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why no re-production of old model

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kawashima
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PostPosted: 06:32 - 15 Jun 2013    Post subject: why no re-production of old model Reply with quote

This may be car topic but we have revival models like mini-one or new beatles, what if they make exactly same design and parts with original, using present build quality and reliability?
If its hard to make all components with original, at least outer design only.
Safety and environmental issue may make them hard, but they'll sell well if they make old models again.
Will it be difficult re-producing old model with original design but with present quality?
If possible, I want them to re-produce very old US open cars.
https://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b295/kawashima_/usoldcar_zps66e35ffb.jpg
I think it's great if this exactly same design car had new engine, AT, and ABS.
I tried to think about 2 wheel examples, but 2 wheels seems to be more difficult doing this cause all mechanism can be seen from outside.
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andyscooter
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PostPosted: 06:37 - 15 Jun 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

in the case of mini

when bmw bought rover they got the rights to the mini name and design

they wont let anyone have the old mini design as somone would build a new old mini

then bmw would loose most of there sales from the new mini they sell
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kawashima
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PostPosted: 07:08 - 15 Jun 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

andyscooter wrote:
in the case of mini

when bmw bought rover they got the rights to the mini name and design

they wont let anyone have the old mini design as somone would build a new old mini

then bmw would loose most of there sales from the new mini they sell

M&A makes it more difficult Thumbs Down
Mini brand is now under BMW.
M&A is sad.
Most sad one for me is Jaguar. How can a Jaguar brand be under tata?
I hate M&A. It spoils the original brand just because of the hope of doubling the sales by a buyer Thumbs Down
I hate Ford too who sold it to tata. I hate M&A. It should be banned for car and bikes.

I like mini one design. new beatle...no.
https://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b295/kawashima_/beatle_zps9bb2b9ed.jpg
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Teflon-Mike
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PostPosted: 08:05 - 15 Jun 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

There have been numerouse 'Revival' bikes.
Kawasaki Zerphyr
Honda CB 'Seven-Fifty'
Suzuki did a revival Katana
Honda did a revival CG125 'Nostalgia-Model'.
You can buy brand new reproduction Harley Pan-Head motors and frames to make 'replica' old Harleys or customs based on antique harleys without butchering a classic one.
Ditto Triumph Bonaville engines and Norton Featherbed frames to make either Bonaville, 'new' old Bonnies, Bonnie Specials, like the Hyde Harrier, or the classic Triton.
Comment I'm sure I read somehwere a while back, was that there were enough reproduction parts available to build a 'new' Norton Atlas from parts & some-one was offering to do so to any-one prepared to have one bespoke built; Has been possible for the the Manx for a long while, and possibly the AJS... err... the OHC single.. 9R?
We then have the Enfield..... not sure that's really a 'revival' machine... but old bike... evolved, AND meets modern C&U regs by the looks of it.
Oh... new Bonnie....
Kawasaki W65 or whatever it is... licence built BSA 650 I believe originally... they revived that from the original tooling I believe.
What else we got?
Just about everything in the Guzzu brochures!
BMW Boxers? They wanted to kill them off... went OHC and water-cooled heads to meet emmissions due to customer apethy towards the fours!
Suppose it depends rather how boradly you want to interpret the suggestion really; but there has actually been far MORE 'nostalgia' or 'revival' motorcycles than... what have we in the car world?
New Mini; New Beetle; New Fiat 500... and a few super-cars getting classic badges. Oh.. maybe the newer Mustangs, and the 'mew' Shelby variants.
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andyscooter
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PostPosted: 08:33 - 15 Jun 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

