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Bad Insurance problem

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Wave2k
G's Stalker



Joined: 06 Apr 2004
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PostPosted: 14:43 - 22 Nov 2004    Post subject: Bad Insurance problem Reply with quote
heres the problem
i used RAMPDALE insurance to insure my rs125 for about £850 tpft
i payed about £290 deposit

i canceled the insurance after 4 months for the cbr400
i lost my deposit and and first they were asking for £780
now there asking for £540 and that i at 17 signed a contract for a loan over the phone or on paper.

this is complete bullshit i think and if this goes through i gotta sell the cbr and get a cheap ped
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Sparks!
Sir Tart-a-lot



Joined: 30 Aug 2003
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PostPosted: 15:06 - 22 Nov 2004    Post subject: Reply with quote
Unfortunately it is not bullshit.

You took out a finance policy which you will have to re-pay, think of it as a loan, if you got a loan from a bank and cancelled your insurance, would you expect not to have to pay the loan off just because you cancelled your insurance?

So basically you have no choice at all but to pay it off!

I know from experience as I lost just over £1000 in the space of 3 weeks after an insurance mess up.

There is a scale of how much money you will receive back when you cancel, i.e firstly you will lose the deposit, that is non-refundable, then say you cancel after 1 month the insurers will pay that amount to the finance company, whatever the finance company have left owing after the insurance company have paid you're refund, is what you will owe the finance company.

Based on the figures you posted, £580 sounds about right unfortunately.
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Last edited by Sparks! on 15:11 - 22 Nov 2004; edited 1 time in total
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yambabe
World Chat Champion



Joined: 12 Jul 2004
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PostPosted: 15:08 - 22 Nov 2004    Post subject: Reply with quote
If he was under 18 when the loan was taken out however, it is not enforceable under English law as he is a minor. If he tells them to sod off there is little they can do about it.

Unless someone stood as guarantor?
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fazed
Korn is my hero!



Joined: 21 Apr 2004
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PostPosted: 15:10 - 22 Nov 2004    Post subject: Reply with quote
If i remember correctly i did say this would be a issue to both of you im sure Confused And yes it is complete rubbish but afaik it's more like a finance deal now rather than insurance so you have to pay the remainder off. Thumbs Down
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Wave2k
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Joined: 06 Apr 2004
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PostPosted: 17:45 - 22 Nov 2004    Post subject: Reply with quote
bye bye cbr4
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Kickstart
The Oracle



Joined: 04 Feb 2002
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PostPosted: 18:19 - 22 Nov 2004    Post subject: Re: Bad Insurance problem Reply with quote
wave2k wrote:
now there asking for £540 and that i at 17 signed a contract for a loan over the phone or on paper.


As BabyYam says you cannot legally have a loan in your own name when you are under 18. Sounds like they have screwed up as they should not have allowed you to insure the RS by installments.

All the best

Keith
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Fortuna
World Chat Champion



Joined: 29 Oct 2004
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PostPosted: 18:39 - 22 Nov 2004    Post subject: Reply with quote
Your under 18, don't pay it.
I cancelled an insurance 2 years ago and I'm being hounded for £50. They can go shove it.
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instigator
Super Spammer



Joined: 19 Oct 2004
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PostPosted: 18:42 - 22 Nov 2004    Post subject: Reply with quote
I'm pretty sure they would have asked for guarantor, I was at age of 17 for my insurance. Wave2k hasn't said if they did have one or not for the insurance.
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Fortuna
World Chat Champion



Joined: 29 Oct 2004
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PostPosted: 21:42 - 22 Nov 2004    Post subject: Reply with quote
instigator wrote:
I'm pretty sure they would have asked for guarantor, I was at age of 17 for my insurance. Wave2k hasn't said if they did have one or not for the insurance.

Exactly what I had to do at that age.
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stinkwheel
Bovine Proctologist



Joined: 12 Jul 2004
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PostPosted: 12:20 - 23 Nov 2004    Post subject: Reply with quote
https://www.adviceguide.org.uk/index/family_parent/family/young_people_money_consumer.htm#Contracts

Quote:
Unenforceable contracts

If you are under 18, you cannot normally make a legally enforceable contract and so cannot be sued for damages under any agreement you have made - but see below. However, if you make an unenforceable contract, you can be ordered by a court to return any property you acquired as a result, if the person with whom you made the contract has suffered a loss.


