Just bloody wrong?

[NickD]

Is it just me, or is it very, very wrong?

The new Citroen ad makes a big thing about the fact that the car is equipped with sensors that alert you to the fact that you are straddling the white lines by sounding an alarm in the car.

It just strikes me as a step too far, something else for the driver to rely on, rather than paying attention, taking some responsibility, and exercising some skill and judgement.

If you can't avoid straddling the white lines you don't need a beeper, you need to GET OFF THE FUGGIN' ROAD.
____________________
I was only doing what it said on my licence officer....
Tear along the dotted line!

[McJamweasel]

I'm not sure. I suppose it could casue problem sif the driver does start to rely on it too much ad then gets into another car without the beeper, but then it may also promote better driving.

People will indicate more, as it doesn't buzz when the indicators are on and it should stop people drifting without realising. It may well stop accidents where people are falling asleep too, if they drit it buzz's and wakes them up.
____________________
BCF: Be yourself, just don't be an arse.

[instigator]

Good and bad thing, yeah.

Drivers are being given far too many driving aids , which means that they dont rely so much on their own judgement, but on something from a little electronic gadget.

Rear parking sensors, things which tell you how far you aree to the car in front, these things......Its just getting OTT.

[Minky_monkey]

I think they should extend ths technology a bit further. If you drift over the white lines on a motorway, a giant spike comes out of the seat.

They wouldn't do it again!

I do think it creates laziness though, look at those parking sensors. What happens when someone gets in a different car without them, they just reverse into the one behind them! Well the buzzer never went off you see.......

[NickD]

All studies into 'risk compensation' have shown that the 'safer' you make a car for the occupants the more dangerous it is for everyone outside that car. I'm with Minkey's spike idea. Fuck gadgets, people should just learn how to bloody drive.
____________________
I was only doing what it said on my licence officer....
Tear along the dotted line!

[mchaggis]

I've not too many problems with it, so long as it can be turned off if you want to, and so long as it doesn't come on when the indicators are on.

My main issue is that people might be more willing to drive when tired, thinking the beeping will stop them running out of their lane and stopping them from crashing. I think the technology which can tell if the driver is falling asleep is better, it can wake them up and tell them to stop driving.

The problem with creating cars safer for their occupants meaning that other road users are less safe isn't always the car's fault. In the case of the stupid fat 4x4 with the obscenely high bonnets and massive kerb weights it is the fault of the design, and is the fault of the American car designers, if we're blaming it on people.

The problem with making the car super safe for the occupants means that some people will see themselves as somewhat invulerable, think the consequences of crashing are less, which may lead to more rash and less considerate driving.

So, I would agree, if you want to increase road safety, increase driver training and try to get drivers more experienced before letting them out. Electronics help, but won't stop the accidents full stop. A interesting comparison is the effect on accidents of ABS braking.

The rate of accidents has not changed since the widescale introduction of the system, people crash just as much whether their wheels lock or not. The main difference is that as they have cornering ability, the injuries and fatalities tend to be to themselves rather than to other road users. This is because they can steer away from the other vehicle, pedestrian etc, but then they tend to hit other things instead.

[headlamp]

Ultimately any safety aid that is going to save lives and prevent accidents is a good thing. As to whether drivers will rely on them to stop drifting over white lines is, I believe, a different point. One of the side effects of all these safety devices (air bags, seat belts, crumple zones etc.) is that drivers feel more 'secure' in their cars and, consequently may drive more recklessly and disregard for other road users as they feel safe. In other words it is the 'peopleware' rather than the 'hardware' that is the problem.

I like Minky's idea for a spike if they drift. While we're on the subject of devices in cars, how about a one that gives drivers an electric shock if they use their mobile, another one that slaps them in their face if they change lane without looking and one that kicks them in the shins if they cross the white lines at traffic lights when they're red!
____________________
Using a mobile phone while driving a car should be made a capital offence!

[Minky_monkey]

I think those suggestions would be totally acceptable!

[Jebus]

it is proberly not a good idea for other road users that the driver will be listening for bleeps instead of paying attention.

[Retro-Man]

[zx636]

All driving aids are supposed to make it safer on the road. Most I think are put in to make driving easier. I actually believe these things make drivers lazy. I could see someone getting used to the car beeping if they drift, what happens when like most electrical things it packs up for no reason and without warning? could be a disaster.

I could think of one that would be really useful if it worked properly, and thats for a bike. Indicators that cancel. I know there are kits out there but they are iffy at best. It really needs to be mechanical from the steering to work.

I bet everyone on here as left their indicators on at sometime if you are honest. I have even heard of bikers who admit they forget and intend to use their indicators as little as possible.

[tony532]

will this make the idiots drive on the right side of the road when they go round a corner?

[Irezumi aka Reuben]

I dont think you can lay the blame on the designers side.

I think the designers are made to cover up the floors with the governments testing/licencing systems and for those of individual drivers who drive when they shouldnt or cant.

Perhaps drilling it into people that falling asleep at the wheel is dangerous would be better? If you watch TV late (ie 1am) they show adverts about not knocking over road workers and sleep deprevation. But it doesnt reach everyone obviously.

With the Citroen apparently it vibrates, if it was me id be tempted just to drive along the lines anyway
____________________
Pictorgraphicalfantastical

[zx636]

I certainly agree that drivers should not start a journey if they are tired and maybe stop for a while if they have already started. I have to admit I have done the first. Just finishing work after 8 hours in the west end when I get a call telling me my wife and kids have had an accident in Wales where they wer visiting in-laws.