i like the new new beetle though

Laughing https://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb129/andyscooters/2012beetle7_zps69a2b040.jpg
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kawashima
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PostPosted: 08:34 - 15 Jun 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Teflon-Mike wrote:
There have been numerouse 'Revival' bikes.
Kawasaki Zerphyr
Honda CB 'Seven-Fifty'
Suzuki did a revival Katana
Honda did a revival CG125 'Nostalgia-Model'.
You can buy brand new reproduction Harley Pan-Head motors and frames to make 'replica' old Harleys or customs based on antique harleys without butchering a classic one.
Ditto Triumph Bonaville engines and Norton Featherbed frames to make either Bonaville, 'new' old Bonnies, Bonnie Specials, like the Hyde Harrier, or the classic Triton.
Comment I'm sure I read somehwere a while back, was that there were enough reproduction parts available to build a 'new' Norton Atlas from parts & some-one was offering to do so to any-one prepared to have one bespoke built; Has been possible for the the Manx for a long while, and possibly the AJS... err... the OHC single.. 9R?
We then have the Enfield..... not sure that's really a 'revival' machine... but old bike... evolved, AND meets modern C&U regs by the looks of it.
Oh... new Bonnie....
Kawasaki W65 or whatever it is... licence built BSA 650 I believe originally... they revived that from the original tooling I believe.
What else we got?
Just about everything in the Guzzu brochures!
BMW Boxers? They wanted to kill them off... went OHC and water-cooled heads to meet emmissions due to customer apethy towards the fours!
Suppose it depends rather how boradly you want to interpret the suggestion really; but there has actually been far MORE 'nostalgia' or 'revival' motorcycles than... what have we in the car world?
New Mini; New Beetle; New Fiat 500... and a few super-cars getting classic badges. Oh.. maybe the newer Mustangs, and the 'mew' Shelby variants.

Thanks for pointing me out there are much more examples in 2 wheels you are great! Indeed Zephyr and CB750 are revival bikes with new technologies. I've forgotten about these.
I think it's great there are still spare parts for old models and which enables one to build a whole 'new' old bike again.
Also revival models in 2wheels looks more original than in 4 wheels.
I really like this idea.
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kawashima
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PostPosted: 08:40 - 15 Jun 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

andyscooter wrote:

I didn't know about this new new beetle Embarassed
This one looks much better than previous comical one.
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Nexus Icon
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PostPosted: 08:47 - 15 Jun 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is it still a Golf in a pretty dress?

At least the new Mini was engineered from the ground up.
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P.
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PostPosted: 08:49 - 15 Jun 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nexus Icon wrote:
Is it still a Golf in a pretty dress?

At least the new Mini was engineered from the ground up.


Probably just some pov spec Polo.

Same with the Civic, I love the 04 shape... the new angled ones are horrible, even inside, they are horrendous Laughing
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keggyhander
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PostPosted: 09:40 - 15 Jun 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd love a mkIII Cortina with modern mechanicals.
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sidewinder
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PostPosted: 10:22 - 15 Jun 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

andyscooter wrote:


Looks like a poor mans Porsche.( Chinese copy) Very HappyThumbs Up
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i.p.phrealy
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PostPosted: 10:32 - 15 Jun 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

keggyhander wrote:
I'd love a mkIII Cortina with modern mechanicals.


I agree! Take a focus, chop the outer skin off and put the cortina over the top.
Mmmm! Smile
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reed
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PostPosted: 10:37 - 15 Jun 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

The MK I Golf has been in production in South Africa up until recently. Very Happy

https://www.motorstown.com/images/volkswagen-citi-golf-01.jpg

https://www.motorstown.com/images/volkswagen-citi-golf-02.jpg
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Nexus Icon
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PostPosted: 10:38 - 15 Jun 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

i.p.phrealy wrote:
keggyhander wrote:
I'd love a mkIII Cortina with modern mechanicals.


