Creeping closer to yoof driver curfews

[Rogerborg]

It's currently up for discussion, along with minimum "learning periods" (lolwut, measured how?), lessons on motorways (by far the safest roads), zero alcohol limits, three year probation and no tooling around with your Corsa brimming with chavs and slags.

I mention it because I imagine that bikers will be considered as an afterthought, while the bill is on the way to be rubber-stamped.

Be a laugh if it caught newly qualified drivers, but not those tooling around on L plates though.
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[Ollie1995]

Uk's turning into wannabe USA
____________________
XR 125, DT125 LC, Greeves Scottish, RS200, XS400, GPX600r

Theory Passed - 18/7/13 MOD1 Booked - 24/9/13

[arry]

It's not the nightime that causes the accident, it's the attitude of the driver. Applying the curfew does nothing to change the attitude of the driver - they'll just do what they currently do at 2 in the morning at 8 in the evening instead.

[j.silvs]

I understand the zero alcohol for beginner drivers and heck I would even argue for everyone... however I dont drink so I would say that

But what is the night time thing going to do?

Surely they need the experience at first at night time? - what if they are stranded or in a traffic jam on the M25 and it hits the curfew. Do they just get out?, if there is a clause saying they can return home during those times well then we all know what will happen:

Police - ''what are you doing on the roads at this time of the night"
Youth - "Going home"
Police - "OK, carry on"

Surley a restriction of what litre cars and 0-60s cars you could get in your first year or so would be better? or something like that.

[Joncrete Cungle]

The driving curfew sounds like a load of poorly thought out knee jerk sensationalist bull $hit to me. WTF are youngsters at college or uni supposed to do in order to afford eye watering insurance extortion? Work in the evening, nights or weekend.

How do these people get to their bar / glass collecting job, takeaway job, supermarket nightshift job, hotel job or any other shift work outside of the 9 - 5 bubble? Parents drop them off and pick them up? Public transport out in the shires after 8pm, doesn't exist? Their mates giving them a lift looks to be against the law to boot.

A twenty four year old could easily be a graduate with almost 3 years working after uni under their belt. What if they need to be at a meeting for 9am in that there London village and they are based in Cumbria? Or on site for 8am in Dover and they are based in South Yorkshire? Or someone doesn't turn up / is ill and they get called in early or asked to work late?

At twenty four years old one of my friends was a HGV driver, would youngsters starting out in the HGV world be banned from driving from say 11pm to 6am? Or anyone 24 and under who works shifts / night work or even early starts?

By all means take them on the motorway when they are driving at nearly test passing standard / just passed the driving test and out on to country roads at night in the rain. Or extend the new drivers act from 24 months to 36 months. But to prohibit people aged 17 to 24 from the roads from say 11pm / midnight to 5am / 6am is frankly mental.

The numbers of traffic officers in this part of the world has fallen by half over the last 20 years. How the heck do you enforce such legislation? ANPR pinging all the cars that pass during the curfew and cross checking registered keepers DOB? Plod pulling cars over because they can and demanding to see papers? Some sort of Orwellian magic satellite box fitted to all young drivers cars?

[Wafer_Thin_Ham]

The idea is just laughable.

Let's hope the government kick it into the long grass. I hate it when the BRAKE lot start getting all uppity.

Young drivers cause the most crashes because they're inexperienced and full of hormones. It doesn't seem like they've looked into the cause of crashes, rather they've just said young people crash at night, so let's ban them.

I don't see the point of the motorway driving bit. Plenty of dual carriage way A roads that are identical to a motorway bar the hard shoulder and some blue signage.

[Joncrete Cungle]

[Wafer_Thin_Ham]

[Joncrete Cungle]

IF such a mental law ever makes through Parliament one of the unintended consequences will be for the employability of da yoot. Sometimes we start work at 5 or 6 am, other times we finish at 11pm or midnight. If da yoot can't make it here under their own steam for that time in a morning, or get home under their own steam at that time at night then jobs will go to those who can.

[Irn-Bru]

I've been driving almost 5 years and I'd still fall in that category
____________________
KTM 990 SMT & Suzuki DR-Z 400 SM

[Wafer_Thin_Ham]

More yoofs cycling around at night is safer?

TBH it seems pretty unenforceable. If it's ANPR enforced they'll simply drive their parent's cars as a named driver.
____________________
My Flickr

[Tungtvann]

Definitely need motorway lessons! The amount of people who still have no idea how to properly drive on them is ridiculous.

[Wafer_Thin_Ham]

[Tungtvann]

The motorway has a middle lane for morons to sit in all the time.

[Vracktal]

Curfews are a daft idea for reasons already stated. And banning them from carrying passengers is daft too, our roads are already clogged enough, we should be encouraging more carpooling, not less. Driving a car is already disincentivized enough among youths due to the cost of motoring anyway.