The other party to an unenforceable contract cannot enforce its provisions against you as a young person but you can still enforce your rights under the contract.


When you reach the age of 18, a contract that you entered into before then is unenforceable unless you confirm that the contract should become binding.


Enforceable contracts

Some contracts made by a young person are legally enforceable. These are contracts for necessaries. The most usual examples of this are food and clothing.


As a person aged under 18 you can be responsible under a contract to provide you with necessary services, for example, legal or medical services. You can also be responsible under contracts for an apprenticeship, employment and training, but only if the contract as a whole is for your benefit.


If you drive a vehicle when you are 17 you must have third party liability insurance, even though you cannot usually enter into a contract until you are 18.


Quote:
Cancelling while payments are still being made

If you have bought goods under a hire purchase or a conditional sale agreement (see under heading Types of credit) and have already made some payments, you can end the agreement by returning the goods. However, you may still have to pay any arrears and an amount of money which, when added to the amount of money paid already, comes to half the total price of the goods, if the agreement is regulated under the Consumer Credit Act (see under heading Regulated credit agreements).

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Kickstart
The Oracle



Joined: 04 Feb 2002
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PostPosted: 12:30 - 23 Nov 2004    Post subject: Reply with quote
Hi

Looks like the most they could legally charge you is a total of £425, minus what you have already paid (£295 + 4 months installments).

The only oddity is how you would return the goods to them when you have used 4 months of the insurance.

All the best

Keith
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stinkwheel
Bovine Proctologist



Joined: 12 Jul 2004
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PostPosted: 12:34 - 23 Nov 2004    Post subject: Reply with quote
Kickstart wrote:


The only oddity is how you would return the goods to them when you have used 4 months of the insurance.


You send them back the policy document/cover note, it is not cancelled until you have done this IIRC.
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I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.
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Sparks!
Sir Tart-a-lot



Joined: 30 Aug 2003
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PostPosted: 12:42 - 23 Nov 2004    Post subject: Reply with quote
Judging by the fact wave hasn't replied, I guess it means he had someone sign guarantor and has no choice but to pay?

Just curious Smile Anything you find out info wise mate, can you let me know too as I'm in the same position, only the sum is twice as much Confused Laughing
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Kickstart
The Oracle



Joined: 04 Feb 2002
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PostPosted: 13:17 - 23 Nov 2004    Post subject: Reply with quote
stinkwheel wrote:
You send them back the policy document/cover note, it is not cancelled until you have done this IIRC.


But that does not do anything about the insurance he has already used.

All the best

Keith
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Sparks!
Sir Tart-a-lot



Joined: 30 Aug 2003
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PostPosted: 13:21 - 23 Nov 2004    Post subject: Reply with quote
Kickstart wrote:
stinkwheel wrote:
You send them back the policy document/cover note, it is not cancelled until you have done this IIRC.


But that does not do anything about the insurance he has already used.

All the best

Keith


But he has already paid for the insurance he has already used and will not get a refund for it, the refund is for the extra insurance he HASNT used, but technically has paid for.

Finance is done by a second company that are nothing exactly to do with the insurance company as such, so when you take out a finance with insurance you are basically getting a loan with a finance company, who pay the insurance for a year in one go. Thus when you cancel the insurance company will refund the money that you havent used based on their scales, if you pay for it yourself in one go then this refunnd will go to YOU but if done on finance then they pay that money to the finance company, the finance company deduct it from your "loan" and whatevers left you still have to pay!

The insurance is legally not cancelled until you return your certificates etc to them.

I hope that makes sense and that I have the right end of the stick Laughing I think that's what you was asking anyway Confused Laughing
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Kickstart
The Oracle



Joined: 04 Feb 2002
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PostPosted: 13:28 - 23 Nov 2004    Post subject: Reply with quote
Yams wrote:
But he has already paid for the insurance he has already used and will not get a refund for it, the refund is for the extra insurance he HASNT used, but technically has paid for.