I agree! Take a focus, chop the outer skin off and put the cortina over the top.
Mmmm! Smile


Don't forget to turn the engine through 90 degrees, fit a propshaft and diff and send the power to the arse end.
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Lord Percy
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PostPosted: 10:48 - 15 Jun 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's because manufacturers want to profit somehow, so they give the poor people shit-looking cars, then save the James Bond designs for people who are willing to pay for it. It kind of sucks, but that's another end of consumerism where I must hold my hands up and say we really can't complain. If anyone really wants something better, they should go out and do it for themselves. But most of us don't know how, so we have to make do with what they give us, and I understand that, as far as fairness goes.
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Tristan.
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PostPosted: 10:54 - 15 Jun 2013    Post subject: Re: why no re-production of old model Reply with quote

Body design is mostly driven by safety legislation, with aero playing another major part - hence fuel economy/emissions. You still get old designs of little cars made and sold in South America and Central Asia where they haven't adopted the same levels yet

kawashima wrote:
Most sad one for me is Jaguar. How can a Jaguar brand be under tata?


That relationship is much much more hands off than it was between Ford and JLR. Money changes hands but the company essentially gets to do it's own thing. It's a much more British brand than it ever was under Ford.
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stickybackbob
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PostPosted: 10:55 - 15 Jun 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

They still make the old Morris Oxford in India

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=hindustan+ambassador&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=oke8UeTWC4O70QWaoICACw&ved=0CDoQsAQ&biw=1280&bih=709

Iran have recently stopped making the Hillman Hunter Smile

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=iran+hillman+hunter&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=60e8UYeqJ6aK0AWZ2IGwCw&ved=0CDwQsAQ&biw=1280&bih=709

Never stuck pictures up before so apologies for the links Smile
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kawashima
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PostPosted: 12:25 - 15 Jun 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lord Percy wrote:
It's because manufacturers want to profit somehow, so they give the poor people shit-looking cars, then save the James Bond designs for people who are willing to pay for it. It kind of sucks, but that's another end of consumerism where I must hold my hands up and say we really can't complain. If anyone really wants something better, they should go out and do it for themselves. But most of us don't know how, so we have to make do with what they give us, and I understand that, as far as fairness goes.

I understand this. When toyota stopped making rear drive collora including levin and trueno (86), many people requested them to keep FR models even at motor shows, but they ignored and went for FF models. Now most of young people can't afford cars, young guys at 86 generation are now middle age and have money, Toyota remade 86 and BRZ again. They make models once they think they are profitable. It's made by subaru though.

Tristan. wrote:
That relationship is much much more hands off than it was between Ford and JLR. Money changes hands but the company essentially gets to do it's own thing. It's a much more British brand than it ever was under Ford.

I didn't know that. I should welcome it then Thumbs Up

stickybackbob wrote:

Mmm real new old models!
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stevo as b4
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PostPosted: 13:34 - 15 Jun 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

What is the car in the first post? Hudson, Packard, Chevvy?

Whatever it is, go to south America, and you will still see these kinds of old Yank stylish car's in everyday use. They make the parts as they go by hand to fix them and keep them on the road. The good thing about old school Yank iron, is that they were all built very strong and made to last in those days. In fact anything American iron before the late 70's generally with a few exceptions was built to last and mechanically will run for 50years on piss poor fuel etc.

As for new old car's well aint the retro thing over now so we are told?

Unless it's real genuine old school it aint cool anymore. Beetle's Mini's Fiat 500's etc they are pretty uncool now their bubble has burst.

Bringing on to the point of cheap to make but practical small car's the New Mini was never spacious, roomy or practical. It costs 3-series money to service and run, and as a small city car it failed massively. Something uncool but roomy, and boxy but cheap and simple, along with good spec and value like a Hyundai i10 is a far better city car.