Graduated licensing? I'm okay with this. Same for longer tests and motorway tuition. But don't constrain when they can drive.
____________________
2007 BMW R1200R: On road
2009 BMW G650X Challenge: On road
1975 Norton Commando 850: Off road, awaiting recommissioning

[Bucky]

A curfew is the a stupid idea.
Plenty of young people work late or night shifts, I did. How are they suppose to commute to work?
Unless you live in a large city, public transport becomes irregular and erratically timed and often non-existent in the evening/night.

Also banning passengers is madness, we should be promoting car pooling to reduce the number of cars on the road.
When I'd 1st passed my test, atleast once a week we'd pile everyone into a car to go to the cinema.
We were not 'boy-racers' by any stretch on the imagination but if there had been a ban on carrying passengers, we'd each driven ourselves resulting in more fooling around on the roads. Rather than someone just applying the handbrake at a quiet junction when the drivers not looking. etc.

Graduated licensing I'm ok with, seriously who could afford the car insurance for a sporty car then they passed. Those who did have sporty cars (who I knew) modified less powerful ones & didn't tell their insurers.

As for the incoming ban on modifying smaller CC motorbikes (also a stupid idea) surely it would only be fair to do the same with cars.
Surely a ban on mods for the 1st couple of years of riding would be a better solution, this would also impact the 3rd party parts industry less, keeping more people in work.
I passed my DAS in '09, I like tweaking a bike and making it personal. I wouldn't mind downsizing to a smaller cc bike with better MPG. However if the anti-tampering laws come in I wont.
____________________
"You know, they say that, the wheel is the greatest invention ever. But I think it's probably the second wheel, because . . .
Have you ever seen a guy on a unicycle?..."

[Pigeon]

Can we pllleeeeease just shoot anyone under the age of 25, this would solve all our problems.

Without kids hooning it around their local patches, terrorising the inhabitants, we wouldn't have had Joey Dunlop or John McGuinnes or Ian Hutchinson.

That being said, when it's 1am and an RS125 without baffles is screaming past your window. Or somebody is killed because (ego + testosterone) > (ability * luck).

But it's annoying when the rights of everyone are effected by the actions of a relative few. I really detest the state meddling. I wish they were there to provide infrastructure (both physical and process), but that was it. However, there are 60 million people in this country and things change. Maybe interference is required.

I understand the points idea (banned after 6pts for the first 12mths or whatever). Gets people in good habits early, once the behaviour is planted, takes longer to change, in theory.

I thought insurance companies (acting as the free market part) did control it. The prices of a 17yr old on even a modest 1.6 Focus would be prohibitive to the majority.

Guess it's still an issue.

Lessons on Motorways. Remember that L-Drivers get, maybe 25 hours in the car before taking the test. Not sure I want L-Drives weaving all over the M-Way. I realise that they can after passing test, so maybe this fear is without merrit.

Zero alcohol limit. Not sure I buy that either.

Limiting Passengers is much more sensible than curfew, in terms of impacting the many. But then we could see more groups out in multi-vehicle situations, actually increasing the chance of racing.

In the end, people will feck up. Unless you can remove the douche particle that infects a lot of us when were <=24.

[Im-a-Ridah]

Put the limits on them, those people in a category that doesn't include me, and I'm alright jack

[Kickstart]

Hi

One of things given as a reason for restrictions being required is that 20% of accidents involve a driver aged 17 to 24.

Now, given that many accidents will have 2 drivers in them we could say that 10% of drivers involved in accidents are ages 17 to 24. Suspect 10% is pretty close to the proportion of miles done by drivers aged 17 to 24.

Maybe someone with decent stats skills could come up with some more accurate figures, but at present it seems like the figures being used to justify restrictions are an example of how to lie with stats.

All the best

Keith
____________________
Traxpics, track day and racing photographs - Bimota Forum - Bike performance / thrust graphs for choosing gearing

[Rogerborg]

Wotchya.

I believe that the problem for insurers isn't so much Kehvyn stacking his Corsa, but that he tends to 'quadraspazz'[*] Shaynayiah, Duwayaine, Traceeei and Treyhvore when he does it, and they can claim against him as 3rd parties.

Whole life care for the promising cream of hairdressing and catering community colleges don't run cheap.

[*] Official insurance term, ask arry.
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[Derivative]

I've never really understood the whole 'curfew' thing.

I generally feel safest driving at night. There's no-one about. Yes, if you see the odd erratic driving, someone's probably had one too many.

But on the whole, driving at 2-3am is a pretty pleasant experience.

Is there actually any evidence to show that people are in collisions more often at night? I'd have thought that, excluding drink related stuff, there's no traffic about, and therefore hardly any accidents.

[Louise]

What about the oldies My driving test is booked within the next 2 weeks.. Ive had one lesson in the car (7 years riding tho) and my instructor seems to feel im ready - Yet for someone whos 29, im being penalised with a £1500 insurance on a 1.6 car thats 13 years old - Yet I ride a 636 thats capible of doing 60 mph in such n such time. - How about just putting new drivers to a low car, IE 1.1 or 1.2 ect.

[Im-a-Ridah]

[Redoko]

[arry]