The point being how that ties in with the rules that Stinky quoted, for someone who is under 18 and therefore not legally able to enter into a credit agreement in their own name.

All the best

Keith
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Ste
Not Work Safe



Joined: 01 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: 13:31 - 23 Nov 2004    Post subject: Reply with quote
stinkwheel wrote:
You send them back the policy document/cover note, it is not cancelled until you have done this IIRC.
I would have thought that your insurance policy is cancelled when they say it is, or agree it is. Thought they ask for the policy documents back so you can't show them to the police without saying the policy has been cancelled. When I've changed what bike I'm covered on and they've asked me to send them to insurance documents back I have just told them I can't as I've shredded it and they've be fine with that so they don't need to have the old policy paperwork back.
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Sparks!
Sir Tart-a-lot



Joined: 30 Aug 2003
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PostPosted: 13:45 - 23 Nov 2004    Post subject: Reply with quote
Kickstart wrote:
Yams wrote:
But he has already paid for the insurance he has already used and will not get a refund for it, the refund is for the extra insurance he HASNT used, but technically has paid for.


The point being how that ties in with the rules that Stinky quoted, for someone who is under 18 and therefore not legally able to enter into a credit agreement in their own name.

All the best

Keith


Ahh sorry mate, I didn't actually read stinkwheels posts Embarassed

Ste, CIA wouldn't cancel my policy till they got the certificate back, as far as I know they usualy require it back but obviously if you tell them you've shredded it, well not much they can do is there Laughing
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Kickstart
The Oracle



Joined: 04 Feb 2002
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PostPosted: 14:22 - 23 Nov 2004    Post subject: Reply with quote
Yams wrote:
Ste, CIA wouldn't cancel my policy till they got the certificate back, as far as I know they usualy require it back but obviously if you tell them you've shredded it, well not much they can do is there Laughing


Send them a load of Hamster droppings, with a note that this is the certificate in its current state.

All the best

Keith
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Wave2k
G's Stalker



Joined: 06 Apr 2004
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PostPosted: 15:04 - 23 Nov 2004    Post subject: Reply with quote
nobody signed anything, the monthly payment came out of my account and at the top of the papers is my name
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Mal
Brolly Dolly



Joined: 31 Aug 2004
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PostPosted: 19:28 - 23 Nov 2004    Post subject: Reply with quote
Here's a question. Is direct debit classed as a credit agreement?

If so, shouldn't a bank not allow a direct debit to be set up on an account where the account holder is under 18?

Mal
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yambabe
World Chat Champion



Joined: 12 Jul 2004
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PostPosted: 21:02 - 23 Nov 2004    Post subject: Reply with quote
No Mal.

Direct debit is a repayment method, not a credit agreement. A direct debit in itself does not constitute a contract under the Consumer Credit Acts.
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Fortuna
World Chat Champion



Joined: 29 Oct 2004
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PostPosted: 21:15 - 23 Nov 2004    Post subject: Reply with quote
babyyam wrote:
No Mal.

Direct debit is a repayment method, not a credit agreement. A direct debit in itself does not constitute a contract under the Consumer Credit Acts.

Yeah it's just the way you pay.
My insurance got canceled after I stopped paying.
It's a loan that pays for your insurance. The loan company canceled my insurance (how I do not know) and wanted the remainder.
When asked if the the insurance company refunded them for the rebate they said yes. So in effect would have been paid twice if I had paid!
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cliff
Doctor Sicknote



Joined: 10 Feb 2004
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PostPosted: 16:36 - 24 Nov 2004    Post subject: Reply with quote
Sorry to hear that wave. But I do have a vaguely related question regarding stinky's post.
Last year (when I was 16) I found that I could go up to £100 overdrawn on my cashcard. Can I go overdrawn and then tell them to stick it becuase I'm under 18? Question
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M1ke
Ped Boi



Joined: 11 Jun 2002
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PostPosted: 23:09 - 25 Nov 2004    Post subject: Reply with quote
Is £100 worth getting a bad credit rating for life? Razz
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