In our economic situation and in the Global car market, more people will be interested in value and something that is reliable but economical and practical now, than they ever will about retro has beens like the MINI and Beetle etc.

p.s. I agree with Paddy about the Civic, the worst thing about the FN model is the nasty gaitorless gearshifter. I'm not an OCD'er but have you seen how much dust and dirt and hair that gets stuck in the base of the gear lever? Laughing
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Teflon-Mike
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PostPosted: 15:31 - 15 Jun 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevo as b4 wrote:
I'm not an OCD'er but have you seen how much dust and dirt and hair that gets stuck in the base of the gear lever? Laughing

Gear-Lever?
https://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/NjAwWDgwMA==/z/ksQAAMXQgfZRCo~v/$(KGrHqRHJEsFDzEyteVWBRCo+u5),g~~60_1.JPG?set_id=880000500F
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kawashima
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PostPosted: 17:45 - 15 Jun 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevo as b4 wrote:
What is the car in the first post? Hudson, Packard, Chevvy?

Whatever it is, go to south America, and you will still see these kinds of old Yank stylish car's in everyday use. They make the parts as they go by hand to fix them and keep them on the road. The good thing about old school Yank iron, is that they were all built very strong and made to last in those days. In fact anything American iron before the late 70's generally with a few exceptions was built to last and mechanically will run for 50years on piss poor fuel etc.

As for new old car's well aint the retro thing over now so we are told?

Unless it's real genuine old school it aint cool anymore. Beetle's Mini's Fiat 500's etc they are pretty uncool now their bubble has burst.

Bringing on to the point of cheap to make but practical small car's the New Mini was never spacious, roomy or practical. It costs 3-series money to service and run, and as a small city car it failed massively. Something uncool but roomy, and boxy but cheap and simple, along with good spec and value like a Hyundai i10 is a far better city car.

In our economic situation and in the Global car market, more people will be interested in value and something that is reliable but economical and practical now, than they ever will about retro has beens like the MINI and Beetle etc.

p.s. I agree with Paddy about the Civic, the worst thing about the FN model is the nasty gaitorless gearshifter. I'm not an OCD'er but have you seen how much dust and dirt and hair that gets stuck in the base of the gear lever? Laughing

I think that is 1950's chevrolet bel air sedan.
https://www.newstalgiamotors.com/carsdb/1953-Chevrolet-Bel-Air-4-Door-Sedan
I think it's cool they still make the parts by hand in countries like cuba too. They use them as everyday transport, not as collector's item. It's interesting old US cars are so built strong not like recent ones.
I agree that revival cars are not cheap budget cars anymore.
Tbh when I first saw new beatle on the road, I thought it comical and nice, but when the road is flooded with them I didn't like watching them any more.
I didn't know Hyundai i10. I saw it for the first time on the net. They sold cars from 2001 to 2009 and now buses only here.
Present civic looks like an egg shape. I think if everyone don't stick to mpg figures and prefer pointy designs, they will go back to them again.
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Nick_Giles
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PostPosted: 19:38 - 15 Jun 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

keggyhander wrote:
I'd love a mkIII Cortina with modern mechanicals.


I much preferred the Mk II. My dad had a midnight blue 1600E one. He later had both a Mk III GXL and a 2000E but the 1600E was always everyone's favorite.


Nick
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keggyhander
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PostPosted: 19:51 - 15 Jun 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nick_Giles wrote:
I much preferred the Mk II. My dad had a midnight blue 1600E one. He later had both a Mk III GXL and a 2000E but the 1600E was always everyone's favorite.Nick


The reason I like mkIII's is that they look like a stubby Dodge Challenger.
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cg125erinit
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PostPosted: 19:53 - 15 Jun 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

sidewinder wrote:
andyscooter wrote:


Looks like a poor mans Porsche.( Chinese copy) Very HappyThumbs Up


Thats exactly what I thought! Very Happy
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Nick_Giles
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PostPosted: 21:45 - 15 Jun 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote

keggyhander wrote:


The reason I like mkIII's is that they look like a stubby Dodge Challenger.



Just remembered.!

Lots of people back in the 70's bought Mk III Cortina's. Fitted wheel arches then had them painted red with a white 'Starsky & Hutch' stripe on them. Laughing Laughing Laughing

Very often did the work themselves and made a right dogs danglers of it too. Rolling Eyes


Nick
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