Belive me, heart takes over head and apart from topping up with petrol and a ciggy I rode non stop. Must have broken most "rules of the road". Luckily enough it wasnt to bad a crash, few bruises etc.

No excuse I know just trying to say that even someone like me who I consider to be a good driver / rider sometimes makes mistakes. Even so, I dont think aids for assisting drivers to stay awake should be legal.

[Dom]

Yes! Thank God someone agrees with me!

Imo it's just plain irresponsible to give drivers any more of an excuse to pay less attention to the road than they already do. If you're tired then drive with the windows open and the radio on full blast or something like that. Until cars can actually pay attention to *everything* on their own it is not a good thing that drivers can get in the car thinking "Ah well I'm on the motorway now all I need to do is keep my foot here and check there's not a car going slower in front of me every now and then I'll get where I want to."

[california_rookie]

[Nighteyes]

Does anyone know how the sensors will detect your 'straddling' the white lines? Is it just a case of detecting when your on something white? In that case, I wouldn't want to own one of these fancy citroens when it's just snowed.

What about when you have to go over the white lines to go passed a row of parked cars for example? Would this alarm go off then? Somewhat annoying I would say that.

In theory I suppose it could be helpful with regards to people falling asleep at the wheel on motorways etc. Since I know it's very easy to do and sometimes you don't even realise you need to blast the radio on and get some cold air around until you've already done the 'jolt' awake thing.

But aside from that it would just be a nuisance from what I've read so far. If possible, I'd be tempted to turn it off for usual driving and just switch it on before motorway work.
____________________
My Precioussss!, My Bikes, The Lord & Master, Canis Lupus!
39. Something nice about the person who sent this to you? She's beautiful, funny, and has a huge heart.

[Minky_monkey]

Just to give an indication of how deadly it can be, as a recovery agent we used to work on broken down vehicles on the hard shoulders of motorways, a practice that has long been changed.

I was working on a vehicle a few years back, when I heard a sudden BANG. When I looked up, a 38 tonner had just taken the wing mirror off the transit recovery truck that I had parked at the rear of the vehicle I was working on!

It certainly woke me up that day, I can tell you!

We now have a policy, that if it is quicker to repair, repair it. Otherwise, it it is quicker to tow it off to a place of safety, do that and then have a look!

It's not until you're actually parked up that you realise how dangerous the motorway hard shoulder is. It's not normally the first truck out of a convoy that hits you, but the second or the third as they're invariably travelling too close to see you.

I once went to an AA depot, in the car park was a Transit service van that was shortened by two thirds of it's length. It was hit on the M3 by an artic. Luckily the patrol wasn't killed although he was off work for two years.

[Kickstart]

Hi

Not sure about this idea. Can see it helping a bit, but will probably just increase the number of people who just sit in the middle lane.

Also the police are taught to only indicate when it would be helpful. The purpose of this is to force them to really know what is going on around them (fine in principle, but a bit silly should there happen to be someone there who they have not seen). Strangely this will land up with them being buzzed at with this system.

[yambabe]

I saw this ad for the first time last night, and watched with open-mouthed amazement. In my mind, it's just another device to stop people who should not be on the road doing the sensible thing and staying at home.

Motorways have this device fitted already for car drivers. Go over the white line between you and the hard shoulder, you hit a "rumble strip" which alerts you to the fact that you have drifted. Change lanes and you drive over cats eyes, which have much the same effect.

Yet another "gadget" for the people who believe that driving does not warrant full concentration, attention and alertness. Yet another excuse for poor driving and/or killing someone when it fails to operate and they can then say "I didn't realise".

The only time this will be useful is when we all drive vehicles into which we pre-programme a destination then sit back and wait to be taken there. The people at Citroen have been reading too much science fiction, we're not there yet and most of us (especially the ones who ride) don't want to go there anyway.

This is not a safety development, it's a cop-out.

(Sorry if this is a rant. Two years ago I was taken off the M6 in my Fiesta by a driver who fell asleep at the wheel of his 4x4 in the outside lane, woke up, braked to avoid the slowing car in front, lost it and came across in front of me sideways. No amount of gadgets in his car would have prevented what happened from happening. Him having an extra couple of hours in bed before he set off to drive from Devon to Scotland might have. It's kinda personal.......)
____________________
Sod falling in love, I wanna fall in chocolate.

[McJamweasel]

[JonB]

Only 50MPH?

IMO it would help us because whilst filtering they would have to indicate to stop the bleeper going off, so we could actually see if they are going to pull out in front of you.

Though it is a step too far. Drivers pass their test for a reason, they are good enough to drive on the road without aids, so they shouldn't need them. Though I guess this would only happen in a perfect world.
____________________
Be careful whose advice you buy, but, be patient with those who supply it. Advice is a form of nostalgia, dispensing it is a way of fishing the past from the disposal, wiping it off, painting over the ugly parts and recycling it for more than it?s worth.

[McJamweasel]

It would be more of a hindrance than a help at low speed. Just imagine, driving around town, you go over some zig zag lines *beep*, move out past some cars *beep*, past a bus stop *beep*, around a car park *beep*.

Thats going to do nothing more than make the system worthless and a big irritation to the driver.
____________________
BCF: Be yourself, just don't be an arse.

[stryker]

Oh cool! Now I really can drive to work with my eyes closed.

<me ducks for cover>
____________________
Now what?

[tintin]