wait? what?

motorcycles are not eligible to pay parcking charges anywhere in the uk?

someone please elaborate on that?
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TomGT
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PostPosted: 01:32 - 26 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Usually_Wrong wrote:
wait? what?

motorcycles are not eligible to pay parcking charges anywhere in the uk?

someone please elaborate on that?


it's all bollocks because I really don't want to pay that £40 Confused
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Im-a-Ridah
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PostPosted: 03:25 - 26 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Usually_Wrong wrote:
wait? what?

motorcycles are not eligible to pay parcking charges anywhere in the uk?

someone please elaborate on that?


I can't think of any places outside London that charge for motorcycle parking.
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iooi
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PostPosted: 09:09 - 26 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Im-a-Ridah wrote:

I can't think of any places outside London that charge for motorcycle parking.


Depends where you park.
Certainly there is a car park by the bus station in Skiption, that clearly states you have to pay to park your bike in the dedicated M/C area.
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Skudd
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PostPosted: 10:59 - 26 Aug 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote

Plead stupidity, say you are new to that there Big London town city. Say you didn't see the sign but on returning you saw it, but it was too late, agree that they have a hard thankless job, but if they could be so kind just this once to let you off you would be eternally greatfull.

If they say no.............................. Call them every name under the sun and throw a traffic warden over a hedge.
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