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HM Revenue and Excise wants power to exceed speed limits

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T.C
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PostPosted: 14:39 - 28 Nov 2012    Post subject: HM Revenue and Excise wants power to exceed speed limits Reply with quote
HMRC want to be included in the list of approved bodies/people who can exceed speed limits when carrying out covert surveillance operations. Shocked

I hope it does not get approval

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-20511424
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yen_powell
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PostPosted: 15:42 - 28 Nov 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote
From last year we had instructions issued that all new speed limit traffic orders have to have military special forces added to the normal list of exemptions (fire/police/ambulance etc).
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Mr Calendar



Joined: 14 Jun 2004
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PostPosted: 15:55 - 28 Nov 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote
yen_powell wrote:
From last year we had instructions issued that all new speed limit traffic orders have to have military special forces added to the normal list of exemptions (fire/police/ambulance etc).

It's effectively who can use blue lights.

Military added in 2011 and can disregard speed limits and other road signs when safe, so same as police.

Mountain rescue has been on the list for a few years but changed from ambulances to emergency vehicles (Confused Thinking no idea!) in 2010. Mountain rescue ambulances can officially break speed limit, other mountain rescue vehicles can't.

Info on this site (clicky link) might be useful. The list of emergency vehicles is actually quite long.

There's a list and links to legislation at the bottom which should keep some people on here happy with another source to quote Wink

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sickpup
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PostPosted: 16:14 - 28 Nov 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote
map wrote:
Info on this site (clicky link) might be useful. The list of emergency vehicles is actually quite long.

There's a list and links to legislation at the bottom which should keep some people on here happy with another source to quote Wink

Shifty


Well it might keep me happy if it was correct or even an exhaustive list.
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sickpup
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PostPosted: 16:35 - 28 Nov 2012    Post subject: Re: HM Revenue and Excise wants power to exceed speed limits Reply with quote
T.C wrote:
HMRC want to be included in the list of approved bodies/people who can exceed speed limits when carrying out covert surveillance operations. Shocked

I hope it does not get approval

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-20511424


To be fair considering the dire state of Police drivers I have to wonder if they should have permission to exceed the speed limit.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 16:44 - 28 Nov 2012    Post subject: Re: HM Revenue and Excise wants power to exceed speed limits Reply with quote
sickpup wrote:
To be fair considering the dire state of Police drivers I have to wonder if they should have permission to exceed the speed limit.

To be fairer, the coppers that I know who have stacked many, many vehicles claim to have begun the fail from below the speed limit every time.

Wait... I think that may validate your point. Thinking

I'll X-post the title from my dupe: Tax collection now a "life or death" activity

and leave it at that.
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T.C
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PostPosted: 16:52 - 28 Nov 2012    Post subject: Re: HM Revenue and Excise wants power to exceed speed limits Reply with quote
sickpup wrote:


To be fair considering the dire state of Police drivers I have to wonder if they should have permission to exceed the speed limit.


Given that Panda car drivers now only have to do a 30 minutes assessment in order to be authorised rather than the 3 week course that used to be the pre-requisite I am inclined to agree.

The only saving grace is that Traffic crews still have to do the full course, but even then the training is not what it used to be.
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MarJay
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PostPosted: 16:58 - 28 Nov 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote
It won't happen, as the HMRC people involved are all walts that think they are MI5.

I think whitehall know that, so it won't be an issue. They'll still get stopped by police and let the offenders get away even if it is allowed, so I doubt they'll be able to justify it.
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rumppole
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PostPosted: 17:04 - 28 Nov 2012    Post subject: Re: HM Revenue and Excise wants power to exceed speed limits Reply with quote
T.C wrote:
Given that Panda car drivers now only have to do a 30 minutes assessment in order to be authorised rather than the 3 week course that used to be the pre-requisite I am inclined to agree.


Where did you get your info? Its incorrect.

The course is now two weeks rather than three, for all response officers. Half a day for non response drivers, ie. those not allowed to use blue lights and sirens.

I'm pretty sure the standard of driving in general on UK roads has become poorer. Especially on motorways. It would seem that motorway ettiquette, is a thing of the past.
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Mr Calendar



Joined: 14 Jun 2004
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PostPosted: 17:18 - 28 Nov 2012    Post subject: Re: HM Revenue and Excise wants power to exceed speed limits Reply with quote
rumppole wrote:
T.C wrote:
Given that Panda car drivers now only have to do a 30 minutes assessment in order to be authorised rather than the 3 week course that used to be the pre-requisite I am inclined to agree.
...The course is now two weeks rather than three, for all response officers. Half a day for non response drivers...

Perhaps I'm being picky (so nothing new) but it really doesn't matter how long a course is if the assessment part is minimum.

A course could be months or even hours. Yet if the assessment is answer one question it's hardly valid.

IIRC even the normal driving test for us plebs is scheduled for 60 minutes duration.
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T.C
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PostPosted: 17:25 - 28 Nov 2012    Post subject: Re: HM Revenue and Excise wants power to exceed speed limits Reply with quote
rumppole wrote:


Where did you get your info? Its incorrect.

The course is now two weeks rather than three, for all response officers. Half a day for non response drivers, ie. those not allowed to use blue lights and sirens.

I'm pretty sure the standard of driving in general on UK roads has become poorer. Especially on motorways. It would seem that motorway ettiquette, is a thing of the past.


I am referring to my old force and the information comes direct from my old crew mate who is still instructing on the school.

Son of our neighbours has just been authorised to drive marked vehicles (non emergency) as a Special Constable and his assessment only lasted about 10 minutes apparently Rolling Eyes

There will be variations from force to force, but none the less standards of driving within the service are not what they used to be.
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rumppole
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PostPosted: 17:30 - 28 Nov 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote
The course is two weeks. You are assessed throughout this period. You can be removed from the course at any time if deemed unsafe or incapable.

There is a final drive aspect. But unlike the DVLA test where you can be the worlds worst driver but nail it for the 30 mins you are with an examiner that has no prior knowledge of you, or your driving, the final drive is with the assessor you've had for the two week period. One would hope that this removes the unsuitable.

This suitability though, like all things graded by a human being, is subjective. Some examiners would accept driving abilities others would not tollerate.
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rumppole
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PostPosted: 17:33 - 28 Nov 2012    Post subject: Re: HM Revenue and Excise wants power to exceed speed limits Reply with quote
T.C wrote:
I am referring to my old force and the information comes direct from my old crew mate who is still instructing on the school.

Son of our neighbours has just been authorised to drive marked vehicles (non emergency) as a Special Constable and his assessment only lasted about 10 minutes apparently Rolling Eyes

There will be variations from force to force, but none the less standards of driving within the service are not what they used to be.


I don't doubt you TC. I'm sure your friend is telling the truth. But the training given to response drivers is supposed to be governed by Home Office Rules and Regs. I can therefore see major issues and embarrassment for that force should a police vehicle be involved in a serious accident and it becomes known the driver only had 10 mins worth of training.

It beggars belief. Shocked
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mysterious_rider
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PostPosted: 17:45 - 28 Nov 2012    Post subject: Re: HM Revenue and Excise wants power to exceed speed limits Reply with quote
T.C wrote:
HMRC want to be included in the list of approved bodies/people who can exceed speed limits when carrying out covert surveillance operations. Shocked

I hope it does not get approval

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-20511424



Where on earth did you read that, I don't think we read the same article mate, I was reading something along the lines of organ carrying cars and bomb disposal units etc possibly being able to exceed speed limits.
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T.C
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PostPosted: 17:58 - 28 Nov 2012    Post subject: Re: HM Revenue and Excise wants power to exceed speed limits Reply with quote
mysterious_rider wrote:
T.C wrote:
HMRC want to be included in the list of approved bodies/people who can exceed speed limits when carrying out covert surveillance operations. Shocked

I hope it does not get approval

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-20511424



Where on earth did you read that, I don't think we read the same article mate, I was reading something along the lines of organ carrying cars and bomb disposal units etc possibly being able to exceed speed limits.


It is the opening paragraph!
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mysterious_rider
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PostPosted: 17:59 - 28 Nov 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote
How did I miss that Laughing
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Joncrete Cungle
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Joined: 31 Jan 2012
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PostPosted: 17:59 - 28 Nov 2012    Post subject: Re: HM Revenue and Excise wants power to exceed speed limits Reply with quote
mysterious_rider wrote:
T.C wrote:
HMRC want to be included in the list of approved bodies/people who can exceed speed limits when carrying out covert surveillance operations. Shocked

I hope it does not get approval

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-20511424



Where on earth did you read that, I don't think we read the same article mate, I was reading something along the lines of organ carrying cars and bomb disposal units etc possibly being able to exceed speed limits.


In the bit that says

Quote:
HM Revenue and Customs has asked to be on a revised list of emergency services allowed to break the legal speed limit.

HMRC wants the powers for covert surveillance of organised crime.

The request was revealed as the Department for Transport consults on allowing speed limit exemptions to be extended to services beyond the police, fire and ambulance services.
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T.C
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PostPosted: 18:02 - 28 Nov 2012    Post subject: Re: HM Revenue and Excise wants power to exceed speed limits Reply with quote
rumppole wrote:


I don't doubt you TC. I'm sure your friend is telling the truth. But the training given to response drivers is supposed to be governed by Home Office Rules and Regs. I can therefore see major issues and embarrassment for that force should a police vehicle be involved in a serious accident and it becomes known the driver only had 10 mins worth of training.

It beggars belief. Shocked


I should have qualified my comment in that I was referring to Panda drivers not response drivers per se, and yes you are right the training is governed by the Home office, but that being said, it has gone from a 3 week standard course (class 4) for Pandas, then 3 weeks intermediate (class 3) and 4 week advanced to a straight 3 week advanced to get a class 1 or 2 with nothing in between.

I still stand by my original comments that standards of driving have dropped substantially and maybe you are one of the lucky ones who works in a force where standards have been maintained or even increased!
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Mr Calendar



Joined: 14 Jun 2004
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PostPosted: 19:58 - 28 Nov 2012    Post subject: Reply with quote
mysterious_rider wrote:
How did I miss that Laughing

Poor obs Wink Very Happy
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